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honestly united

honestly united

Posted
Posted
45 minutes ago, Detournement said:

Even if you genuinely consider weakening Glasgow and Edinburgh so that a bunch of Scottish (and Georgian!) jobbers can get cricket scores put on them by Leinster and the Stormers as a good idea there is still the problem of paying for a training facility and finding a venue to play the games. 

Look at last night. Darcy Rae nowhere near it in the scrum, Harley a busted flush at lock, Peter Horne and Huw Jones kidding on they are a 10 and 15. Two wingers in their 30s. Brandon Thomson on the bench. Pierroto, Ioane, Lokotui and Tagive brought in from abroad simply to make up numbers. Chris Fusaro still playing 3 years after he would have been let go by Ulster or even Scarlets. 

The problem is the polar opposite of requiring a third pro team. The glaring problem is not having enough players for two.

I would say you have just highlighted why we need a 3rd development team - how do you bring young players through if they are not getting game time? At the moment the very best come through like Hogg, Russell & Gray in spite of the system, not because of it. Harley & Jones are still in the Scotland squad, Horne was not that long ago.

The SRU are paying out for a stake in and sending players to a US team, a French team and London Scottish and the Super 6 - stop all of that and it would more than pay for another Pro team and then we might actually have the players coming through to fill it.

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Detournement

Detournement

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, honestly united said:

I would say you have just highlighted why we need a 3rd development team - how do you bring young players through if they are not getting game time? At the moment the very best come through like Hogg, Russell & Gray in spite of the system, not because of it. Harley & Jones are still in the Scotland squad, Horne was not that long ago.

The SRU are paying out for a stake in and sending players to a US team, a French team and London Scottish and the Super 6 - stop all of that and it would more than pay for another Pro team and then we might actually have the players coming through to fill it.

The issue is that there are no young players good enough to come in and get game time. Having a third Pro team isn't going to improve the overall standard, youth development is the issue.

 

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honestly united

honestly united

Posted
Posted (edited)
21 hours ago, Detournement said:

The issue is that there are no young players good enough to come in and get game time. Having a third Pro team isn't going to improve the overall standard, youth development is the issue.

 

We consistently beat wales in the u-20's but they somehow manage to get enough players for 4 teams

My take is that, at the moment, unless your going to be a top class player, like Hogg, Gray, Russell, Dobie, your not getting any quality game time at 19/20/21/22 which is when you need it if you want to be a top class player, or even a remotely decent player. Players need exposure to that top level match situation to get the skills we need. At the moment the SRU are paying for all these guys in the Institute of Sport and the majority of these wont get a game for a pro side until they are 24/25 which by then its too late. Which is why we dont have a glut of players that you would call good club pro's, but just not international class - I would class guys like Horne, Grigg, Harley, Swinson who (at their prime) you would want to see in a Glasgow side, but probably not for Scotland - you look back at Glasgow over the last few years and the starting line up was either Scotland squad or international for Fiji / Canada etc or was waiting to be Scotland qualified. If more young players were getting game time we have then have that core of dependable but maybe not world class players.

The institute of sport is also why we dont have that killer instinct to win close games - the players are developed in a little bubble where the isn't that pressure to win games, there is no winning league or cups and the mind set of winning isn't bred into them.

I would see a third Scottish team a lot like Connaught was 5 or 10 years ago - a core of solid seasoned pro's that were not troubling the international team, with a lot of youngsters that as soon as they were in the international side would move on to Leinster or Munster. For me 2 teams is stunting the development of our younger players and the Super 6 was never going to fix that.

Edit to add, on my first point I looked back at some old u20 squads, 2015 for example you now have players like Fagerson, Bradbury, Ritchie who were getting game time years ago and are now Scotland regulars, but you still think of Lewis Carmichael, Lewis Wynne and Robbie Nairn as youngsters when they get a game as they took so much longer to get there first starts

 

2015 Six Nations Under 20 Championship Squad
Forwards

Backs

 

Although Nairn is quite a bit younger being in the 2017 squad. 

2017 is even starker in that M Fagerson and Darcy Graham are already Scotland regulars with Crosbie and McDowall there or there abouts - whereas Bain only made his Glasgow debut this week

2017 Six Nations Under 20 Championship Squad
Forwards

Backs

  • Ruaridh Dawson (Newcastle Academy)
  • Paddy Dewhirst (Ayr)
  • Connor Eastgate (Wasps Academy)
  • Darcy Graham (Hawick)
  • Ali Greig (Bristol University)
  • Josh Henderson (Glasgow Hawks)
  • Cameron Hutchison (Currie)
  • Stafford McDowall (Ayr)
  • Ross McCann (Melrose)
  • Robbie Nairn (Bristol University)
  • Craig Pringle (Stirling County)
  • Charlie Shiel (Currie)
  • Andrew Simmers (Heriot’s)
Edited by honestly united
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Detournement

Detournement

Posted
Posted
21 hours ago, ajwffc said:

Anybody know any fly halfs
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/54813924

Wee Duncy will be fine for this tournament.

