Why no InDy?

[DA Baracus]

3 hours ago, Tattie36 said:

Yet again, you’re confusing the SNP/current SG with independence. I would go as far as saying that the majority of independence supporters don’t have a particular desire to see an SNP government for longer than is necessary in an independent Scotland - perhaps 1 or 2 terms before we can have proper left, right and centre options. And, yes, maybe even the rebirth of a proper Labour Party… although they will probably have to change their name as “Labour” or even worse “Scottish Labour” is pretty toxic.

He's doing it on purpose, yet again.

He started out as a reasonable poster, even though I disagreed with much of what he said, but for some reason he's recently decided to start playing a 'character' and is misconstruing things intentionally, probably looking for some sort of reaction.

It's a bit sad really, as he used to have some decent contributions.

[Guest Jedi]

5 hours ago, Tattie36 said:

Yet again, you’re confusing the SNP/current SG with independence. I would go as far as saying that the majority of independence supporters don’t have a particular desire to see an SNP government for longer than is necessary in an independent Scotland - perhaps 1 or 2 terms before we can have proper left, right and centre options. And, yes, maybe even the rebirth of a proper Labour Party… although they will probably have to change their name as “Labour” or even worse “Scottish Labour” is pretty toxic.

Just 'one or two' terms....they would have been in power for 28 years by then!! (that is assuming a successful Ref next year, and a 1 or 2 year period to divide assets).

Help ma boab...28 years (with 10 of those being in charge of an iScotland)...I shudder to think what shape public services would be in by then..what is left of them once they have sold off most of Scotland's assets to foreign capital.

[Benjamin_Nevis]

Splendid. Another thread turned into the Jedi LOOKATME show. I almost preferred Detournement's spamming. At least his tinfoil hat pish was actually funny. 

Edited November 5, 2022 by Day of the Lords

[KingRocketman II]

6 hours ago, Day of the Lords said:

Splendid. Another thread turned into the Jedi LOOKATME show. I almost preferred Detournement's spamming. At his his tinfoil hat pish was actually funny. 

and with him you could always rely on a return to the comfy "aye, but what currency" argument whenever polls favoured indy or an SNPbad "enquiry" petered out once more....

[Detournement]

19 hours ago, Jedi said:

 

Here's a radical notion.....during any campaign in a future Referendum, the Yes side 'might' be asked some questions about EU membership, borders, currency, spending plans and priorities in the early days, the monarchy, the division of assets, moving Trident,.....as I say just a 'wild, radical notion'. Not sure if just replying 'but we will get the government we vote for in an Independent Scotland' in reply to every question will win the day on its own....probably wrong there though.

 

People who are serious about independence are worried about this. They seem very small in number.

However if what independence really means to you is creating a political persona and in group to function as a comfort blanket against how much a shitshow modern society is then it's irrelevant. 

[Detournement]

18 hours ago, Jedi said:

 

There will be no 'friction' on an English border as members.of EFTA it doesn't effect the current arrangements.

 

The UK isn't a member of EFTA.

[Kenneth840]

8 hours ago, BudBudBud said:

It would rob me of my British Nationality, which just isn't going to happen.

There's no way I'll allow myself to be torn out of the country I love.

I guess that's the no surrender side coming through. You would still be geographically British in an Independent Scotland. I believe you are correct to say it won't happen, not under NS tenure or her replacement Angus. 

What would be wrong with you having a Scottish passport?  If Scotland was in a situation where its fiscal policy was sound, would you vote Yes?

 

Edited November 5, 2022 by Kenneth840

[Kenneth840]

10 hours ago, KingRocketman II said:

and with him you could always rely on a return to the comfy "aye, but what currency" argument whenever polls favoured indy or an SNPbad "enquiry" petered out once more....

Comfy and Peter in one sentence, 100% correct.  

I shouldn't have downvoted it, my mistake, I never realised you had worked out Pishfart was a fraud. 

[lichtgilphead]

10 minutes ago, BudBudBud said:

Regarding a Scottish passport - I'd see it as diluting my nationality.

I thought that you had previously claimed to have been born in England? You would still be entitled to a rUK passport if that is the case.

Even if you were born in Scotland, you would probably still be entitled to an rUK passport - Irish (Eire) citizens born before 1949 can still apply for a UK passport - I would expect similar arrangements would apply.

Please stop making nonsensical claims.

[lichtgilphead]

9 minutes ago, BudBudBud said:

If you wish to specify the ridiculous claims I’ve made then I’ll happily address them.

You claim that a Scottish passport would dilute your nationality, even though you would be under no obligation to take up your entitlement to such a passport, as you would also be entitled to a rUK passport.

[Antlion]

2 minutes ago, BudBudBud said:

Yes, I believe it’s very existence, even if not taken up by me, would dilute my British Nationality.

The very notion of choosing what passport you want trivialises Nationhood, in my humble opinion.

Just my take on it though pal.  The world would be boring if we all agreed.

The Treaty of Union already did that.

[lichtgilphead]

6 minutes ago, BudBudBud said:

Yes, I believe it’s very existence, even if not taken up by me, would dilute my British Nationality.

Do you feel that the existence of separate Englsh & Scottish bus passes dilute your nationality? 

