NHS Reform

[SandyCromarty]

A report the other day declared that the tories had been underfunding the NHS for the last ten years.

The reason why is obvious, the tories have always resented the free access the Labour created NHS provides and now all we hear from the UK Health Minister and the tories in general is NHS Reform.

And that means one thing from the scum, and the reason they have been running the Institution into the ground and now shouting it is broken, and that is to bring in privatisation and the profit greed of American type medical companies to take over the NHS and make it only accessible to those that can afford health insurance.

Ruth Davidson eg was always raving about free prescriptions in Scotland and said often that she would remove free prescriptions if she ever took office.

The tories are only out for their business friends to make money so that they can benefit, Mone is a prime example of a tory taking from the taxpayer, the tories are the reason the NHS is in the state it's in, underfunding and Brexit meant thousand of nurses and Doctors returned back to their countries

Reform and privatisation of the NHS must never happen and these money grabbing medical companies must never be allowed to take over even the smallest NHS area. 

Edited December 17, 2022 by SandyCromarty

[welshbairn]

It's not rocket science sorting out the NHS, European countries that do better than us have more hospital beds and staff per head.

[Granny Danger]

17 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

It's not rocket science sorting out the NHS, European countries that do better than us have more hospital beds and staff per head.

And higher state pensions, mostly paid at an earlier retirement age, and a functioning educational system and not everyone is on strike!  It’s almost as if the U.K. is doing something wrong.

 

[Theroadlesstravelled]

I would wager that a huge percentage of Britons still think the NHS is the best in the world.

Deluded.

[tamthebam]

Part of the problem is the short sighted, do nothing, get away with the cheapest option, it's someone else's problem attitude of UK Governments for decades 

Given the "baby boomer" demographic it should have been plain that when that generation got older demand for services like hip replacement operations would significantly rise. And that could have been planned for decades ago. Because it was known about and even talked about decades ago.

[BFTD]

We just can't afford luxuries like socialist healthcare anymore, plus it's so low quality compared to the marvellous service I receive from the private healthcare that my friends and I choose to spend our hard-earned money on. I'm afraid it's time to consider all options, especially the ones that would leave the undeserving poor fruitlessly begging on social media for donations to pay for simple medical treatment that they'll never afford, as it'll give them something to aspire to.

Now excuse me, my awful wife and I have to check our investments in Bupa.

[SandyCromarty]

Over the years, like many, I have travelled all over for work mainly and have experienced private healthcare in the USA, Singapore, France, Iran etc, it is very costly, in France for instance it costs 25 Euros just to visit a Doctor at their practice and prescriptive medications at a pharmacy are grossly expensive.

For reasons I won't expand on we spent months in an ICU in a US west coast hospital over 25 years ago, the experience financially overall came to 7.2 Million US dollars which was met by Workers Comp, this included rehab at a facility and to access that the cost of an ambulance each way was a 1,000 dollars, it's probably three times that now.

During that time in the ICU we witnessed many being admitted with stab and gunshot wounds through drug deals or gang warfare and the majority did not have health insurance, so they got basic life saving surgery but absolutely no rehab or after care and the cost was picked up by the city, one young black chap was admitted with 5 bullets in him and they managed to save him but he was left a cripple. You have to witness cruel decisions like that which is made only for financial reasons to see how health care is run by heartless big business only for profit.

In Iran I attended a hospital with my agent for a minor ailment, the agent accompanied my with a huge wad of cash which soon disappeared as we paid each department I attended.

It's alright having private health care in this country when usually your employer provides it but if all citizens only had access to NHS health care by paying very costly monthly bills, whether you use the system or not, then there would be a hue and cry, and don't forget that the cost of private care is at various levels, from basic monthly payments to the most costly which determines which care you get, paying a basic family fee monthly and then, heaven forbid, you need cancer treatment then it may require you to sell your home to meet the costs, and I'm not scaremongering as that has been a reality for many US citizens

To have access at all levels of the NHS as we do is not a luxury but a basic human right if we care for all of society, if the tories continue to squander our national insurance payments on nuclear weapons or suchlike then so be it but we must defend the NHS in it's present state and not hand it over to greedy american medical insurance companies. 

[Aufc]

44 minutes ago, SandyCromarty said:

Over the years, like many, I have travelled all over for work mainly and have experienced private healthcare in the USA, Singapore, France, Iran etc, it is very costly, in France for instance it costs 25 Euros just to visit a Doctor at their practice and prescriptive medications at a pharmacy are grossly expensive.

