The Queen of the South thread

[Frankie S]

On 13/04/2022 at 23:53, Priti priti priti Patel said:

People keep referring to money in the bank. 

The £1 million detailed in the accounts isn't necessarily in the bank now. Although sent to shareholders in Feb this year, the accounts in fact covered the financial year up to 31 May 2021. The £1 million was in the bank as of 31 May 2021 - i.e before the start of the season. 

The board were forecasting a six figure loss for this season so at least part of it will have been spent. The majority of it was covid grants paid up front and intended to cover losses due to covid. I suspect a large part of that £1 million will have been spent by now. 

 

A six figure loss is anything from 100k to 999.99k. Assuming it is a six figure loss as predicted, I would suspect it would be much closer to the former figure than the latter. Given the board’s reputation for relatively prudent financial management (a virtue in most businesses, the flipside is that in football it can be seen as penny-pinching), there’s absolutely no chance we’ve spent the majority of that £1 million by now. If there’s one thing our risk averse board could be expected to do reasonably well, it’s navigate the club steadily and carefully through a crisis, so I presume their stewardship of the club through the Covid crisis was fairly exemplary. 

Football clubs got bailed out to a degree that other businesses didn’t. The Covid windfalls bestowed upon Championship clubs makes most of us in the business sector green with envy. I wish my four businesses (whose combined turnover comfortably exceeds that of Queen of the South) had received a million quid in Covid grants - lucky if they received a quarter of that, and despite being at the cutting edge of the sectors worst affected by Covid, we’ve largely preserved our pre-Covid cash at bank holdings / current assets position due to a combination of furlough, Covid grants and careful stewardship through challenging times.

As a shareholder, I suspect the next set of accounts will make rather less traumatic viewing than many anticipate - much less horrific than the x-rated rubbish we’ve had to endure on the park this season at any rate. Shareholder funds at Queens increased from just over 1.4 million to >2.1 million in the year to end of May 2021, a huge increase that relatively few businesses could conceivably have replicated in the Covid era. The amount owed to creditors was relatively negligible given the strength of the balance sheet / exceedingly healthy current assets position. 

And I’ve yet to be persuaded that the bunch of losers that masqueraded as a football team in Queen of the South colours this season were anything other than the bargain basement selection of cut price journeyman that they looked. In football you generally get what you pay for. 

 

 

 

 

[Otis Blue]

1 hour ago, Priti priti priti Patel said:

This is not one bad season with a dodgy manager. We have been declining season on season for years now and not just on the pitch. I can't say how much it's down to Hewitson rather than other directors, members of staff, or major shareholders, but this is most certainly a result of institutional failure rather than just one manager getting it wrong on the pitch.

^^^ This ... the result of a business strategy lacking any ambition, yet persevered with for several seasons now.  We reap what we sow ...

[TERREGLES1919]

1 hour ago, Benji said:

That’s us down for sure. 
 

I wonder how many years it’ll be before we come back up? 
 

Plenty. Look at Falkirk as an example 

[Otis Blue]

15 minutes ago, Frankie S said:

A six figure loss is anything from 100k to 999.99k. Assuming it is a six figure loss as predicted, I would suspect it would be much closer to the former figure than the latter. Given the board’s reputation for relatively prudent financial management (a virtue in most businesses, the flipside is that in football it can be seen as penny-pinching), there’s absolutely no chance we’ve spent the majority of that £1 million by now. If there’s one thing our risk averse board could be expected to do reasonably well, it’s navigate the club steadily and carefully through a crisis, so I presume their stewardship of the club through the Covid crisis was fairly exemplary. 

Football clubs got bailed out to a degree that other businesses didn’t. The Covid windfalls bestowed upon Championship clubs makes most of us in the business sector green with envy. I wish my four businesses (whose combined turnover comfortably exceeds that of Queen of the South) had received a million quid in Covid grants - lucky if they received a quarter of that, and despite being at the cutting edge of the sectors worst affected by Covid, we’ve largely preserved our pre-Covid cash at bank holdings / current assets position due to a combination of furlough, Covid grants and careful stewardship through challenging times.

As a shareholder, I suspect the next set of accounts will make rather less traumatic viewing than many anticipate - much less horrific than the x-rated rubbish we’ve had to endure on the park this season at any rate. Shareholder funds at Queens increased from just over 1.4 million to >2.1 million in the year to end of May 2021, a huge increase that relatively few businesses could conceivably have replicated in the Covid era. The amount owed to creditors was relatively negligible given the strength of the balance sheet / exceedingly healthy current assets position. 

And I’ve yet to be persuaded that the bunch of losers that masqueraded as a football team in Queen of the South colours this season were anything other than the bargain basement selection of cut price journeyman that they looked. In football you generally get what you pay for. 

Hard to find fault with that ... and thanks for the business insights there Frankie S.

