The Cricket Thread

[Savage Henry]

England could probably declare now.

[Mark Connolly]

Ireland are shite at Test cricket, eh?

[die hard doonhamer]

20 hours ago, Boo Khaki said:

Nowhere near for me. 

The numbers are huge, but they play far more Tests these days than they once did, and he has always struggled in places where the ball doesn't move in the air. The genuine greats were great in all conditions and on all surfaces and had more than one string to their bow. He also routinely got splattered all over the place in limited overs internationals.

He's had a great career, especially in the context of how ropey the first 5 years or so were, but I don't believe he's the same calibre of bowler as the genuine greats. I'd say that just in the time I've watched Test cricket, Holding, Roberts, Marshall, Lillee, Hadlee, Donald, Wasim, McGrath, and possibly Ambrose and Walsh were better. I'm talking in terms of talent and ability and who I'd throw the ball to under any and all circumstances, not weight of numbers. I'd personally put Anderson in the next rung down, i.e. very good but not genuinely 'all time great', with the likes of Imran, Pollock, Waqar, and so on.

I think the nature of Test cricket has changed a lot over the past 30 years or so, so perhaps it isn't realistic to compare current era players with those whose careers were largely prior to the turn of the millennium. I'm not convinced that bowling and taking wickets is either easier, or more difficult than it used to be, because I think you can make arguments for both cases, but it certainly feels that on top of just playing more cricket, there are more results, shorter games, and numbers are generally higher across the board, so perhaps it's a bit apples and oranges.

I don't think Anderson is the best of all time, I do think he is an all-time great, though, and worthy of his place in the discussion. Longevity is a factor that should be considered as well, and Anderson is probably better in his 40s than he was in his 20s.

I do think the struggled away from home element is overstated. Here is his record by country:

Played In	Mat	O	M	R	W	5w	10w	Best	Avg	S/R	E/R
Australia	21	824.3	217	2313	68	1	0	5/43	34.01	72.75	2.81
England and Wales	101	3640.2	962	10207	429	24	3	7/42	23.79	50.91	2.80
India	13	375.4	102	997	34	0	0	4/40	29.32	66.29	2.65
New Zealand	9	319.2	74	1021	36	1	0	5/73	28.36	53.22	3.20
Pakistan	2	67.0	17	148	8	0	0	4/36	18.50	50.25	2.21
South Africa	10	385.1	75	1177	34	2	0	5/40	34.62	67.97	3.06
Sri Lanka	7	207.4	49	599	18	2	0	6/40	33.28	69.22	2.88
United Arab Emirates	6	216.0	63	452	22	0	0	4/17	20.55	58.91	2.09
West Indies	10	346.3	95	893	36	2	0	6/42	24.81	57.75	2.58
Overall (9)	179	6382.1	1654	17807	685	32	0	7/42	26.00	55.90	2.79

He hasn't done great in Aus, SA and SL, but he has held up in on the subcontinent and in the West Indies. His record in NZ does surprise me a bit, as it feels like he should have done better there given the conditions.

[die hard doonhamer]

Apologies for the double post on the same subject, but splitting his career in 2 makes for interesting analysis.

2003-2013:

Year	Mat	O	M	R	W	5w	10w	Best	Avg	S/R	E/R
2003	8	249.5	58	906	26	2	0	5/73	34.85	57.65	3.63
2004	3	55.1	8	219	7	0	0	4/52	31.29	47.29	3.97
2005	1	34.0	4	149	2	0	0	2/117	74.50	102.00	4.38
2006	3	94.3	20	382	8	0	0	4/40	47.75	70.88	4.04
2007	5	215.0	46	775	19	1	0	5/42	40.79	67.89	3.60
2008	11	408.5	71	1373	46	2	0	7/43	29.85	53.33	3.36
2009	13	440.5	100	1355	40	2	0	5/80	33.88	66.13	3.07
2010	12	463.0	120	1309	57	3	1	6/17	22.96	48.74	2.83
2011	7	296.2	77	870	35	1	0	5/65	24.86	50.80	2.94
2012	14	566.2	141	1416	48	1	0	5/72	29.50	70.79	2.50
2013	14	531.5	125	1655	52	3	1	5/47	31.83	61.37	3.11
Overall	91	3355.4	770	10409	340	15	3	7/42	30.61	59.22	3.10

 

2014-now:

