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So what are your views on the media silence in the last 30 years about Rangers fans' disgusting bigoted, sectarian singing?

The world has moved on in the last 30 years. I wasn't even born 30 years ago. Certain things which were taken as acceptable in the past are no longer that way. Thats why certain songs and add-ons are no longer sung and there is an active effort among Rangers fans to educate and change the small moronic element who still attend. I am not saying it was right then either, but it was more widely accepted, like using the word n*gger, drinking in football grounds and wearing flares. In the last 10 years, especially in the last 3 or 4, the media have condemned all forms of sectarianism (rightly so) as it is now no longer widely accepted as simply 'just the way it is'.

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The world has moved on in the last 30 years. I wasn't even born 30 years ago. Certain things which were taken as acceptable in the past are no longer that way.

When was sectarian and bigoted singing ever acceptable?

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I was at the game and wasn't aware of any booing at the start. I am not suggesting that this didn't happen, it could have been that it was in a section of the ground a fair bit from my own. Where I sit in the Copland Rear, it was pretty noisy at this time and everyone was singing, so personally I didn't hear the booing.

I would doubt however that any booing was because of the singing of Derry's Walls (No Surrender). This is sung every week and I have never heard anyone booing it before. It is more likely that the booing you heard was aimed at something else which was happening in the ground at the time and was perhaps not caught by the TV cameras. Again, I am unsure what this was as I was too busy singing and bouncing about!

The song Derry's Walls and The Sash are NOT sectarian songs and are not banned, so I fail to see why there is constant wailing and knashing of teeth by non-Rangers fans every time they are sung. The Sash has also been proven in a court of law not to be sectarian. Some people just look to be offended and just complain about everything Rangers fans do due to a hatred of Rangers. Some people need to get a life and stop allowing their anti-Rangers agenda get in the way of rational thinking and sensible debate.

There is no place in our football grounds for songs like these or the ones a lot of my fellow mindless supporters sign!

The very fact that you seem to defend this only means you find no reasons why you should not keep signing it, this my friend is wrong

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Yes and it has been commented on...1 guy within 50,000. After a great performance like that...and a great game you honestly want to discuss what 1 stupid wee guy did at half time. No praise for the way Rangers fought back...no praise for Hutton,Ferguson,Thomson or McGregor? What happend to the feel good factor?

Thomson-are you sure???!!

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Guest rawburt_rfc

Half you'se **** are simply jealous tht rangers won a game and the rest are jealous cause were playing in these games so say what ya want while i say GET IT UP YE!

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When was sectarian and bigoted singing ever acceptable?

Apologies if I didn't get my point across as clearly as I would have wished. I didn't mean that it was ever acceptable, merely that 30 years ago it was widely regarded as 'just the way it is'. The add-ons and FTP songs etc were never acceptable, but society then didn't frown apon it in the way it does now. As I said, the world has moved on.

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but society then didn't frown apon it in the way it does now. As I said, the world has moved on.

But that's my point. The media were so in thrall to Rangers that they would never bring the subject up.

I have been around for 30+ years, and in certain sections of Scottish society these songs have been abhorred and reviled. The religious make up of the Scottish Establishment has changed a lot in that time, which is partly why it is now taken far more seriously.

It is a pity that there were never journalists brave enough to make a stand against Rangers' sectarian signign policy and fans' behaviour 30 years ago. We might be in a more enlightened state now.

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It seems to be an easy target these days that folk attack the "concept" behind songs heard at Ibrox. Christ, if you overanalyse ANYTHING you can find meaning, inferred or otherwise. Some folk think "We Are the People" is biggoted as it professes a "superiority of the Protestant people" who frequent Ibrox. Speculation is as much of a problem as biggotry itself.

I despised listening to the add-on's the fans used to (and in their minority, still do at games, particularly away ties) sing. I also hate hearing songs like Derry's Walls, The Sash and God Save the Queen - why? Not because i find them offensive (even as a Catholic), but because i don't agree with their relevance to football - but then, there's no rule stating that all football songs need to be appropriate, is there? So long as fans avoid offensive songs, where's the serious problem with irrelevant songs?

Folk who sing the crap songs some still echo around the Ibrox terraces ARE an embarrasment - those who try and find corruption in every OTHER song echoing round the terraces are equally as embarassing for different reasons.

BOTH sets of fans, Rangers AND opposition, need to refrain from inputting religion into football, or trying to where none is present.

As for the complete bell-end who was saluting last night, i'm hopeful he will be dealt with appropriately, but i do agree, the main focus last night was Rangers' cracking performance and character to come from behind against a much better team (on paper, not on the night).

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It seems to be an easy target these days that folk attack the "concept" behind songs heard at Ibrox. Christ, if you overanalyse ANYTHING you can find meaning, inferred or otherwise. Some folk think "We Are the People" is biggoted as it professes a "superiority of the Protestant people" who frequent Ibrox. Speculation is as much of a problem as biggotry itself.

I despised listening to the add-on's the fans used to (and in their minority, still do at games, particularly away ties) sing. I also hate hearing songs like Derry's Walls, The Sash and God Save the Queen - why? Not because i find them offensive (even as a Catholic), but because i don't agree with their relevance to football - but then, there's no rule stating that all football songs need to be appropriate, is there? So long as fans avoid offensive songs, where's the serious problem with irrelevant songs?

Folk who sing the crap songs some still echo around the Ibrox terraces ARE an embarrasment - those who try and find corruption in every OTHER song echoing round the terraces are equally as embarassing for different reasons.

