🔵⚪️Saints v Buddies ⚫️⚪️ 25/02/23

[Molotov]

54 minutes ago, FTOF said:

 

What has fucked us up, is the clusterfuck of an overspend at Ralston.

 

That’s raises an interesting question. How much is pumped into Ralston and what is the net result?

[FTOF]

30 minutes ago, Molotov said:

That’s raises an interesting question. How much is pumped into Ralston and what is the net result?

To be fair, if the project had been managed properly, then we wouldn't really be mentioning it.

The club is much better of with Ralston than without it IMO.

[Zamora Fan]

Issue is with the rules rather than the decision as such for me, as a couple of others have said. Red cards fundamentally change games in such a way that it feels silly to chuck them out for any contact that endangers a player, even when it isn’t deliberate and is unlucky more than anything. 
 

Surely a yellow would do if the ref deems that a player accidentally caught someone? With reds reserved for nasty, deliberate leg-breaking tackles. With VAR picking up absolutely everything there are way too many red cards given out and too many games ruined, it would benefit every team if there was an agreement to implement the rules in a more lenient way and to use yellow cards as punishment for dangerous but accidental contact. Same thing applies to handballs where too many are given in the box and deciding otherwise even games. 
 

Wouldn’t be against an orange card, 5 min sin-bin system either.

[flyingscot]

2 hours ago, Sh*teAndMuck said:

And of course I understand wishing the player Flynn well, but I’m sure he’s fine since he played on until the 80th minute!

Sportsound assured us he might be out for months after the game....

[Div]

Have to say at the time I thought it was a red because I thought Phillips had stamped down on Flynn but having seen it again several times I don't see any intent or malice in the challenge, just a really poor touch on a bobbly pitch leading to him stretching over the ball and unfortunately catching Flynn in doing so.

It was totally accidental and had it been the other way around I'd have been very disappointed if one of our lot was sent off for that.

Seems like VAR has moved on from penalties now and is just determined to see players sent off.

Was a pretty scrappy game as it always seems to be in Perth. The pitch was absolutely shite which didn't help either team.

[perthsaint1977]

If that was Callum McGregor or Ryan Jack, would a red card have been shown? 

Not a chance. 

As Div says, it's unfortunate what happened but there was no malice, no aggression, just an unfortunate accident. 

Common sense has to apply in these type of incidents 

[tree house tam]

2 hours ago, Zamora Fan said:

Issue is with the rules rather than the decision as such for me, as a couple of others have said. Red cards fundamentally change games in such a way that it feels silly to chuck them out for any contact that endangers a player, even when it isn’t deliberate and is unlucky more than anything. 
 

Surely a yellow would do if the ref deems that a player accidentally caught someone? With reds reserved for nasty, deliberate leg-breaking tackles. With VAR picking up absolutely everything there are way too many red cards given out and too many games ruined, it would benefit every team if there was an agreement to implement the rules in a more lenient way and to use yellow cards as punishment for dangerous but accidental contact. Same thing applies to handballs where too many are given in the box and deciding otherwise even games. 
 

Wouldn’t be against an orange card, 5 min sin-bin system either.

Then the issue would be with consistency. With the refs we currently have in Scotland, they need it in black and white and in the rules. If it's not and left up to them to decide? Well f**k me their decisions are wild. No common sense and most are egotistical wee fannies.

[Shuggie_Murray7]

Regardless of intent, it’s a red card all day long.

I argued earlier in the season that Fraser one against Hearts wasn’t a red, but I feel this one is a far more straight forward decision.

It’s a straight leg, studs up, contact above the ankle. He’s not even in control of the ball at the point of contact, which doesn’t matter but Neil McCann hilariously seemed to think so.

It’s as clear cut a red as you’ll see, despite the fact I agree that there is no intent.

Edited February 26, 2023 by Shuggie_Murray7

[Zamora Fan]

Should we be sending players off when there’s no intent to even tackle let alone cause harm? Not for me.

 

And tbh @tree house tamI’ve never been that arsed about consistency, rather see refs and VARs judge each decision on its own merits. Consistency/ black and white rules is how you end up with every handball being a penalty and loads of red cards. Ruins games

[tree house tam]

2 hours ago, Zamora Fan said:

Should we be sending players off when there’s no intent to even tackle let alone cause harm? Not for me.

 

And tbh @tree house tamI’ve never been that arsed about consistency, rather see refs and VARs judge each decision on its own merits. Consistency/ black and white rules is how you end up with every handball being a penalty and loads of red cards. Ruins games

We'll agree to disagree then. I'd much prefer if everything was either black or white, grey areas are where cheats prosper.

[Molotov]

8 hours ago, FTOF said:

To be fair, if the project had been managed properly, then we wouldn't really be mentioning it.

The club is much better of with Ralston than without it IMO.

I was referring to how much money is “invested” into the academy year after year and whether it is actually profitable.

I believe we have been forced to get rid of key academy staff over the last 12months as a result of the financial difficulties it may take us a while to recover as I’m aware some promising players have also left. 

