🔵⚪️Saints v Buddies ⚫️⚪️ 25/02/23

[Torfason]

Just now, Merkland Red said:

Don't think you read the Hearts match thread at the time.

I did and I was annoyed but like I say the rule is being applied evenly so on reflection it is what it is.

[The Saintee]

Take the red and move on. Maybe Phillips will learn from it but I suspect not. He's always going to be a 2/3 red card a season player IMO. 

Now that Cal's dynamic duo have been broken up we can look forward to some interesting midfield combinations.

[Wilbur]

This was a game that St Johnstone probably had to win to sustain any chance of a top-six spot. Now they're in no-man's land, likely to be in the bottom-six but safe from relegation. Season over and it's still only February. Ideal time to pump Davidson and bring in a decent manager to build for a better challenge next season. 

[PauloPerth]

I thought first 20 minutes or so we were the better side without creating anything. St Mirren then pressed us much higher, getting right onto the first defender Matthews played it out to and we didn’t cope at all. Instead of playing a decent long ball we ended up with half hit clearances under pressure or losing the ball altogether.  I despair of other teams when I see them and, despite getting caught every time with the ball and being under pressure, they still keep trying to force Guardiola light because that’s what they were told to do.

I’m all for us trying to play out from the back where possible, but when it wasn’t on we could have played upto Clark from the keeper and worked off him a few times just to get us up the park.

As a result st mirren were the better side from that point on.

2nd half we mostly defended well and tried to get forward when we could.  Was a bit surprised Callum left us with two strikers at HT as felt sure he’d sacrifice one for a midfielder.  Worked out well enough in the end.

[btb]

38 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

The red cards a weird one.

Real time you can see theres zero intent and its entirely accidental. Slowed down, zoomed in on and paused, it looks completely different and is a stonewall red.

It wont be overturned and is a waste of time/money either way. 

Agreed - zero intent but we've had similar decisions both for & against us since VAR was introduced, I said after the Pittman red card when we played Livi back in December that if this was the new criteria then the beaks would be dishing out a lot of reds.

[FTOF]

12 minutes ago, btb said:

Agreed - zero intent but we've had similar decisions both for & against us since VAR was introduced, I said after the Pittman red card when we played Livi back in December that if this was the new criteria then the beaks would be dishing out a lot of reds.

It was the case well before VAR was introduced.

Captain Joe's sending off v Ross County, when his follow through, after winning the ball, caught Ross Stewart on the knee was deemed a red card.

Think it was the fourth official that spotted it.

 

 

[houston_bud]

7 minutes ago, FTOF said:

It was the case well before VAR was introduced.

Captain Joe's sending off v Ross County, when his follow through, after winning the ball, caught Ross Stewart on the knee was deemed a red card.

Think it was the fourth official that spotted it.

 

 

Nani's red card for Man Utd against Real Madrid was about 10 years ago, when he caught the boy when he was trying to control the ball.

[FTOF]

27 minutes ago, PauloPerth said:

I thought first 20 minutes or so we were the better side without creating anything. St Mirren then pressed us much higher, getting right onto the first defender Matthews played it out to and we didn’t cope at all. Instead of playing a decent long ball we ended up with half hit clearances under pressure or losing the ball altogether.  I despair of other teams when I see them and, despite getting caught every time with the ball and being under pressure, they still keep trying to force Guardiola light because that’s what they were told to do.

I’m all for us trying to play out from the back where possible, but when it wasn’t on we could have played upto Clark from the keeper and worked off him a few times just to get us up the park.

As a result st mirren were the better side from that point on.

2nd half we mostly defended well and tried to get forward when we could.  Was a bit surprised Callum left us with two strikers at HT as felt sure he’d sacrifice one for a midfielder.  Worked out well enough in the end.

A fair assessment. I thought you defended really well after the sending off.

We prefer teams that try to play out from the back, especially when they're not really good enough to do so. You'd have been better lumping it into the box as you suggested. Look where your goal came from.

Ultimately we just don't score enough. As a result whether we finish top six or not is very finely balanced. Without Ayunga and Greive, I doubt we'll make it. Unless Watt goes on some sort of crazy goal scoring spree.

 

 

[btb]

11 minutes ago, FTOF said:

It was the case well before VAR was introduced.

Captain Joe's sending off v Ross County, when his follow through, after winning the ball, caught Ross Stewart on the knee was deemed a red card.

