Who will be the next permanent manager of the Conservatives?

[CambieBud]

16 minutes ago, scottsdad said:

 

Only now are we seeing some of this from the Tories. Sunak being called a socialist is just like Starmer being called a Tory. 

You say this but all evidence suggests that Starmer is a Tory. Name me one policy that differentiates the 2 parties?

[williemillersmoustache]

27 minutes ago, Monkey Tennis said:

I don't think it does anymore.

Historically, it favoured the two biggest parties, but it's not helping Labour now and is unlikely to in the foreseeable future.

I think objectively you're right it's not working but they don't have the wit or courage to do anything other than "wait their turn" 

[williemillersmoustache]

Just now, CambieBud said:

You say this but all evidence suggests that Starmer is a Tory. Name me one policy that differentiates the 2 parties?

This, tell me something about him other than how he parts his hair that's on the left. 

[Richey Edwards]

4 minutes ago, williemillersmoustache said:

This, tell me something about him other than how he parts his hair that's on the left. 

He drives on the left.

[LongTimeLurker]

1 hour ago, Clown Job said:

I’m just watching for a pledge of allegiance to the flag in schools being proposed next 

Education is devolved so they would only be able to do it in England. Thing is though would you put it past some SNP supporters to want something like that with a Saltire involved? Excessive nationalism is an issue regardless of which flag it revolves around.

[O'Kelly Isley III]

1 hour ago, Clown Job said:

I’m just watching for a pledge of allegiance to the flag in schools being proposed next 

This could prove interesting for those of us who remain seated and silent during the 'Loyal Toast' which is still perpetuated at some social occasions.  Burns Suppers, for example, normally accompanied by the sound of Rabbie birlin' in his grave.

[RiffRaff]

People who vilify Britain will be treated as extremists and referred to the Government’s deradicalisation Prevent programme under plans by Rishi Sunak.

Does this mean that anyone voting SNP is vilifying Britain, by the nature of their vote they wish to see Briatin broken up?

I wonder what exactly a "deradicilasation" programme consists of?

 

[D Angelo Barksdale]

'We are a tolerant country, but anyone who says different better watch out'

[Salt n Vinegar]

16 minutes ago, O'Kelly Isley III said:

This could prove interesting for those of us who remain seated and silent during the 'Loyal Toast' which is still perpetuated at some social occasions.  Burns Suppers, for example, normally accompanied by the sound of Rabbie birlin' in his grave.

Presumably being of a republican outlook would be a criminal offence. I know that some folk who are fans of the same club as me, would quite like that, but they're @rseholes. British values don't appear to be what people think they are. 

I've chaired a few Burns Suppers in my time, and have only called upon speakers to do the "strictly necessary" toasts. One gammon asked me if there was going to be a toast to the monarch and seemed a bit annoyed when I said no. I said he was free to propose one at any other point in the ceilidh which followed, but not during the 'formal' Burns Supper, but he didn't take up the offer. 

If right wing loonies think that even appearing to support suppression of opinion or criticism is a "British value" then they're not living in the country they claim to want. 

Maybe we could draw up a list of what British values are? 

Let's start with two... respect for the law and recognising the importance of honesty....

[Antlion]

13 minutes ago, Salt n Vinegar said:

 

Maybe we could draw up a list of what British values are? 

Let's start with two... respect for the law and recognising the importance of honesty....

Executing, dethroning, humbling, and eroding the power of monarchs. British history is full of it.

[Monkey Tennis]

1 hour ago, Fullerene said:

There are a lot of people in the Labour Party who struggle to understand that.

FPTP is supposedly more likely to give them a working majority but what is the point of that if you have to water down your beliefs so much that it is no better than a coalition government?

Also, what can a Labour majority government do that cannot be undone by a subsequent Tory majority government?

FTFP ensures you either have a Labour Party drifting rightwards or a Labour Party seen as too left wing to be electable.

You're right.

The tactical voting evident in the recent English by-elections shows that there is an appetite for anti-Tory voting.  

