Clubs Are Taking The Piss Thread

[DA Baracus]

Water should be free at every single SPFL ground.

[Mr. X]

8 hours ago, accies1874 said:

 

 

 

These clubs have lost the run of themselves, some are making it harder for fans to buy tickets, plus we've already seen dreadful stewarding/organisation by at least one club.

 

What can/should be done to make things better for fans? Why do clubs hate away fans? Are you put off going to games for whatever off-the-pitch reason?

 

Hearts lowest away ticket prices are £19.

Unfortunately that only kicks in once the upper section has sold out and the lower section tickets become available. 

This should happen more frequent this season as fewer away tickets will be available due to the higher demand for home tickets.

[craigkillie]

Except that those £19 tickets only become available after a large number of people have shelled out £27.

[pozbaird]

1 hour ago, Mr. X said:

Hearts lowest away ticket prices are £19.

Unfortunately that only kicks in once the upper section has sold out and the lower section tickets become available. 

This should happen more frequent this season as fewer away tickets will be available due to the higher demand for home tickets.

If St Mirren are a bronze fixture, then frankly, I am insulted.

[johnnydun]

The way the clubs will see it, if you knock £1 off every ticket for, say Dundee at an average attendance of say 4000, the club miss out on £72k a season.

Reduce that to £20, the club would miss out on £288k a season.

I don't agree with pricing as it is, but the clubs are a business and it is a massive revenue stream, especially in this country.

Of course this may bring more fans back, but not the 800 required every week to make back the balance.

Edited August 3, 2022 by johnnydun

[Lyle Lanley]

We are charging our own support £35 for this Sunday’s derby. 

[Swello]

I go to most of our away games every season and have done for years and it feels like clubs are now down to wringing the last drops out of the dwindling number of people that can (a) afford it and (b) can be arsed navigating that week's Secret Ground Entry Challenge*

I never really understand clubs' obvious ambivalence towards away supporters - they pay money that must be good for cashflow, a good away support hugely enhances the atmosphere/experience and at a time where home supports are pretty static, it's a way to grow your gate receipts. For clubs like Rangers, Celtic & Hearts that can feasibly sell out their stadiums I kind of get it - but for clubs that host a fucking forest of empty seats every week I really don't get why they seemingly go out their way to make the experience as miserable as possible.

 

* Apparently next season, in order to get into a run of the mill away game, we need to:

1. Collect 5 coupons out of the local paper of the home team and send them to them to the club secretary who will send you a website address in return

2. (After 6 rounds of Captcha traffic light selections) Register on the website, where you will be provided a phone number

3. Call the number, select the correct options to be informed which local industrial estate will host the portakabin where you can get a ticket authorisation QR code

4. Queue between 08:00 and 10:00 on matchday at the home team's social club, where an old lady at a trestle table will scan the QR code, take the admission fee (Postal orders only, no cards or cash) and issue a turnstile approach voucher (strictly 1 per person, valid only with 2 recent utility bills)

5. Present the voucher to a steward who will perform a borderline sexual assualt with some vague excuse about "Pyro" before allowing you to approach the huge queue to the one open turnstile.

6. Answer a final riddle and you're in! (all seats are covered in police incident tape except 18 single restricted view seats scattered randomly around the stand - pies sold out on Friday)

[VincentGuerin]

9 hours ago, craigkillie said:

Except that those £19 tickets only become available after a large number of people have shelled out £27.

'Except'

You mean exactly like his post said

Edited August 4, 2022 by VincentGuerin

[Dons_1988]

11 hours ago, VincentGuerin said:

That's true to an extent. But fans are part of the window dressing.

Look at how much of the tv marketing around British football focuses on 'THE PASSION' and 'THE RIVALRY' etc.

Fans are central to how the game is sold.

Well this is it, we are essentially part of the product instead of the target customer. 

And yet we’re being rinsed to do so. 

[VincentGuerin]

Just now, Dons_1988 said:

Well this is it, we are essentially part of the product instead of the target customer. 

And yet we’re being rinsed to do so. 

We are. But my point is that the nature of how it is sold gives us a degree of power.