Think it was the fourth official that spotted it.

3 minutes ago, houston_bud said:

Nani's red card for Man Utd against Real Madrid was about 10 years ago, when he caught the boy when he was trying to control the ball.

 

Agreed, my point was more about the frequency of these situations, we seem to have been having the same debate every other week since the restart in December.

[mizfit]

First 20 I felt we were really good, then St. Mirren got a foothold and it got nervy. 
 

The referee really did not help and weirdly I think his absurd decisions helped spur our players on and waken them up. 
 

Todays hilarity for me though came from the St Mirren fans pavement dancing with the police outside the Tulloch institute though. 

[Theyellowbox]

There is absolutely no chance that is a red card and totally expect it will be appealed and overturned. Phillips has no idea the player is even there and unless he has the unique ability to levitate, he has to put his foot somewhere. If if was my player that was on the ebd of the challenge, of course I'd be shouting for it, but it's just not a red. A yellow possibly at best.

As for the actual game, aside from the opening 20, St Mirren were the better side and we were lucky to get the draw. Main caused us some real issues. Only concern I'd have if I was a St Mirren fan is that the squad looks a bit light. Midfield looked a bit jaded towards the end.

Agree with others that it just isn't going to work with Bair. Willing him to do well, but it's not going to happen. May worked his socks off, but I'm a bit concerned at the centre of defence. Considine's lack of pace was evident and Gordon's poor form continues. 

[PSJ.84]

1 hour ago, The Saintee said:

Take the red and move on. Maybe Phillips will learn from it but I suspect not. He's always going to be a 2/3 red card a season player IMO. 

Now that Cal's dynamic duo have been broken up we can look forward to some interesting midfield combinations.

Not so sure I agree that this red in particular is a slight on Phillips. I think he’s been unlucky with the bounce of the ball and has ended up catching Flynn - no intent but it’s a red - but it’s one of those. I’d actually say since his mini run in the team began, in terms of fouls and bookings, he’s toned things down. 
 

The second part will be interesting, as logically it would probably be Hallberg and MacPherson with Wotherspoon ahead but who the f**k knows what it’ll actually be 

[AW saint]

8 minutes ago, Theyellowbox said:

There is absolutely no chance that is a red card and totally expect it will be appealed and overturned. Phillips has no idea the player is even there and unless he has the unique ability to levitate, he has to put his foot somewhere. If if was my player that was on the ebd of the challenge, of course I'd be shouting for it, but it's just not a red. A yellow possibly at best.

As for the actual game, aside from the opening 20, St Mirren were the better side and we were lucky to get the draw. Main caused us some real issues. Only concern I'd have if I was a St Mirren fan is that the squad looks a bit light. Midfield looked a bit jaded towards the end.

Agree with others that it just isn't going to work with Bair. Willing him to do well, but it's not going to happen. May worked his socks off, but I'm a bit concerned at the centre of defence. Considine's lack of pace was evident and Gordon's poor form continues. 

You have it spot on about our midfield. We are short of numbers to mix it up. We look leggy and players need a rest. We lost 2 midfielders with no replacements. 

[FTOF]

25 minutes ago, Theyellowbox said:

There is absolutely no chance that is a red card and totally expect it will be appealed and overturned. Phillips has no idea the player is even there and unless he has the unique ability to levitate, he has to put his foot somewhere. If if was my player that was on the ebd of the challenge, of course I'd be shouting for it, but it's just not a red. A yellow possibly at best.

As for the actual game, aside from the opening 20, St Mirren were the better side and we were lucky to get the draw. Main caused us some real issues. Only concern I'd have if I was a St Mirren fan is that the squad looks a bit light. Midfield looked a bit jaded towards the end.

Agree with others that it just isn't going to work with Bair. Willing him to do well, but it's not going to happen. May worked his socks off, but I'm a bit concerned at the centre of defence. Considine's lack of pace was evident and Gordon's poor form continues. 

You're going to be sorely disappointed. As clear a red card as you're going see.

Not a chance in hell that it's going to be overturned.

It doesn't matter regarding intent. Rightly or wrongly it's the end result that matters and has for some time even before VAR.

Unfortunately for Phillips the end result was a full studded follow through onto Flynn's ankle.

[Munoz]

29 minutes ago, mizfit said:

First 20 I felt we were really good, then St. Mirren got a foothold and it got nervy. 
 