I think for most of us on here when we saw the squad that had been assembled at the start of the season it was painfully clear that they were from the lower leagues up here or from non-leagues south of the border and relatively young and inexperienced.  It was another continuation of our "cheap as chips" financially prudent strategy in the hope that we might have got lucky by unearthing a few gems from that market.  Most of us realised that it was an extremely risky strategy and one that would inevitably get us found out ... and we got found out.

I don't blame Gibson, he's a local lad and it's obvious he feels passionately about his roots and the club, and he did what he could with a lousy hand dealt to him.  My own view is keep Gibson as player for maybe another season combined with him continuing to gain coaching experience with the youngsters - but go and get a decent manager in; someone with energy, experience, a proven eye for a player and able to motivate players ... and give him a decent budget.  We should push the boat out this time for the manager and say to the guy ... this is a real opportunity to build something now and create a squad able to return to the Championship and to compete well in it ... and an opportunity for you to improve your standing in the game.  Queens have potential in the Scottish game at our level - we arguably have more potential than Arbroath (absolutely no slight on Arbroath intended there) and as much as Ayr, Morton, Raith, Hamilton, Inverness etc.

[Kunter]

It's been coming for a number of seasons and there's been little in the way of evasive action to prevent such a fate from our board. 

It's not even just about the football. Even off the field they are a complete inept shambles. 

Just do the right thing Hewitson and go. 

 

[Slipmat]

If and when we lose to Caley on Tuesday it will be 8 consecutive defeats in competitive games which would match the second worst such run in the club's history.  We've done that before in 1963/64 and over the end of 1981/82 (6 losses) & beginning of 1982/83 (2 losses).

The big question is, can we match or overtake the worst ever run of 10 consecutive defeats in the 1958/59 season?

I think we've got it in us.

[sneeuq]

12 minutes ago, Slipmat said:

If and when we lose to Caley on Tuesday it will be 8 consecutive defeats in competitive games which would match the second worst such run in the club's history.  We've done that before in 1963/64 and over the end of 1981/82 (6 losses) & beginning of 1982/83 (2 losses).

The big question is, can we match or overtake the worst ever run of 10 consecutive defeats in the 1958/59 season?

I think we've got it in us.

And some folks still want Gibson to have the gig

[Guest Flash]

8 minutes ago, Slipmat said:

If and when we lose to Caley on Tuesday it will be 8 consecutive defeats in competitive games which would match the second worst such run in the club's history.  We've done that before in 1963/64 and over the end of 1981/82 (6 losses) & beginning of 1982/83 (2 losses).

The big question is, can we match or overtake the worst ever run of 10 consecutive defeats in the 1958/59 season?

I think we've got it in us.

Were there 12 consecutive league defeats in 63/64, with a cup game in between that reduced it to 8 in all competitions?

[Slipmat]

30 minutes ago, Flash said:

Were there 12 consecutive league defeats in 63/64, with a cup game in between that reduced it to 8 in all competitions?

My bad - I had mistakenly included a 2-0 win over Stranraer and a draw with Morton which were friendlies.  So if we include the cup loss to Hearts we actually lost 13 in a row that season, our last in the top flight.

[QoS99]

My preference would be to get another manager in and keep Gibson as a player/coach for another year. I think the argument that there is “no one out there” is a bit of a lazy one to make. There is no reason we shouldn’t be able to pinch a “smaller” clubs manager, or to try and entice a manager out of work. I know Stewart Petrie is from Dundee but wonder if he’d be willing to relocate if given the chance. Other managers out of work such as Neil McCann or Jim McIntyre could be appealing for league 1, if they want to come obviously. I’ve said before I’d love for James McFadden as manager, but again, unsure if he’d be willing to give up the punditry for our gig full time. 

[Alex Nesovic's Barmy Army]

I think you're right Gibson as a player for another year, especially in league one.

But McFadden...f**k off [emoji23]

My preference would be to get another manager in and keep Gibson as a player/coach for another year. I think the argument that there is “no one out there” is a bit of a lazy one to make. There is no reason we shouldn’t be able to pinch a “smaller” clubs manager, or to try and entice a manager out of work. I know Stewart Petrie is from Dundee but wonder if he’d be willing to relocate if given the chance. Other managers out of work such as Neil McCann or Jim McIntyre could be appealing for league 1, if they want to come obviously. I’ve said before I’d love for James McFadden as manager, but again, unsure if he’d be willing to give up the punditry for our gig full time. 

[QoS99]

1 minute ago, Alex Nesovic's Barmy Army said:

I think you're right Gibson as a player for another year, especially in league one.

But McFadden...f**k off
 

 

 

 

Hahaha I know bit of an out the box shout. But always liked the way he speaks and he has had coaching experience and previously said he wants to be a manager. I would rather we tried to be ambitious and take a risk rather than go for the easy option (Gibson). That’s nothing against him, I think he will be our manager one day, but no need to rush him in my opinion.

[QoS99]

4 minutes ago, Alex Nesovic's Barmy Army said:

I think you're right Gibson as a player for another year, especially in league one.