6 minutes ago, BudBudBud said:

The very notion of choosing what passport you want trivialises Nationhood, in my humble opinion.

Why do you have a problem with dual nationalities? As a high profile example, Boris Johnson will have had to make that very choice.

[carpetmonster]

9 minutes ago, lichtgilphead said:

 

Why do you have a problem with dual nationalities? As a high profile example, Boris Johnson will have had to make that very choice.

He may not have *had* to - while the US generally frowns upon its citizens holding office in other countries, I’m unsure as to how Sunak still reputedly holds a green card when ‘ordinarily living outside the US’ for 12 months - and they really don’t like over 6 - has them deem your GC vacated. 
 

The reason he did was because he didn’t fancy paying US taxes anymore. I’ll be taking out US citizenship next year; the US and UK essentially ignore each other’s citizenships for the pleb class. If Scotland goes independent I’d renounce my UK citizenship and take out Scottish, in order to get the EU freedom of movement. My American child won’t be getting a British passport, for the same reason. 

[sophia]

28 minutes ago, BudBudBud said:

No, I don't think the bus pass set-up dilutes my nationality at all.

For me nationality is much more than an acknowledgement of citizenship to a place.  It has it's roots in history, culture, peoples and a long, interesting story as to how each one of us has arrived where we are.

In the true sense of the word, I don't think it can be chosen, although in the legal sense this obviously isn't the case.

I suppose my mindset is different to most.  For example, I could never move abroad, no matter whether I was offered 'citizenship', a high paying job or a better lifestyle etc.  I love my country and want to help it prosper in the small way that I can.

I totally agree, the place we've arrived at is an outcome of 1746. Granted there was cultural oppression that would be held up today as crimes against humanity and ethnic cleansing but that shouldn't distract us from the legend of our British state that I love and I truly believe wider still and wider shall thy bounds be set. God, who made thee mighty, make thee mightier yet.

[lichtgilphead]

1 hour ago, BudBudBud said:

For me nationality is much more than an acknowledgement of citizenship to a place.  It has it's roots in history, culture, peoples and a long, interesting story as to how each one of us has arrived where we are.

So how does changing a couple of words on a glorified ID card affect your "history, culture, peoples and a long, interesting story as to how each one of us has arrived where we are"?

If these roots are so strong, how exactly are they weakened by this change?

Talking of ID cards, is your nationality weakened by the fact that northern ireland has different driving licences from the rest of the UK?

[Billy Jean King]

It would rob me of my British Nationality, which just isn't going to happen.
There's no way I'll allow myself to be torn out of the country I love.

Not another reincarnation of this tedious fud, ffs your totally transparent !!

[Benjamin_Nevis]

54 minutes ago, Billy Jean King said:

14 hours ago, BudBudBud said:

It would rob me of my British Nationality, which just isn't going to happen.
There's no way I'll allow myself to be torn out of the country I love.

Not another reincarnation of this tedious fud, ffs your totally transparent !!

Folk actually debating with it as well. Just laugh at the sad wee tube and move on FFS. He'll get emptied soon enough. 

[Juanhourjoe]

On 04/11/2022 at 16:31, Jedi said:

Here's a radical notion.....during any campaign in a future Referendum, the Yes side 'might' be asked some questions about EU membership, borders, currency, spending plans and priorities in the early days, the monarchy, the division of assets, moving Trident,.....as I say just a 'wild, radical notion'. Not sure if just replying 'but we will get the government we vote for in an Independent Scotland' in reply to every question will win the day on its own....probably wrong there though.

'the yes side, could be whatever faction you'd be prepared to vote for in an independent Scotland. 

Assuming on gaining independence, there would be an election on who would form the first government. (and that wouldn't include tories, lib dems or Labour in there current form) as they don't have the infrastructure of a party based in Scotland. This first election would be wide open on who would end up in charge. 

So taking that into consideration. Your answer to those questions could come from any of the pro independence groups. Who have different answers to all these questions. It doesn't really matter what the SNP say about any of these questions now, as different options on them would be put to you when the time comes. 

[Guest Jedi]

1 hour ago, Juanhourjoe said:

'the yes side, could be whatever faction you'd be prepared to vote for in an independent Scotland. 

Assuming on gaining independence, there would be an election on who would form the first government. (and that wouldn't include tories, lib dems or Labour in there current form) as they don't have the infrastructure of a party based in Scotland. This first election would be wide open on who would end up in charge. 

So taking that into consideration. Your answer to those questions could come from any of the pro independence groups. Who have different answers to all these questions. It doesn't really matter what the SNP say about any of these questions now, as different options on them would be put to you when the time comes. 

If a Ref had been won, the SNP would be in an incredibly strong position, both as the sitting Scottish govt, to negotiate the terms of Independence (based on their own prospectus) and also to win a thumping majority at the first Scottish election ( with 45% in the bag and having delivered a Yes result).It would take other parties years to find their footing in a post-Indy Scotland, so looking at 2 terms at least for an ongoing SNP govt.

[Monkey Tennis]

23 hours ago, BudBudBud said:

It would rob me of my British Nationality, which just isn't going to happen.

There's no way I'll allow myself to be torn out of the country I love.

Wait, was this sincere?

On the way through the thread I was genuinely going to give it a greenie, as I thought it was a decent parody.