Year	Mat	O	M	R	W	5w	10w	Best	Avg	S/R	E/R
2014	8	330.0	101	886	40	1	0	5/53	22.15	49.50	2.68
2015	11	393.3	114	1042	46	2	0	6/42	22.65	51.33	2.65
2016	12	394.1	103	973	41	3	1	5/16	23.73	57.68	2.47
2017	11	426.0	128	967	55	4	0	7/42	17.58	46.47	2.27
2018	12	391.4	113	968	43	1	0	5/20	22.51	54.65	2.47
2019	5	135.1	35	362	12	1	0	5/46	30.17	67.58	2.68
2020	6	198.0	57	471	23	2	0	5/40	20.48	51.65	2.38
2021	12	399.5	141	848	39	2	0	6/40	21.74	61.51	2.12
2022	9	293.5	76	713	36	1	0	5/60	19.81	48.97	2.43
2023	2	64.2	16	168	10	0	0	4/18	16.80	38.60	2.61
Overall	88	3026.3	884	7398	345	17	3	7/42	21.44	52.63	2.44

 

The second half of his career is just incredible, only 1 year where he averaged more than 24, and he missed most of that summer injured.

[jaggyness]

I'm loathed to agree with Michael Vaughan but he's just hit the nail on the head. This is what happens when your all rounder can't bowl 10+ overs an innings. Your quicks lose intensity and if it isn't working for them/track isn't doing anything you start to suffer

[Mark Connolly]

Good stuff from Ireland, provide a morning's entertainment, then get off in time for the Cup Final

[peasy23]

Jack Leach has a stress fracture and will miss the Ashes, so God only knows who England will pick as a spinner. 

[Fuctifano]

Wonder if I they'll try and get Rashid to play, I'm not sure that's the best idea though (assuming he's not injured, I have no idea) 

[die hard doonhamer]

I’d either find a way to put Dan Lawrence in the batting order and go without a specialist spinner, splitting the spin workload between Root and Lawrence, or put Rehan Ahmed in. 

[Rhys McCabe Hype Train]

Liam Dawson would be my outside pick. Habitual water carrier for England and actually decent red ball form in the Championship.

Found it mental that Sky didn’t show any Blast games yesterday since the Ireland test ended early, albeit the YouTube streams from the counties is actually quite decent. But after all is that not what their “pod” is for? Hitching to the back of a Hilux and going to whatever game took their fancy? Or is it just further sticking of the Blast to the back burner to give The Hundred more publicity?

[Savage Henry]

Moeen Ali has reversed his retirement (I could have sworn he did that a while back), and has been included in the squad.  Ali at 8 strengthens the batting and the team loses nothing from the spin department.  

[PB1994]

19 minutes ago, Savage Henry said:

Moeen Ali has reversed his retirement (I could have sworn he did that a while back), and has been included in the squad.  Ali at 8 strengthens the batting and the team loses nothing from the spin department.  

I think he confirmed his retirement again a few months after Stokes became captain.

[die hard doonhamer]

Wrong call, imo. A 36 year old that hasn’t played red ball cricket in 2 years is not the answer. 

[btb]

7 minutes ago, die hard doonhamer said:

Wrong call, imo. A 36 year old that hasn’t played red ball cricket in 2 years is not the answer. 

I agree but perhaps it's symptomatic of no spinners in the 20-25 age range getting a regular chance to bowl, erm, 20-25 overs in a match.

The future is bite sized matches for TV/gaming industry....

[Moomintroll]

Great catch from Cam Green there.

[peasy23]

A collapse by India this morning sees them only add 70 runs for their last 7 wickets as Australia win the World Test Championship by 209 runs.

[jaggyness]

No real surprises in the England team for the first test. The pace attack looks very samey in terms of pace especially if Stokes can't bowl consistently 

[die hard doonhamer]

England team for the first test:

I think they’ll regret leaving out Mark Wood. 
 

In the County Championship, Surrey are currently 425/3 chasing 501 against Kent. Sibley and Foakes both unbeaten beyond 100, with Jamie Smith having got a ton yesterday. If (or when, as it seems) they get there it will be just 1 short of the highest successful chase in the competition. 

[die hard doonhamer]

Surrey get home with 5 wickets in hand. Dom Sibley with a 415 ball unbeaten 140. Mammoth innings. 

[Savage Henry]

1 hour ago, die hard doonhamer said:

England team for the first test:

I think they’ll regret leaving out Mark Wood. 
 

In the County Championship, Surrey are currently 425/3 chasing 501 against Kent. Sibley and Foakes both unbeaten beyond 100, with Jamie Smith having got a ton yesterday. If (or when, as it seems) they get there it will be just 1 short of the highest successful chase in the competition. 

I think you pick the best XI with the best eleven players.  England has done this.   That batting lineup is as deep as they come, so I fully expect them to be all out for 123 by the middle of the afternoon session.