I like you agree that Ralston it is a good project to have and we need to continue the good work.

The only big star that has successfully come through the Ralston academy since it began is John McGinn.

I don’t think we can really claim Morgan or McLean as true academy graduates given the age they joined us.

Perhaps Ethan can progress where Kyle McAllister and Stevie Mallan faltered after leaving. 

If only we could get a batch of young stars come through on Jim McLean length of contracts.

[Virtual Insanity]

5 hours ago, Shuggie_Murray7 said:

Regardless of intent, it’s a red card all day long.

I argued earlier in the season that Fraser one against Hearts wasn’t a red, but I feel this one is a far more straight forward decision.

It’s a straight leg, studs up, contact above the ankle. He’s not even in control of the ball at the point of contact, which doesn’t matter but Neil McCann hilariously seemed to think so.

It’s as clear cut a red as you’ll see, despite the fact I agree that there is no intent.

Of course its straight leg and studs up, he's standing up. Contact is above the ankle only because Flynn has dived in and missed the ball. 

Its probably reckless although I think there's a case that it's careless more than reckless. There is absolutely no way that he has "far exceeded the necessary force" for the action he was taking, which is trying to plant his foot on the pitch. He doesn't stamp down in any way at all. 

 

[FTOF]

7 minutes ago, Virtual Insanity said:

Of course its straight leg and studs up, he's standing up. Contact is above the ankle only because Flynn has dived in and missed the ball. 

Its probably reckless although I think there's a case that it's careless more than reckless. There is absolutely no way that he has "far exceeded the necessary force" for the action he was taking, which is trying to plant his foot on the pitch. He doesn't stamp down in any way at all. 

 

A visit to specsavers is in order if you think Flynn didn't make contact with the ball.

He quite clearly gets his toe to it before contact is made by Phillip's boot.

Edited February 26, 2023 by FTOF

[Virtual Insanity]

Fine, doesn't really change the substance of the point though does it? 

[FTOF]

9 minutes ago, Virtual Insanity said:

Fine, doesn't really change the substance of the point though does it? 

Why mention it then?

[Bobby_F]

15 hours ago, Virtual Insanity said:

Of course its straight leg and studs up, he's standing up. Contact is above the ankle only because Flynn has dived in and missed the ball. 

Its probably reckless although I think there's a case that it's careless more than reckless. There is absolutely no way that he has "far exceeded the necessary force" for the action he was taking, which is trying to plant his foot on the pitch. He doesn't stamp down in any way at all. 

 

Dermot Gallagher on Ref Watch confirming that the tackle on Flynn was “very very very bad” & thoroughly deserved to be red.

[Radford]

Honestly, so many fans absolutely deserve VAR.

[tree house tam]

32 minutes ago, Radford said:

Honestly, so many fans absolutely deserve VAR.

We ALL deserve VAR and once we get rid of the on pitch referees football will be a better game.

 

As long as they still use the software from a company I may/may not have shares in. When that changes get that shite in the bin.

[SJFCtheTeamForMe]

What could Phillips do differently?

Was completely unavoidable due to how quickly he was closed down and tackled for him to be able to try and land his leg elsewhere. 

There's no common sense ever applied to the rules of the game. He caught him therefore red is about the end of the thought process. Surely football is better than that Simplist thought process?

I watched a bit of the rugby at the weekend where there was 2 red cards and they use their VAR to find any reason not to send him off and actively look for "mitigating" circumstances. Different sport yes but I don't understand why football try to find ways to give red cards so easily and frankly hide behind "well that's the rules of the game". 

Its like football wants to just create unnecessary drama sometimes. 

Penalties are the same. Looking for any opportunity to give a pen for the slightest reason, actively looking for a problem rather than using any common sense. The penalty we got against Hearts a prime example. NO ONE and I mean no one in the stadium seen it happen. He didn't gain any real advantage but VAR watched it in super zoom slow mo and decided it was a penalty. Beyond a nonsense really. 

Edited February 27, 2023 by SJFCtheTeamForMe

[ZingaliMan]

7 minutes ago, SJFCtheTeamForMe said:

What could Phillips do differently?

Was completely unavoidable due to how quickly he was closed down and tackled for him to be able to try and land his leg elsewhere. 

There's no common sense ever applied to the rules of the game. He caught him therefore red is about the end of the thought process. Surely football is better than that Simplist thought process?

I watched a bit of the rugby at the weekend where there was 2 red cards and they use their VAR to find any reason not to send him off and actively look for "mitigating" circumstances. Different sport yes but I don't understand why football try to find ways to give red cards so easily and frankly hide behind "well that's the rules of the game". 

Its like football wants to just create unnecessary drama sometimes. 

Penalties are the same. Looking for amu opportunity to give a pen for the slightest reason, actively looking for a problem rather than using any common sense. 

Dearie me it was not a kick leg was lifted studs right into Flynn's ankle which you can see the bottom of his leg bending with the force . Was it intentional no , was it dangerous play of course. Guaranteed the red card will stand Flynn is lucky he did not suffer a break.