Firstly, Scottish clubs are more reliant on gate money as compared to tv money than clubs from other leagues. While they'll use this as justification for maximising prices, it also means they feel it if we don't show up. Certainly much more so than if English Premier League fans were to boycott, for example.

Secondly, clubs don't want empty stadiums from a marketing perspective. The game is sold on there being fans and it having an atmosphere etc.

I'm not saying that as fans we can just fix this in a couple of weeks, but we don't make use of the degree of power we have.

[DoingThe42]

I've been around a bit already this season, and some of the pricing has been reasonable. For example, a tenner to watch Albion Rovers v Cove is fair enough.

However, I also got absolutely bumped for £24 to watch Dundee v Thistle, which was an excellent game, but still, and then £25 for St Mirren v Motherwell. Again, a decent game to be at, but that's not cheap.

This weekend I've got two games.£20 for Queens Park v Ayr and £20 for Arbroath v ICT.

I should add in that the bumping extends past ticket prices as well. Dundee charged me £2 for a match programme, which seemed about right.

Then I discovered that it was essentially a poster with three pages of adverts and two pages of 'reading'! Absolutely mugged.

 

[For Your Pies Only]

Prices for away fans should match average prices for home fans IMO, and it's short sighted of clubs to charge £26+ at a time when finances are tight for folk if they truly want to grow attendances.

To play devil's advocate a wee bit though, clubs could argue that fitba pricing is if anything cheaper than the going rate for most live events now. Gig prices are £30+ for any reasonably established act, closer to £50 for anything at the Hydro. Saturday theatre tickets are rarely under £25. If you wanted to go and see an AC/DC tribute band in Glenrothes this month it's £20 quid minimum. 

[craigkillie]

'Except'
You mean exactly like his post said [emoji3]

His post said it, but he was arguing that Hearts should have been listed at £19 on the table, which I don't agree with for the reason given.

[pozbaird]

12 minutes ago, For Your Pies Only said:

Prices for away fans should match average prices for home fans IMO, and it's short sighted of clubs to charge £26+ at a time when finances are tight for folk if they truly want to grow attendances.

To play devil's advocate a wee bit though, clubs could argue that fitba pricing is if anything cheaper than the going rate for most live events now. Gig prices are £30+ for any reasonably established act, closer to £50 for anything at the Hydro. Saturday theatre tickets are rarely under £25. If you wanted to go and see an AC/DC tribute band in Glenrothes this month it's £20 quid minimum. 

£50 for an established act at the Hydro could be classed as a bargain these days - if for example, the established act is an ageing Genesis with Phil Collins in a bathchair. As for the upcoming  ‘dynamic ticketing’ scandal through Ticketmaster for the Springsteen tour that pit stops at Murrayfield, don’t get me started.

Thing about gigs by bands at the Hydro or a stadium - you’ll only get to see them tour once every X amount of years. Last Hydro gig I was at was possibly Kiss on their farewell tour. I’d never seen them before. Think it was about £75. Was fantastic, and pretty much guaranteed to be a great event. There’s fitba’ matches week after week, after week. No guarantee you’ll even enjoy it. The pricing for something like Scottish football does need ‘capped’ if possible, or something done, at least in these ‘cost of living crisis’ times.

Edited August 4, 2022 by pozbaird

[DukDukGoose]

9 hours ago, johnnydun said:

The way the clubs will see it, if you knock £1 off every ticket for, say Dundee at an average attendance of say 4000, the club miss out on £72k a season.

Reduce that to £20, the club would miss out on £288k a season.

I don't agree with pricing as it is, but the clubs are a business and it is a massive revenue stream, especially in this country.

Of course this may bring more fans back, but not the 800 required every week to make back the balance.

Exactly this.

[AJF]

I think a twenty's plenty campaign only works if there is a significant alternative income stream for clubs. That's why it's more feasible in England where they get paid astronomical amounts in TV revenue.

The fact that ticket sales is the main source of income for clubs in Scotland leads me to think it's a non-starter unless something drastically changed.

[shuggz]

33 minutes ago, pozbaird said:

£50 for an established act at the Hydro could be classed as a bargain these days - if for example, the established act is an ageing Genesis with Phil Collins in a bathchair. As for the upcoming  ‘dynamic ticketing’ scandal through Ticketmaster for the Springsteen tour that pit stops at Murrayfield, don’t get me started.