For reasons I won't expand on we spent months in an ICU in a US west coast hospital over 25 years ago, the experience financially overall came to 7.2 Million US dollars which was met by Workers Comp, this included rehab at a facility and to access that the cost of an ambulance each way was a 1,000 dollars, it's probably three times that now.

During that time in the ICU we witnessed many being admitted with stab and gunshot wounds through drug deals or gang warfare and the majority did not have health insurance, so they got basic life saving surgery but absolutely no rehab or after care and the cost was picked up by the city, one young black chap was admitted with 5 bullets in him and they managed to save him but he was left a cripple. You have to witness cruel decisions like that which is made only for financial reasons to see how health care is run by heartless big business only for profit.

In Iran I attended a hospital with my agent for a minor ailment, the agent accompanied my with a huge wad of cash which soon disappeared as we paid each department I attended.

It's alright having private health care in this country when usually your employer provides it but if all citizens only had access to NHS health care by paying very costly monthly bills, whether you use the system or not, then there would be a hue and cry, and don't forget that the cost of private care is at various levels, from basic monthly payments to the most costly which determines which care you get, paying a basic family fee monthly and then, heaven forbid, you need cancer treatment then it may require you to sell your home to meet the costs, and I'm not scaremongering as that has been a reality for many US citizens

To have access at all levels of the NHS as we do is not a luxury but a basic human right if we care for all of society, if the tories continue to squander our national insurance payments on nuclear weapons or suchlike then so be it but we must defend the NHS in it's present state and not hand it over to greedy american medical insurance companies. 

Whilst I agree with your sentiment, we also need people to start taking account of their health choices. It’s great that the NHS Is free and it’s incredible, however, we are also partly to blame for the state of it as many people have no interest of being healthy knowing they will get treated for free for any ailments. We need to look at the state of the NHS from a different angle as well as the underfunding one. People need to be held accountable for their poor life choices such as obesity and anything that comes from that. 

[coprolite]

16 minutes ago, Aufc said:

Whilst I agree with your sentiment, we also need people to start taking account of their health choices. It’s great that the NHS Is free and it’s incredible, however, we are also partly to blame for the state of it as many people have no interest of being healthy knowing they will get treated for free for any ailments. We need to look at the state of the NHS from a different angle as well as the underfunding one. People need to be held accountable for their poor life choices such as obesity and anything that comes from that. 

You only have to look at the US to see how much healthcare costs provide a  didincentive to be obese. 

What you want is punishment for something you disapprove of. 

 

[SandyCromarty]

32 minutes ago, Aufc said:

Whilst I agree with your sentiment, we also need people to start taking account of their health choices. It’s great that the NHS Is free and it’s incredible, however, we are also partly to blame for the state of it as many people have no interest of being healthy knowing they will get treated for free for any ailments. We need to look at the state of the NHS from a different angle as well as the underfunding one. People need to be held accountable for their poor life choices such as obesity and anything that comes from that. 

I fully understand your sentiment but there are people who maintain a healthy life style but take part in sports requiring extensive extreme exercise yet end up needing heart bypasses, Souness for example, I don't think that they should be penalised, there are many ways to analyse or criticise life styles, and yes I understand your concern over obesity, drinking, drug taking and smoking, we could go on and on, there are sections of the community who adamant that cosmetic surgery or sex change operations should not be on the NHS, NHS treatment mental illness in a perfectly healthy looking individual may be a concern for some.

The basic monthly cost of health care in New York is 600 USD, if you were in one of the categories mentioned above it would be a lot higher, and that 600 dollars would not cover you for accidents, cancer or operations.

As a caring society free access health care for all is a necessity. 

The NHS is there for all of us

[Aufc]

31 minutes ago, coprolite said:

You only have to look at the US to see how much healthcare costs provide a  didincentive to be obese. 

What you want is punishment for something you disapprove of. 

 

I’m not saying they need to be punished. I am saying at some point these people need to be held accountable for the fact their life choices have consequences. We can’t just simply keep increasing taxes to fund the NHS as it won’t touch the sides

[Aufc]

7 minutes ago, SandyCromarty said:

I fully understand your sentiment but there are people who maintain a healthy life style but take part in sports requiring extensive extreme exercise yet end up needing heart bypasses, Souness for example, I don't think that they should be penalised, there are many ways to analyse or criticise life styles, and yes I understand your concern over obesity, drinking, drug taking and smoking, we could go on and on, there are sections of the community who adamant that cosmetic surgery or sex change operations should not be on the NHS, NHS treatment mental illness in a perfectly healthy looking individual may be a concern for some.