BOTH sets of fans, Rangers AND opposition, need to refrain from inputting religion into football, or trying to where none is present.

As for the complete bell-end who was saluting last night, i'm hopeful he will be dealt with appropriately, but i do agree, the main focus last night was Rangers' cracking performance and character to come from behind against a much better team (on paper, not on the night).

Very good post mate

The banger should be identified by Rangers and his picture put on the big screens saying what a pie he is.

He should not however be banned as quite frankly what he did was harmless and just plain dumb

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But that's my point. The media were so in thrall to Rangers that they would never bring the subject up.

I have been around for 30+ years, and in certain sections of Scottish society these songs have been abhorred and reviled. The religious make up of the Scottish Establishment has changed a lot in that time, which is partly why it is now taken far more seriously.

It is a pity that there were never journalists brave enough to make a stand against Rangers' sectarian signign policy and fans' behaviour 30 years ago. We might be in a more enlightened state now.

The media 30 years ago were probably pro-Rangers, although I can't comment as I wasn't around at the time. I do stand by my conviction now though that there are a large group of journalists and even some whole newspapers who are anti-Rangers and attempt to drag the Club's name through the mud at every possible opportunity. Times have certainly changed and the media representation in this country has come full circle.

I also defend The Sash and Derry's Walls as non-sectarian. Songs which commemorate British history and victories in the same way that Flower of Scotland celebrates Scottish History should not be condemned or banned. I suspect we will just have to agree to disagree on that matter. It is a debate which could go on until we are both long dead and by reading other threads on the subject, has been covered many times on P&B without reaching a conclusion.

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Some folk think "We Are the People" is biggoted as it professes a "superiority of the Protestant people" who frequent Ibrox.

That's because it doess. It isn't bigoted though - I don't know anyone who has suggested that.

As for the complete bell-end who was saluting last night, i'm hopeful he will be dealt with appropriately,

Castration?

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My all time favourite Rangers sectarian song was the classic "its magic you know.... Rangers and Catholics don't go"..... :lol:

Fcuk that's an old one. Didn't they change in the 90's to "it's magic you know....Celtic and trophies don't go"?

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Half you'se **** are simply jealous tht rangers won a game and the rest are jealous cause were playing in these games so say what ya want while i say GET IT UP YE!

rawburtrfc in missing the point shocker :rolleyes:

Pedant alert: Tony, maybe you should rephrase the bit in your post which says "my fellow mindless supporters" or something like that as you're accidentally putting yourself in with them as far as the sentence looks :lol:;)

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Guest Captain Saintsible
But that's my point. The media were so in thrall to Rangers that they would never bring the subject up.

I remember after a St. Mirren v Rangers game at Love Street in the early 90s the Sunday Mail having a pop at the St. Mirren support about one of the songs that had been sung.... I can't remember what the song was or what it was about. I phoned up the Sunday Mail hotline to ask why the journalist in question (again, I can't remember who it was) was having a pop at the St. Mirren support - but made no mention of the various sectarian songs sung by the Rangers support through the game.

My point made it into the hotline column the next day..... but the comment added below it was something along the lines of "he probably didn't mention it because he was singing along with them"............

That kinda summed up the attitude of the media to the issue of sectarian songs being sung by Rangers fans.......

Things have changed a bit now - but that was only 15 years ago.

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It is a pity that there were never journalists brave enough to make a stand against Rangers' sectarian signign policy and fans' behaviour 30 years ago. We might be in a more enlightened state now.

The media have been forced into condemnation, just like the club itself. Last night, I was driving and listening to a bit of the game on Radio Scotland and the commentator was gushing about how marvellous the Rangers support was in getting behind the team. He said this while they were belting out ‘Derry’s Walls’ ffs.

Archie is the worst for that may I add.

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The media have been forced into condemnation, just like the club itself. Last night, I was driving and listening to a bit of the game on Radio Scotland and the commentator was gushing about how marvellous the Rangers support was in getting behind the team. He said this while they were belting out ‘Derry’s Walls’ ffs.

Archie is the worst for that may I add.

There's really nothing wrong with Derry's Walls... agree with the message or disagree, it's not a hateful, sectarian song.

I personally think going to Ibrox to "celebrate heritage" is stupid and largely odious, but there's really not anything wrong with that particular song.

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Some folk think "We Are the People" is biggoted as it professes a "superiority of the Protestant people" who frequent Ibrox.

That's certainly the best explanation that I've heard. Strangely whenever you ask a Person about it they tend to clam up a bit.

I wonder why?

The media 30 years ago were probably pro-Rangers, although I can't comment as I wasn't around at the time. I do stand by my conviction now though that there are a large group of journalists and even some whole newspapers who are anti-Rangers and attempt to drag the Club's name through the mud at every possible opportunity. Times have certainly changed and the media representation in this country has come full circle.

You and the rest of the People certainly give them ample opportunity.

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There's really nothing wrong with Derry's Walls... agree with the message or disagree, it's not a hateful, sectarian song.

I personally think going to Ibrox to "celebrate heritage" is stupid and largely odious, but there's really not anything wrong with that particular song.

Literally, you may have a point but in the context, I think there’s plenty wrong with it. It’s all part of the anti Irish/Catholic attitude. Why else would Scottish fitba fans sing about such an event? You could also say GSTQ isn’t sectarian but it’s pretty obvious the **** love for the idle rich is more to do with the Act of Settlement than anything genuine. Ditto with their over the top adoration for the British state having more to do with it’s rule in the Irish 6 counties.

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