The referee really did not help and weirdly I think his absurd decisions helped spur our players on and waken them up. 
 

Todays hilarity for me though came from the St Mirren fans pavement dancing with the police outside the Tulloch institute though. 

Thought today's ref was one of the better ones we've has this season. Tried to let the game flow, and wasn't too quick with the yellow cards. Given the speed of the red card challenge, he can be forgiven for only dishing out the yellow. 

[FTOF]

20 minutes ago, AW saint said:

You have it spot on about our midfield. We are short of numbers to mix it up. We look leggy and players need a rest. We lost 2 midfielders with no replacements. 

Hopefully Baccus will be back next week.

It was always going to be the case with Flynn and Kiltie not being regulars.

Unfortunately finance dictated both Reid and Erhahon leaving. If either of them were still with us we'd be in a much stronger position.

[PauloPerth]

1 hour ago, FTOF said:

A fair assessment. I thought you defended really well after the sending off.

We prefer teams that try to play out from the back, especially when they're not really good enough to do so. You'd have been better lumping it into the box as you suggested. Look where your goal came from.

Ultimately we just don't score enough. As a result whether we finish top six or not is very finely balanced. Without Ayunga and Greive, I doubt we'll make it. Unless Watt goes on some sort of crazy goal scoring spree.

 

 

I think st Mirren since they came back up are a decent barometer of where other supporters’ own team are at.

A capable but unspectacular side, usually mid-table well clear of relegation on the periphery of top six; a fairly consistent, 7th or 8th best in the league. 
 

If you’re a good side and playing well you should get the win, but if you’re poor or not on it st mirren will likely beat you.

In light of this, a draw pretty much sums up where we are this season. Likely too good to go down but probably not consistent or good enough for top six.

 

[ZingaliMan]

1 hour ago, Theyellowbox said:

There is absolutely no chance that is a red card and totally expect it will be appealed and overturned. Phillips has no idea the player is even there and unless he has the unique ability to levitate, he has to put his foot somewhere. If if was my player that was on the ebd of the challenge, of course I'd be shouting for it, but it's just not a red. A yellow possibly at best.

As for the actual game, aside from the opening 20, St Mirren were the better side and we were lucky to get the draw. Main caused us some real issues. Only concern I'd have if I was a St Mirren fan is that the squad looks a bit light. Midfield looked a bit jaded towards the end.

Agree with others that it just isn't going to work with Bair. Willing him to do well, but it's not going to happen. May worked his socks off, but I'm a bit concerned at the centre of defence. Considine's lack of pace was evident and Gordon's poor form continues. 

Was it deliberate ? Absolutely not but could he have brok his ankle . ? Yes . It's a strange one will be interesting to see how the SFA deal with it.  For me it was a unfortunate accident.  

[PSJ.84]

41 minutes ago, Munoz said:

Thought today's ref was one of the better ones we've has this season. Tried to let the game flow, and wasn't too quick with the yellow cards. Given the speed of the red card challenge, he can be forgiven for only dishing out the yellow. 

I would’ve agreed that he was quite far but the 10/15 minutes after half time swayed it. Just completely lost the run of himself for a bit. Could’ve forgiven the red card, but from my view, he was a foot away(appreciate I might’ve interpreted that worse than him). 
 

ETA: None of this Old Firm playing against 12 men pish. 

Edited February 25, 2023 by PSJ.84

[Trackdaybob]

3 hours ago, PSJ.84 said:

Amazed that we’re considering appealing that red card

Now I've seen it, it's a red every day of the week. 

2 hours ago, PauloPerth said:

I thought first 20 minutes or so we were the better side without creating anything. St Mirren then pressed us much higher, getting right onto the first defender Matthews played it out to and we didn’t cope at all. Instead of playing a decent long ball we ended up with half hit clearances under pressure or losing the ball altogether.  I despair of other teams when I see them and, despite getting caught every time with the ball and being under pressure, they still keep trying to force Guardiola light because that’s what they were told to do.

I’m all for us trying to play out from the back where possible, but when it wasn’t on we could have played upto Clark from the keeper and worked off him a few times just to get us up the park.

As a result st mirren were the better side from that point on.

2nd half we mostly defended well and tried to get forward when we could.  Was a bit surprised Callum left us with two strikers at HT as felt sure he’d sacrifice one for a midfielder.  Worked out well enough in the end.

Pretty much in agreement with all of that.