The basic monthly cost of health care in New York is 600 USD, if you were in one of the categories mentioned above it would be a lot higher, and that 600 dollars would not cover you for accidents, cancer or operations.

As a caring society free access health care for all is a necessity. 

The NHS is there for all of us

I don’t class people with drug or alcohol problems in the same category. These people have an addiction and need help. The majority of obese people just need to make simple changes to their lifestyle and be accountable for it. 
 

Being healthy is a necessity. Having free health care because you choose not be healthy is not a necessity 

[BFTD]

I'm all for chucking the fatties on the scrapheap, so long as the proponents do the decent thing and provide us with suicide booths for when our lifestyle choices leave us dying slow, painful deaths.

While we're at it, do we have any other groups that we'd like to deny medical treatment to? Definitely foreigners, obviously. I've heard people refer to extreme sports enthusiasts like skydivers. Maybe limit treatment to a lethal injection at the scene, like with horses.

[Aufc]

7 minutes ago, BFTD said:

I'm all for chucking the fatties on the scrapheap, so long as the proponents do the decent thing and provide us with suicide booths for when our lifestyle choices leave us dying slow, painful deaths.

While we're at it, do we have any other groups that we'd like to deny medical treatment to? Definitely foreigners, obviously. I've heard people refer to extreme sports enthusiasts like skydivers. Maybe limit treatment to a lethal injection at the scene, like with horses.

This is a typical response when anyone dares to question stuff like this. 

They should be offered support to help them lose weight. If they continue down the path of not losing weight and costing the NHS a fortune then they should have some form of financial penalty (how it works I am not sure). I am all about free choice and if people want to be unhealthy then that is their choice. However, the state shouldn’t need to pick up the tab for this (in the majority of cases).

The biggest issue in the UK is that obesity has become so normalised that it’s ingrained. People are afraid of causing offence that we ignore the medical reality.

Edited December 18, 2022 by Aufc

[BFTD]

2 minutes ago, Aufc said:

This is a typical response when anyone dares to question stuff like this. 

They should be offered support to help them lose weight. If they continue down the path of not losing weight and costing the NHS a fortune then they should have some form of financial penalty (how it works I am not sure). I am all about free choice and if people want to be unhealthy then that is their choice. However, the state shouldn’t need to pick up the tab for this (in the majority of cases).

So is that a no to the suicide booths?

You heartless monster.

[DeeTillEhDeh]

One way to raise income and tackle consumption would be to heavily tax unhealthy products.

[Granny Danger]

6 minutes ago, DeeTillEhDeh said:

One way to raise income and tackle consumption would be to heavily tax unhealthy products.

The Daily Express and Daily Heil slapped with a £10 per copy supplement.

[coprolite]

31 minutes ago, Aufc said:

I’m not saying they need to be punished. I am saying at some point these people need to be held accountable for the fact their life choices have consequences. We can’t just simply keep increasing taxes to fund the NHS as it won’t touch the sides

You're right. Massive coronaries  and diabetes are no sort of consequence at all. Fat people are obviously really happy with how they are and just need skinny people to judge them, then they'll be skinny too.

[Granny Danger]

4 minutes ago, coprolite said:

You're right. Massive coronaries  and diabetes are no sort of consequence at all. Fat people are obviously really happy with how they are and just need skinny people to judge them, then they'll be skinny too.

I didn’t die in two world wars just so skinny people could tell me what my BMI should be.

Edited December 18, 2022 by Granny Danger

[BFTD]

8 minutes ago, DeeTillEhDeh said:

One way to raise income and tackle consumption would be to heavily tax unhealthy products.

Ah, but that affects thin people too, so is therefore grossly unfair.

 

That's saved somebody a post, I'm sure.

3 minutes ago, coprolite said:

You're right. Massive coronaries  and diabetes are no sort of consequence at all. Fat people are obviously really happy with how they are and just need skinny people to judge them, then they'll be skinny too.

Aye, but the NHS currently helps to treat that, instead of teaching them a lesson by leaving them to suffer.

To save money, the NHS needs to employ more decisionmakers to ascertain whether heart conditions and diabetes were brought on by being fat, or would have occurred anyway.