Thing about gigs by bands at the Hydro or a stadium - you’ll only get to see them tour once every X amount of years. Last Hydro gig I was at was possibly Kiss on their farewell tour. I’d never seen them before. Think it was about £75. Was fantastic, and pretty much guaranteed to be a great event. There’s fitba’ matches week after week, after week. No guarantee you’ll even enjoy it. The pricing for something like Scottish football does need ‘capped’ if possible, or something done, at least in these ‘cost of living crisis’ times.

Was looking at prices for George Ezra at TECA..c£120 top price..then my eye was caught by Justin Beiber for next year.Wonder how much ?   Top seat....

 

 

 

 

£260.

[Swello]

7 minutes ago, AJF said:

I think a twenty's plenty campaign only works if there is a significant alternative income stream for clubs.

Offering PPV for away supports should be that additional revenue stream as I don't believe it would cannibalise away support numbers any more than the cost of petrol and ludicrous admission will - but even that was rife with over-charging and arbitrary restrictions (Hi Celtic) during the pandemic. I know our ever helpful broadcast partners add another layer of restrictions onto this but that is surely not insurmountable.

The current setup is custom-designed to drive folk to the dodgy streams route and there are now countless examples (netflix, spotify, steam, etc) where a well run, easy to access digital service will beat the piracy route. If folk can't afford the total price of a day out, they may well be willing to pay for a high quality stream from an SPFL run service - which is going to be preferable to trying to click a 1 pixel wide "X" to remove a GIF of a massive fanny from in front of your 240P stream of St Johnstone Vs St Mirren on Hesgoal.

[NorthBank]

Paisley artist John Byrne exhibition in Kelvingrove is £7.50

New Order tribute Band at the Bungalow in Paisley £11

Showcase cinema Paisley £9.75 for the most expensive ticket.

For each of the above I will be entertained; can buy a ticket at the venue or on-line; have access to decent toilets with hot water; won't be searched on entry. At one venue I can even have a pint. The others have cafes.

It is no surprise that non-diehards won't go to matches when they can have a far cheaper form of entertainment at a fraction of the cost. Only the diehards go to matches these days and that will slowly diminish as price rises give us all less spare cash. Clubs will not attract more potential fans at current admission prices.

[VincentGuerin]

12 minutes ago, Swello said:

Offering PPV for away supports should be that additional revenue stream as I don't believe it would cannibalise away support numbers any more than the cost of petrol and ludicrous admission will - but even that was rife with over-charging and arbitrary restrictions (Hi Celtic) during the pandemic. I know our ever helpful broadcast partners add another layer of restrictions onto this but that is surely not insurmountable.

The current setup is custom-designed to drive folk to the dodgy streams route and there are now countless examples (netflix, spotify, steam, etc) where a well run, easy to access digital service will beat the piracy route. If folk can't afford the total price of a day out, they may well be willing to pay for a high quality stream from an SPFL run service - which is going to be preferable to trying to click a 1 pixel wide "X" to remove a GIF of a massive fanny from in front of your 240P stream of St Johnstone Vs St Mirren on Hesgoal.

I agree with this in principle, but there's a lot of development and thought needed.

For example, I subscribe to Hearts TV and (with the use of a VPN) will watch any Hearts game I can't go to by paying Hearts for it rather than even looking for a dodgy stream. I think most fans would be happy to pay for this as long as the service is reliable.

The problem is the issue of getting fans to pay for the away games on a one-off basis.

For example, if Dundee United allow me to pay 28 quid to watch Dundee United v Hearts at home, I'm likely to get a mate who lives nearby to come and split the cost with me and watch the game with a bit of company. Or another 2 or 3 or whatever. Why wouldn't we? In the same way, I've shared my Hearts TV log-in with plenty of mates and family in the past.

I'm not sure what the answer to that is. Without some kind of loyalty points system rewarding people paying for it themselves (and I've got no idea how that would work), I don't see how you get people to pay. It's easy to see how four or five paying customers for an away game become one paying customer.