Hopefully Finn will be back for the Six Nations but Glasgow's season is done and if Hastings' shoulder did come out twice during the game it could be an issue that won't go away.

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ajwffc

ajwffc

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Detournement said:

Wee Duncy will be fine for this tournament.

Hopefully Finn will be back for the Six Nations but Glasgow's season is done and if Hastings' shoulder did come out twice during the game it could be an issue that won't go away.

I have no problem with Weir starting it is just what happens if we lose him 

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peasy23

peasy23

Posted
Posted
I have no problem with Weir starting it is just what happens if we lose him 

It's going to he Hogg at 10 if Weir has to go off, can't see many other viable options in the squad, and with the bubble requirements it's difficult to add anybody else. (Fwiw, I don't really see Hogg as being all that viable at 10 either)

 

I did have a mad thought that Greig Laidlaw could come in, he's played at 10 a few times in Japan.

 

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Mark Connolly

Mark Connolly

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, peasy23 said:

It's going to he Hogg at 10 if Weir has to go off, can't see many other viable options in the squad, and with the bubble requirements it's difficult to add anybody else. (Fwiw, I don't really see Hogg as being all that viable at 10 either)

 

I did have a mad thought that Greig Laidlaw could come in, he's played at 10 a few times in Japan.

 

James Lang will be at 10 before Hogg, I'd have thought. He plays there regularly for Harlequins.

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honestly united

honestly united

Posted
Posted

vander Valt would have been in the squad if he hadn't gone back to SA for his wedding (i think?) as he is eligible for the 2nd game, but needs to quarantine on his return so scuppers that. It will be Weir starting all 3 games with Lang and Hogg as back and probably wrapping Peter Horne in cotton wool just in case

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ajwffc

ajwffc

Posted
Posted
vander Valt would have been in the squad if he hadn't gone back to SA for his wedding (i think?) as he is eligible for the 2nd game, but needs to quarantine on his return so scuppers that. It will be Weir starting all 3 games with Lang and Hogg as back and probably wrapping Peter Horne in cotton wool just in case
It was his wedding he went back for that was meant to happen in the summer. He is due back on Sunday so his quarantine should end the day after the French game(game 2). So he should be available for the Fiji game and the final.
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ajwffc

ajwffc

Posted
Posted

Round 5 Match Official Appointments

 

Sunday, November 8

Ospreys v Leinster – KO 15:00

  • Liberty Stadium, Swansea
  • Referee: Sam Grove-White (SRU, 10th Championship Appearance)
  • Assistant Referees: Adam Jones and Ben Whitehouse (both WRU)
  • TMO: Tim Hayes (WRU)
  • Live on TG4, Premier Sports 1, eir Sport 1, Super Sport Rugby, , ESPN+ (USA), pro14.tv.

Scarlets v Zebre – KO 17:15

  • Parc y Scarlets, Llanelli
  • Referee: Sean Gallagher (IRFU, 20th Championship Appearance)
  • Assistant Referees: Craig Evans and Gwyn Morris (both WRU)
  • TMO: Wayne Davies (WRU)
  • Live on S4C, Premier Sports 1, eir Sport 1, Super Sport Rugby, DAZN, ESPN+ (USA), pro14.tv.

Monday, November 9

Edinburgh v Cardiff Blues – KO 20:15

  • BT Murrayfield, Edinburgh
  • Referee: Andrew Brace (IRFU, 58th Championship Appearance)
  • Assistant Referees: Hollie Davidson and Ian Kenny (both SRU)
  • TMO: Sam Grove-White (SRU)
  • Live on Premier Sports 2, eir Sport 2, ESPN+ (USA), pro14.tv.

Ulster v Glasgow Warriors – KO 20:15

  • Kingspan Stadium, Belfast
  • Referee: Nigel Owens (WRU, 186th Championship Appearance)
  • Assistant Referees: Frank Murphy and Chris Busby
  • TMO: Joy Neville (IRFU)
  • Live on Premier Sports 1, eir Sport 2, Super Sport Rugby, ESPN+ (USA), pro14.tv.
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GAD

GAD

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Jim McLean's Ghost said:

Glasgow defense is a sieve.

And too many mistakes close to the line.

Yeah, both lines. They don't have the power to match up to the Ulster pack and they are getting steamrolled.

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