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Israel And The Palestinians

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and so far as Iran is concerned very recently, that they will be driven into the sea.

No. They haven't.

This is one ex Imperial mess that can be laid squarely at the door of the US and UK sadly - to all intents and purposes nothing much has changed since 1948. Two into one doesn't go. :(

This however is spot on I Agree totally with this.

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Ok this is a response to doulikefish but I can't quote your response.

You're correct, Israel survived initially because they proved they wer prepared to fight to the last. Their survival is no longer dependent on that, the Arab countries have developed a new mindset (for whatever reason). Israel has not.

As I said, reasonable measures would be acceptable. Their actions are not reasonable. They also had a chance to renew the ceasefire with Hamas but instead chose to continue the economic blockade that is slowly starving Palestine.

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Ok this is a response to doulikefish but I can't quote your response.

You're correct, Israel survived initially because they proved they wer prepared to fight to the last. Their survival is no longer dependent on that, the Arab countries have developed a new mindset (for whatever reason). Israel has not.

As I said, reasonable measures would be acceptable. Their actions are not reasonable. They also had a chance to renew the ceasefire with Hamas but instead chose to continue the economic blockade that is slowly starving Palestine.

for this ill give you the same response i gave to swampy and one renton gave aswell

israel cannot show any weakness,to do so would encourage there vast enemies

to us there actions are not reasonable but in that area there actions are reasonable

if you ever get the chance to travel through the area the first thing an arabic/persian male will show is how strong he is!!

israel responds with strength because that is what there enemies understand

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Yes. They have.

From 2005 onwards my corn puff challenged pal. ;)

Theres another thread on this, but using that quote alone " criminal and terrorist Zionist regime" is NOT the same as the country itself!

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for this ill give you the same response i gave to swampy and one renton gave aswell

israel cannot show any weakness,to do so would encourage there vast enemies

to us there actions are not reasonable but in that area there actions are reasonable

if you ever get the chance to travel through the area the first thing an arabic/persian male will show is how strong he is!!

israel responds with strength because that is what there enemies understand

I appreciate the mindset that the Israelis are suffering from. As I've said though, their deliberately provocative actions are simply the behaviours that were acceptable in a bygone age. Their actions are no longer required to safeguard their existence regardless of the meaningless rhetoric occassionally thrown their way.

Their enemies may only understand strength but their enemies are not in a position to cause Israels destruction. Whichever way you look at it the ceasefire was not renewed because Israel continues to pursue a policy specifically designed to undermine the democratic process they claim to be in favour of. Not their enemies, Israel.

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I appreciate the mindset that the Israelis are suffering from. As I've said though, their deliberately provocative actions are simply the behaviours that were acceptable in a bygone age. Their actions are no longer required to safeguard their existence regardless of the meaningless rhetoric occassionally thrown their way.

Their enemies may only understand strength but their enemies are not in a position to cause Israels destruction. Whichever way you look at it the ceasefire was not renewed because Israel continues to pursue a policy specifically designed to undermine the democratic process they claim to be in favour of. Not their enemies, Israel.

the ceasefire was not renewed because hamas decided to start firing rockets into israel,what did they expect israel to do??

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the ceasefire was not renewed because hamas decided to start firing rockets into israel,what did they expect israel to do??

Well, no. I was under the impression that the rocket fire resumed after the ceasefire ended.

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Theres another thread on this, but using that quote alone " criminal and terrorist Zionist regime" is NOT the same as the country itself!

Yes it is. Iran want the State of Israel to cease to exist. You could argue that this might not be the equivelent of driving the Israeli's into the sea but I don't think that is credible. Iran funds, trains and arms organisations that are explicitly anti-semitic and indiscriminately attack Israeli and Jewish civilians. There are also frequent anti-semitic canards aired on state TV in Iran and the regime has welcomed virulent neo-Nazi's and HOlocaust Deniers (David Duke for example).

Given these facts, I don't think the eventuality of the 'criminal and terrorist Zionist regime' disappearing is one that would lend itself to harmonious inter-community relations among those who would then constitute the former inhabitents of the state of Israel.

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the ceasefire was not renewed because hamas decided to start firing rockets into israel,what did they expect israel to do??

You do realise access to the Gaza strip is tightly controled by Israel. Air, sea and road - nothing gets in or out without Israel's say so. Food, fuel, the lot. They really are functioning like a ghetto, so is it really any wonder they react like they do?

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Well, no. I was under the impression that the rocket fire resumed after the ceasefire ended.

the ceasefire was up for renewal and hamas started the rocket attacks

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You do realise access to the Gaza strip is tightly controled by Israel. Air, sea and road - nothing gets in or out without Israel's say so. Food, fuel, the lot. They really are functioning like a ghetto, so is it really any wonder they react like they do?

i do,but they had a ceasefire in place and things were happening(not very quickly)but hamas didnt even ask for talks about a new one they just started up again with the rockets

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i do,but they had a ceasefire in place and things were happening(not very quickly)but hamas didnt even ask for talks about a new one they just started up again with the rockets

Yes. The people in the Gaza strip were slowly starving to death.

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Yes. The people in the Gaza strip were slowly starving to death.

i havent heard or seen any reports of mass starvation from the gaza strip

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i havent heard or seen any reports of mass starvation from the gaza strip

Whew, thats alright then!

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Whew, thats alright then!

aye it is and also a group of msps are just back,and made no mention of mass starvation,health care yes mass starvation no

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I'm glad XBL has started a thread on this, good to debate something a little more serious on P&B.

Be careful for what you wish for. I remember how happy some Israelis were when Arafatt died four years ago. In his absence there's been instability and radicals taking power - maybe this is a case of better the devil you know?

I wonder if the Israelies fear Obama in a way,will he be as supportive of them as the Rebublicans.Or will he ratchet up the peace process,maybe even Israel fear that

I wondered that too - this is (to an extent) Israel's last chance to get a "free swipe", before Obama comes in, and whilst Bush is winding down. Sadly, they seem to be getting away with it.

I've hopes for Obama - he seems to have his head screwed on Internationally. Northern Ireland taught us that getting people to sit down and negotiate is a lot easier in the long run (same goes for Cuba etc).

This problem isn't going to go away anytime soon. They will probably still be shooting each other in 100 years time. It's a real hangover from the war, when the Jews were uprooted and dumped in an area where they weren't welcome.

And where do Israel get the money for all this modern weaponry? What industry do they have apart from exporting out-of-season fruit and veg to Tesco?

some one will no doubt say the jewish lobby in the states,but they get most there cash from the diamond trade and jaffa cakes ;)

Will be interesting to see how the Jewish lobby in the States continues to fund them, it's a major source of Israel's money. Didn't know about Jaffa Cakes though...

Two into one doesn't go

You mean the Spice Girls lied to me?

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and i just add this is a discussion that we will probably be having in years to come

Yes :( .

the ceasefire was up for renewal and hamas started the rocket attacks

Because Israel refused to be reasonable.

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Will be interesting to see how the Jewish lobby in the States continues to fund them, it's a major source of Israel's money. Didn't know about Jaffa Cakes though...

israels exports are up 28% this year to europe of its jaffa cakes ;)

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