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The years of discontent, 2022/23


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On 28/06/2022 at 14:08, Lofarl said:

Postman and CWU member.  Royal Mail have imposed a 2% pay rise. But will give us up to 5.5% with the following changes.

A reduction in payment allowances, so a pay cut 

Rotational Sunday working at normal pay rate.  No Sunday premium.

Moving the starting times up to 3 hours later.  So no more getting home for schools

Annualised hours, so in theory a shorter delivery in summer, but hours more in Xmas.  For the same money.  So a 5 hr day will pay the same as a 10.

Reduction in sick pay.

New starters earning a lower hourly rate, but more hours contracted

No cutting of duty regardless.  Have to clear everything they give you.  Cue 12 hour shifts in winter.  For the same money.

 

 

So naw.  A no strings pay rise please.

What a bunch of c***s. More and more companies want to do this sort of shit. It's simply naked greed. These pieces of shit just want to hoard all profits and are demanding more and more profits from workers whilst demaning those who make them the profits do more of it and receive less and less.

Hope you all tell them to get themselves so far to f**k.

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Just now, oaksoft said:

No because like everyone else, you're incapable of thinking more than 2 millimetres ahead of what's right in front of you.

9% pay rises means inflation will rise faster, taking interest rates with it.

Some of us have actually lived through this same scenario before.

You need to put down your 1st year university politics books and start considering how everything is inter-linked in the real world.

And I lived through the 60s, 70s and 80s too.

I never went to University. 

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17 minutes ago, virginton said:

There are plenty of ways to reduce fuel usage and make fewer journeys in total (see the number of fat slobs who don't walk the length of themselves) and also ways to reduce domestic consumption as well. That's part of how a high price response should work. 

I'm really not concerned if a two car household can no longer 'afford' to run their sprogs to school in some crap SUV.

Which is why those at the bottom of the income scale need to have it uplifted by inflation rates, absolutely. 

The UK is rammed with people in entirely middle-class jobs and income brackets who seem to think that they're in the bottom deciles and are entitled to this special protection though. 

i dont disagree on the last bit. 

5 minutes ago, oaksoft said:

IMO people on £25k a year are not the priority right now. None of them should be in a situation where they are facing starvation or freezing.

We have millions in the UK earning significantly under that who could well be facing those choices and the government should be helping keep them on an even keel and them alone.

Are you speaking for experience? £25k is not a huge salary and certainly below the UK average. The increase in fuel and energy will be causing people at that level some grief i would think. This is just me surmising as i cant say what they are going through because, fortunately, i am not in that position. 

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How many unions have came out and explicitly demanded an RPI wage rise?

Have any of them put a number on it following rejection of an offer?

Somewhat disingenuous, the number of arguments in here about people don't deserve 9% specifically, when no one actually knows what might be accepted by the workers in question...

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20 minutes ago, oaksoft said:

IMO people on £25k a year are not the priority right now. None of them should be in a situation where they are facing starvation or freezing.

We have millions in the UK earning significantly under that who could well be facing those choices and the government should be helping keep them on an even keel and them alone.

You've clearly lost touch with reality if you believe that to be the case. 

A single person with a modest mortgage would struggle on that salary under the current inflationary pressures.

And God help anyone trying to run a home and bring up a couple of kids.

Edited by Barney Rubble
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3 minutes ago, Barney Rubble said:

You've clearly lost touch with reality if you believe that to be the case. 

A single person with a modest mortgage would struggle on that salary under the current inflationary pressures.

And God help anyone trying to run a home and bring up a couple of kids.

If you're running a home with a couple of kids, you can in all likelihood double that salary though. 

And what do you define as a 'modest mortgage'? 

Edited by vikingTON
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1 minute ago, virginton said:

If you're running a home with a couple of kids, you can in all likelihood double that salary though. 

And what do you define as a 'modest mortgage'? 

I wouldn't be so sure about your first sentence VT.

A modest mortgage on a 25k salary would be 60k maximum.

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16 minutes ago, oaksoft said:

No because like everyone else, you're incapable of thinking more than 2 millimetres ahead of what's right in front of you.

9% pay rises means inflation will rise faster, taking interest rates with it.

Some of us have actually lived through this same scenario before.

You need to put down your 1st year university politics books and start considering how everything is inter-linked in the real world.

The seventies is instructive in another way.

We need to look after growth too. Stagflation is worse than inflation alone and can cause inflation to become embedded.

The seventies is only one case and it doesn’t follow that any wage rises will be inflationary. We have far less people working for state backed primary and secondary industries now so the impact of public sector pay on prices will be lower. NHS services for example aren’t paid for on a market and don’t affect price levels like coal and steel workers would have.