A system of PR would allow that to happen without the requirement for that kind of coordination, which is less likely to materialise in a General Election anyway.

[Monkey Tennis]

1 hour ago, scottsdad said:

I have said in the past that Labour agonise over stuff that the Tories never bother with. The Tories (until now) have been happy to simply be in power. From within power they can come up with policies, flip-flop, do whatever they like.

Labour, on the other hand, always agonise over the purity of the offering from opposition. Labour will fight itself over and over again on the radical/centrist/electable/unelectable/red tory/hard left nonsense. Always they agonise about who they are and as a result, they stay in opposition. 

Only now are we seeing some of this from the Tories. Sunak being called a socialist is just like Starmer being called a Tory. 

Again, a reason why Labour agonise over things that the Tories wouldn't, is to do with the scrutiny and hostility Labour know they'll encounter from the popular press.

I wish they could be bolder at times, but it's harder for them.  As we're seeing, Tories really can afford to come out with any old shit, without it seeming to carry much cost.

[scottsdad]

45 minutes ago, Monkey Tennis said:

Again, a reason why Labour agonise over things that the Tories wouldn't, is to do with the scrutiny and hostility Labour know they'll encounter from the popular press.

I wish they could be bolder at times, but it's harder for them.  As we're seeing, Tories really can afford to come out with any old shit, without it seeming to carry much cost.

I completely agree. Yesterday Liz Truss basically announced lower pay for folk in the North, then did a very fast U-turn. Today the Daily Mail officially endorsed her for Tory leader. 

Had Labour made any such U-turn, even on a much smaller scale, the Mail, Torygraph, Sun, Express and so on would be ripping them to shreds. 

[ICTJohnboy]

3 hours ago, virginton said:

The Tories absolutely do face a similar problem, as their pledges to level up shithole towns in northern England do not tally with the foaming at the mouth tax cuts agenda favoured by their traditional base in the southern English shires. That's why Truss was forced to U-turn on her regional pay policy within 24 hours: the northern Tories were appalled by that seeming betrayal. 

The Tories cannot both fund investment in the north and reduce taxes in the south while plunging headfirst into the middle of an economic shitstorm. 

The Truss u-turn came about 2 hours later, then she lied by claiming to have been mis-represented.

She's clearly the obvious and natural successor to BoJo.

[Frank Quitely]

15 minutes ago, scottsdad said:

I completely agree. Yesterday Liz Truss basically announced lower pay for folk in the North, then did a very fast U-turn. Today the Daily Mail officially endorsed her for Tory leader. 

Had Labour made any such U-turn, even on a much smaller scale, the Mail, Torygraph, Sun, Express and so on would be ripping them to shreds. 

I don't disagree but people don't buy papers for information or illumination, they buy them to validate their already-held prejudices.

Just like America, there are now very few swing voters out there ready to be influenced by the press or the media in general.  Thought has largely been replaced by ignorance and bigotry.  And that is right up the Tory street.

[101]

36 minutes ago, scottsdad said:

I completely agree. Yesterday Liz Truss basically announced lower pay for folk in the North, then did a very fast U-turn. Today the Daily Mail officially endorsed her for Tory leader. 

Had Labour made any such U-turn, even on a much smaller scale, the Mail, Torygraph, Sun, Express and so on would be ripping them to shreds. 

The editor of the mail isn't going to be elevated to the lord's by shredding the Tories

[dirty dingus]

Truss is in Wales for hustings and is now saying she's coming for Drakeford and will be holding him to account. Surely that's the job of the Welsh electorate.

[ICTJohnboy]

5 minutes ago, dirty dingus said:

Truss is in Wales for hustings and is now saying she's coming for Drakeford and will be holding him to account. Surely that's the job of the Welsh electorate.

 

Will the attention seeking cow be visiting Scotland any time soon?

[Salvo Montalbano]

1 minute ago, ICTJohnboy said:

 

Will the attention seeking cow be visiting Scotland any time soon?

There's a hustings in Perth I'm sure it was reported.

[dirty dingus]

16th August Perth