But McFadden...f**k off
 

 

 

 

Also I’m sure you might have said the same if for example we hired Dougie Imrie a few months ago, ie someone unproven and their first gig as a manager, and look how well that has turned out so far.

[Alex Nesovic's Barmy Army]

I am hoping, and waiting for the shuddering disappointment, that we may put some thought into it. What we want to be as a club, what vision is etc.

Also I’m sure you might have said the same if for example we hired Dougie Imrie a few months ago, ie someone unproven and their first gig as a manager, and look how well that has turned out so far.

[Otis Blue]

28 minutes ago, QoS99 said:

My preference would be to get another manager in and keep Gibson as a player/coach for another year. I think the argument that there is “no one out there” is a bit of a lazy one to make. There is no reason we shouldn’t be able to pinch a “smaller” clubs manager, or to try and entice a manager out of work. I know Stewart Petrie is from Dundee but wonder if he’d be willing to relocate if given the chance. Other managers out of work such as Neil McCann or Jim McIntyre could be appealing for league 1, if they want to come obviously. I’ve said before I’d love for James McFadden as manager, but again, unsure if he’d be willing to give up the punditry for our gig full time. 

Aye, McCann came to my mind too the other day.  Some would say he wouldn't fancy a gig way down in L1 and with an unfancied club like Queens, plus he maybe has other business interests and I think he might have some personal baggage (not sure) going on too, but if we were to offer him a decent salary and budget he might take it.  Would give the likes of McCann a relatively low profile/low pressure way back in to the management game.  He always talks a good job as a pundit and oozes enthusiasm - that alone would be a breath of fresh air after AJ's negativity.

Petrie is interesting as a "fresh face", but I'm sure there are plenty Montrose fans who will list all the personal/business reasons why he probably wouldn't take it.

Jack Ross might sound like a wild shout and earn me some ridicule ... but I reckon his star is currently on the wane and as time passes and the bigger opportunities don't come his way, who knows.

I'm sure that the club have been assessing who's who since the day AJ departed - WG was very much a stop-gap (no offence to him).

[Otis Blue]

28 minutes ago, Alex Nesovic's Barmy Army said:

But McFadden...f**k off

 

I like wee James (how can't you after that night in Paris), but something tells me he's not a manager.  He comes across as a "nice guy" but I just get the feeling he would lack some authority/presence in the dressing room.  Hope for James I'm wrong though.

[queenslad]

Not all doom and gloom - both our strikers scored when was the last time this happened in a match tis season?

[Slipmat]

After today's shitshow I just hope we can appoint a motivator.  I'm not sure that Gibson can do that on the pitch (if at all) and as I mentioned on the match thread our players' heads went down and it was as though they threw in the towel the minute Arbroath equalised.   Bear in mind that wasn't when Arbroath took the lead, it was when it was level pegging.  It's a cliche but confidence plays a big part in football and we need someone who can get the players into a mindset that every game is winnable.  For too long we have seen managers obsessing more over holding onto a one goal lead or not getting beaten. 

And could we please have a manager who signs a player to play in a single position and not because they can possibly cover four other positions which just leads to tinkering with formations and personnel?  Gibson is just as guilty as AJ in respect of moving guys from wing to wing*, or wing to central midfield, or striker to midfield.  A consistent approach to selection would help matters.

*as seen today when Folarin came on, burnt the Arbroath left back for pace and sent in a decent cross, and then was immediately switched from right to left wing so that Connelly could move from the left into a number 10 role.

[Monkey Tennis]

11 minutes ago, Slipmat said:

After today's shitshow I just hope we can appoint a motivator.  I'm not sure that Gibson can do that on the pitch (if at all) and as I mentioned on the match thread our players' heads went down and it was as though they threw in the towel the minute Arbroath equalised.   Bear in mind that wasn't when Arbroath took the lead, it was when it was level pegging.  It's a cliche but confidence plays a big part in football and we need someone who can get the players into a mindset that every game is winnable.  For too long we have seen managers obsessing more over holding onto a one goal lead or not getting beaten. 

And could we please have a manager who signs a player to play in a single position and not because they can possibly cover four other positions which just leads to tinkering with formations and personnel?  Gibson is just as guilty as AJ in respect of moving guys from wing to wing*, or wing to central midfield, or striker to midfield.  A consistent approach to selection would help matters.

*as seen today when Folarin came on, burnt the Arbroath left back for pace and sent in a decent cross, and then was immediately switched from right to left wing so that Connelly could move from the left into a number 10 role.

In Gibson's interview, he admits they "chucked it" in the second half.  He also says that if he remains in the role, he doesn't want to see it again, thus implying he would like to continue.

[Otis Blue]

29 minutes ago, Slipmat said:

After today's shitshow I just hope we can appoint a motivator ... we need someone who can get the players into a mindset that every game is winnable.  For too long we have seen managers obsessing more over holding onto a one goal lead or not getting beaten. 

Absolutely ...