That’s not to say that we should be cavalier about the possibility of a spiral. But it’s not inevitable and it’s not the only bad outcome.

 

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3 minutes ago, Barney Rubble said:

I wouldn't be so sure about your first sentence VT.

Well there are going to be capable two wage-earners either way, in the vast majority of such households. Other than unpaid leave, there's no reason to expect that Person B couldn't go out and earn at a full-time median salary as well. 

Single parent families are unlikely to get even close to that £25k benchmark and so should absolutely be prioritised for support (as well as other households with dependents). 

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4 minutes ago, virginton said:

Well there are going to be capable two wage-earners either way, in the vast majority of such households. Other than unpaid leave, there's no reason to expect that Person B couldn't go out and earn at a full-time median salary as well. 

Single parent families are unlikely to get even close to that £25k benchmark and so should absolutely be prioritised for support (as well as other households with dependents). 

Your premise assumes that the kids are at school though.

How do you factor in those families with a couple of infants below school age? 

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6 hours ago, Bairnardo said:

The whole country needs to be ground to a full stop at some point. Strikes, motorway blockades etc just for that reason.

A very loud, stop taking the piss message.

f**k it lets have a general strike. There must be enough unions fighting atm to join up.

Also, you shouldn't avoid the Union because you disagree with their politics. Think of it ona purely local, workplace level.

If your workforce is collectivised but you are not a member, not only do you personally have no voice or seat at the table for anything that falls under the collective agreement, you also weaken the position of the collective meaning that you are likely to get less. Once your workplace is unionised, being a member us no less than common sense and should be unhitched from politics.

I think the biggest issue with my union is the apathy with returning votes from the members. We never seem to get to that magic number required for a mandate.

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Oaksoft back to "poverty doesn't exist" again, is it?  :lol:

He saved £30 on heating bills last year by being smarter than you, dontchano.

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7 minutes ago, mathematics said:

I think the biggest issue with my union is the apathy with returning votes from the members. We never seem to get to that magic number required for a mandate.

Aye. For it to be effective you really need stewards who are visible and who put in a decent bit of work to try and make sure the maximum benefit is gained for the workforce. Its easy to see why disillusionment can set in when the only Union comms you see are head office mailshots about Labour Party business or various causes that aren't your workplace.

 

 

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Oaksoft back to "poverty doesn't exist" again, is it?  [emoji38]
He saved £30 on heating bills last year by being smarter than you, dontchano.
Yip a downgraded room on holiday or cancel Netflix and it's sorted apparently. Unbelievably out of touch in the Ivory Oaky Towers.
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26 minutes ago, BFTD said:

Oaksoft back to "poverty doesn't exist" again, is it?  :lol:

He saved £30 on heating bills last year by being smarter than you, dontchano.

ExcludedUK relentless excluded GIF

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53 minutes ago, Barney Rubble said:

Your premise assumes that the kids are at school though.

How do you factor in those families with a couple of infants below school age? 

Families get paid pre-school childcare by the government and paid paternity leave rights as well. While I've already acknowledged unpaid leave to cover the gaps between those two schemes, there's no reason to think that a family with two parents are sitting on anywhere near £25k per year in household income.

It should not be the priority of the government to keep full-time maws in the house watching Loose Women and Judge Judy each day. 

Edited by vikingTON
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14 minutes ago, Bairnardo said:

I prefer it when he cross references conflicting posts from other threads, or deep in the P&B vault....

I need more staff.

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2 hours ago, DA Baracus said:

What a bunch of c***s. More and more companies want to do this sort of shit. It's simply naked greed. These pieces of shit just want to hoard all profits and are demanding more and more profits from workers whilst demaning those who make them the profits do more of it and receive less and less.

Hope you all tell them to get themselves so far to f**k.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/jun/29/royal-mail-managers-vote-strike-jobs-dispute-unite-union
 

 

That’s the local office managers voted to strike.  I’d have never thought I’d see the day when they would strike.

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2 hours ago, virginton said:

Well there are going to be capable two wage-earners either way, in the vast majority of such households. Other than unpaid leave, there's no reason to expect that Person B couldn't go out and earn at a full-time median salary as well.

 

Are you aware of how many families have some parents who can no longer work through disability or are on zero hours contracts? There are many families that have gone through illness, redundancy or divorce that magnifies the problem.

Not everyone has the skills or education to secure a full time median salary.

Out of interest do you have any kids yourself?

Many parents have to go back to work after paternity leave to make ends meet or keep their job and the nursery care fees are very expensive to say the least. When our kids were under two we were paying well in excess of our monthly mortgage on nursery fees.

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