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Ukraine v Scotland (27/9/22)


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5 minutes ago, Donathan said:

We did tbf. We were supposed to play in March and agreed to move the game to June which meant they brought their first squad. Had we insisted on March they’d either have withdrawn or cobbled together a selection of overseas based players which we’d probably have won.

Aye, war is a wee bit sort of different. 

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51 minutes ago, TheScarf said:

The Czechs were better than us regardless of the formation we played against them, for me it's nowhere near the top 10.

How have you reached the conclusion they were better than us, given we beat them in the previous meeting just 5 months prior?

I'd have thought that was the strongest indicator of who the better side was going in to the game. 

 

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Do you have to advance register a "squad" for internationals? Managers pick squads to give themselves a group to work with obviously and there's a requirement to name a squad for tournament finals. Genuinely not sure there is for qualifying matches. Clearly there are the practicalities of getting a valid passport and potentially a visa for the destination country in some cases (I assume we can move freely to Poland for work can we?).
I'd have thought if it took our fancy to fill out a squad there's nothing to prevent Stevie Clarke naming himself and Steven Naismith in the squad as long as he submits a teamline the designated 2 hours before kick off, or however long it is. Anyone know for sure?
I remember when Snodgrass retired, Lewis Morgan was called up the same day to replace him. There's obviously a chance that this was done the before it was announced or Lewis Morgan was sort of part of the squad like others have been, but it's the closest I can think of a player being called up before a game.
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22 minutes ago, deadasdillinger said:

How have you reached the conclusion they were better than us, given we beat them in the previous meeting just 5 months prior?

I'd have thought that was the strongest indicator of who the better side was going in to the game. 

 

Because the were. They had better players than us and finished above us in the group. 

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28 minutes ago, deadasdillinger said:

How have you reached the conclusion they were better than us, given we beat them in the previous meeting just 5 months prior?

I'd have thought that was the strongest indicator of who the better side was going in to the game. 

 

That's a terrible take. On that basis then every single football match is won by the better team and there is never an upset?

The Czechs were no great shakes at the time but they were better than us, regardless of what we may have done in the previous meeting.

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Anyone claiming that any defeat at a world cup proper is embarrassing is at it or has just been asleep for 20 years.

Faroes 2002, Holland (6-0) in 2003, Kazakhstan away, Georgia away (2007), any of the Wales games and a whole lot besides put any tournament defeat in the shade.

Anyway, back to tomorrow. I don't fancy us to get anything, but it's not a qualifier (I know it isn't meaningless before a'body piles in) and I'm not overly arsed.

1-0 Scotland with Gallagher pocketing whatever jobbing lump Ukraine stick up top. 

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12 minutes ago, velo army said:

Anyone claiming that any defeat at a world cup proper is embarrassing is at it or has just been asleep for 20 years.

Faroes 2002, Holland (6-0) in 2003, Kazakhstan away, Georgia away (2007), any of the Wales games and a whole lot besides put any tournament defeat in the shade.

Anyway, back to tomorrow. I don't fancy us to get anything, but it's not a qualifier (I know it isn't meaningless before a'body piles in) and I'm not overly arsed.

1-0 Scotland with Gallagher pocketing whatever jobbing lump Ukraine stick up top. 

It's more important than your typical qualifier. Get a result and we're guaranteed a play-off spot.

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4 minutes ago, ArabFC said:

It's more important than your typical qualifier. Get a result and we're guaranteed a play-off spot.

We get another shot at a qualifying campaign. I'm not saying it's unimportant, I'm just trying to feel better about it.

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23 minutes ago, velo army said:

Anyone claiming that any defeat at a world cup proper is embarrassing is at it or has just been asleep for 20 years.

Faroes 2002, Holland (6-0) in 2003, Kazakhstan away, Georgia away (2007), any of the Wales games and a whole lot besides put any tournament defeat in the shade.

I'm not sure that's entirely true.  Take the point but there is context to take into account too. Half the country thought we were going to WIN the World Cup when we lost to Peru and drew with Iran. We thought we'd done the hard work in snatching a draw against Norway at France 98 and that a win against Morocco would follow. Hell, I was over there and busy working out how I could extend my holidays and get tickets for the last 16 match before we played! We not only lost, we lost heavily without any sort of fight.

The degree of over-confidence we (as a nation) showed is relevant to the degree of embarrassment also.

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Just now, velo army said:

Anyone claiming that any defeat at a world cup proper is embarrassing is at it or has just been asleep for 20 years.

Faroes 2002, Holland (6-0) in 2003, Kazakhstan away, Georgia away (2007), any of the Wales games and a whole lot besides put any tournament defeat in the shade.

Anyway, back to tomorrow. I don't fancy us to get anything, but it's not a qualifier (I know it isn't meaningless before a'body piles in) and I'm not overly arsed.

1-0 Scotland with Gallagher pocketing whatever jobbing lump Ukraine stick up top. 

Aye thats a good shout, Holland 6-0 was an absolutely appalling feeling.

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2 minutes ago, BingMcCrosby said:

Aye thats a good shout, Holland 6-0 was an absolutely appalling feeling.

The home leg was the first Scotland game I could legally drink and what a fucking state I was in after it. The 2nd leg was highly sobering. 

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I found the 2-1 win over Lichtenstein extremely annoying and embarrassing even though we won and fought back. I left the pub just as we scored the winner heard the roars but didn't even turn back. 

Defeats and 0-0 vs Lithunaia were also filed in a similar category. Also the2-0 defeat in Georgia.

Last two probably down to missed opportunities more than anything else.

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I'm not sure that's entirely true.  Take the point but there is context to take into account too. Half the country thought we were going to WIN the World Cup when we lost to Peru and drew with Iran. We thought we'd done the hard work in snatching a draw against Norway at France 98 and that a win against Morocco would follow. Hell, I was over there and busy working out how I could extend my holidays and get tickets for the last 16 match before we played! We not only lost, we lost heavily without any sort of fight.
The degree of over-confidence we (as a nation) showed is relevant to the degree of embarrassment also.


The only saving grace from the Morocco game was that at least we didn't win and then get knocked out anyway as Norway were beating Brazil at the same time.

THAT would have been peak Scotland.
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1 hour ago, velo army said:

Anyone claiming that any defeat at a world cup proper is embarrassing is at it or has just been asleep for 20 years.

Faroes 2002, Holland (6-0) in 2003, Kazakhstan away, Georgia away (2007), any of the Wales games and a whole lot besides put any tournament defeat in the shade.

Anyway, back to tomorrow. I don't fancy us to get anything, but it's not a qualifier (I know it isn't meaningless before a'body piles in) and I'm not overly arsed.

1-0 Scotland with Gallagher pocketing whatever jobbing lump Ukraine stick up top. 

 

Since 2000 alone:

 

2004 ECQ - Beaten in Lithuania and draw in Faroe Islands

2006 WCQ - We took a single point from two games against Belarus and failed to score against them. We also drew 1-1 in Moldova.

2008 ECQ - Lost in Georgia

2010 WCQ - Lost in Macedonia

2012 ECQ - Draw in Lithuania

2014 WCQ - Drew at home to Macedonia 

2016 ECQ - Beaten in Georgia again

2018 WCQ - Drew at home to Lithuania

2020 ECQ - Humped in Kazakhstan

 

The most recent campaign was the first one since the 2002 world cup qualifying that we didn't drop points against any minnows. Lithuania, Georgia and North Macedonia have been particularly tricky customers for us over the years.

 

I don't think the 6-0 against Holland belongs on this list. They were a very very good side.

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