How will you vote in our democratically mandated indyref 2 - 19/10/2023 (compared to 2014)

[coprolite]

3 hours ago, Eric's Cantina said:

The same self determining government that had to increase their corporate tax rate because the EU had a hissy fit

 

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/europe-has-done-a-number-on-the-irish-corporate-tax-rate-1.4596332

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-58832429

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/oct/07/ireland-poised-to-drop-125-tax-rate-in-oecd-global-pact

What did the EU have to do with that exactly? 

Ireland has voluntarily signed up to a US led global initiative co-ordinated by the OECD. Like Britain. And Japan. And Canada. The poor defenceless lambs. 

[Blootoon87]

Yes then, yes now. Obviously.

[GTG_03]

7 hours ago, strichener said:

We would be no more a nation of equals in the EU than we are in the UK.

We could choose to leave anytime we wanted though...it would be up to us, and isn't that the whole point? 

[DeeTillEhDeh]

Spoilt ballot last time. A big Yes this time.

[HeartsOfficialMoaner]

7 hours ago, Antlion said:

I suppose it would be churlish to point out that unless Scotland somehow saws itself off from England at the border and engineers a tectonic shift that sees it float off into the North Sea, its people will always be British. Just because the UK has hijacked the term (presumably because UKish sounds rank) that doesn’t mean they own it. In fact, would people from the rUK have any more right to the term “British”?

After all, wouldn’t they have to rebrand (again) as the United Territories of the Former Kingdom of England, Principality of Wales, and Partition of Northern Ireland? Or even the United Territories of Southern Great Britain and Northern Ireland? (United Kingdom would be shafted as England would be the only kingdom, united not with another kingdom but with Wales and Northern Ireland. Maybe they’re so desperate to keep us to save on the admin - though you’d think the Tories would be dying to sell off rebranding responsibilities to their pals in pet food or recruitment or underwear manufacturing).

I have a mate who's passport ran out during lockdown and he says that he will not get another one until Scotland is independent as he is not British, he is Scottish. He is a Hearts fan and we have a few European games to play so we will see if he sticks to his guns but a passport is an important document to some people.

 

[Granny Danger]

7 hours ago, Antlion said:

I suppose it would be churlish to point out that unless Scotland somehow saws itself off from England at the border and engineers a tectonic shift that sees it float off into the North Sea, its people will always be British. Just because the UK has hijacked the term (presumably because UKish sounds rank) that doesn’t mean they own it. In fact, would people from the rUK have any more right to the term “British”?

After all, wouldn’t they have to rebrand (again) as the United Territories of the Former Kingdom of England, Principality of Wales, and Partition of Northern Ireland? Or even the United Territories of Southern Great Britain and Northern Ireland? (United Kingdom would be shafted as England would be the only kingdom, united not with another kingdom but with Wales and Northern Ireland. Maybe they’re so desperate to keep us to save on the admin - though you’d think the Tories would be dying to sell off rebranding responsibilities to their pals in pet food or recruitment or underwear manufacturing).

Surely the obvious rebrand would be ‘Little Britain’.  

[BukyOHare]

12 hours ago, John Lambies Doos said:

Ireland has no oil whatsoever and a far better standard of living and GDP per capita than the UK...
So please explain why we are too stupid to build a better, fairer, richer society?
As opposed to the romantic, patriotic bile.

The only person who mentioned stupid was you.

I take it the continued mentioned of oil reserves from the 2014 campaign are just to be forgotten about like it never happened?

Quite how people can be  convinced by anything a political party says in this day and age truly baffles me.

Still an undecided vote for me.

 

 

[strichener]

10 hours ago, Zern said:

Untrue. We wouldn't have to go to court to decide the legality of a referendum for one thing.

If we were in the EU, we couldn't hold a binding referendum on leaving the CAP or CFP.  

And whilst you mention courts, our judiciary would be subservient to the EU courts.

[strichener]

3 hours ago, GTG_03 said:

We could choose to leave anytime we wanted though...it would be up to us, and isn't that the whole point? 

No we couldn't, we could leave anytime the government of the day decided to allow us a vote on membership.  Not the same thing.

[Zern]

48 minutes ago, strichener said:

If we were in the EU, we couldn't hold a binding referendum on leaving the CAP or CFP.  

And whilst you mention courts, our judiciary would be subservient to the EU courts.

We absolutely could hold a binding referendum on whether to continue to uphold the CAP of CFP or any other obligation of membership, by having a vote on membership.

All our courts are subservient to international courts, what's your point?

You tried to make the UK and EU equivalent; they are not. You are ignoring the fact that EU membership is heavily codified and UK membership entry/exit conditions are extremely vague. The nearest we have is the GFA.

[strichener]

43 minutes ago, Zern said:

We absolutely could hold a binding referendum on whether to continue to uphold the CAP of CFP or any other obligation of membership, by having a vote on membership.

All our courts are subservient to international courts, what's your point?

You tried to make the UK and EU equivalent; they are not. You are ignoring the fact that EU membership is heavily codified and UK membership entry/exit conditions are extremely vague. The nearest we have is the GFA.

The only equivalence is that a smaller member is always going to be beholden to the wishes of larger members.

Which international courts are we subservient to?

 

[williemillersmoustache]

The ECHR, The ICC.

This subservience to courts stuff is totally bonkers. 

The very very very good reason that there should be an international body or court in place to protect rights and liberties not beholden to the state alone, is that often the body impinging upon these rights and liberties is the state. 

[Caledonian1]

17 hours ago, scottsdad said:

I was Yes last time. I will be yes again. 

On the poll above I accidentally clicked the yes to no option. 

Please arrange for assistance on the 19th October 2023 or get someone to vote for you by proxy

[Oystercatcher]

Yes.

[Duries Air Freshener]

5 hours ago, HeartsOfficialMoaner said:

I have a mate who's passport ran out during lockdown and he says that he will not get another one until Scotland is independent as he is not British, he is Scottish. He is a Hearts fan and we have a few European games to play so we will see if he sticks to his guns but a passport is an important document to some people.

 

Is this a joke?!

[Zern]

54 minutes ago, strichener said:

The only equivalence is that a smaller member is always going to be beholden to the wishes of larger members.

Which international courts are we subservient to?

 

ICJ, ICC, ECHR to name a few.

[Zern]

48 minutes ago, williemillersmoustache said:

The ECHR, The ICC.

This subservience to courts stuff is totally bonkers. 

The very very very good reason that there should be an international body or court in place to protect rights and liberties not beholden to the state alone, is that often the body impinging upon these rights and liberties is the state. 

Very silly stuff from @strichener 

The also EU cannot extinguish member states, the UK can dismiss the parliament of Scotland on a bloody whim.

[jamamafegan]

I have a mate who's passport ran out during lockdown and he says that he will not get another one until Scotland is independent as he is not British, he is Scottish. He is a Hearts fan and we have a few European games to play so we will see if he sticks to his guns but a passport is an important document to some people.
 

Not all heroes wear capes.

[G51]

depriving myself of a good time in order to have an even better time sticking two fingers up to the passport office

[BFTD]

TBF, f**k the passport office. They once told me that I'd need to have my name legally changed to "Dave" if I wanted a passport, as that was the name I put on the form and my prior passport was under the name "David".

Not at all irrationally bitter about that BTW, thank you very much for asking