Bing.McCrosby Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 3 minutes ago, Gordopolis said: Agree on all of this apart from the pelanties - half or more of his goals from the pelanty spot doesn't sound right at all. Off to check... Update: yeah, only 16 of his 222 career goals to date have been pens, with 4 or 5 a season thru those golden years of 2012-2016: https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/jordan-rhodes/elfmetertore/spieler/48950 Consider yourself *very* lucky not to get a red dot for getting Scotland wrong Thats still only 204 goals that weren't pens, pitiful. There was definitely a time where Rhodes was a fair shout and should have got his chance. As it turns out the way his career went he maybe was never good enough. Which is a shame, but you look at those early career season stats and anybody going to think "wow the boys got a chance" 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velo army Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 1 hour ago, Gordopolis said: Agree on all of this apart from the pelanties - half or more of his goals from the pelanty spot doesn't sound right at all. Off to check... Update: yeah, only 16 of his 222 career goals to date have been pens, with 4 or 5 a season thru those golden years of 2012-2016: https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/jordan-rhodes/elfmetertore/spieler/48950 Consider yourself *very* lucky not to get a red dot for getting Scotland wrong Mandela affect means I still reckon I'm right . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satoshi Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 7 hours ago, Binos said: Czech Republic Belgium Croatia Uruguay Including Portugal Denmark The list of countries that produce talent vs our pitiful output is extensive You really do like picking much bigger nations don't you? Not to mention the much larger nations we are doing better than of course. But by all means by embarrassed you don't control, I don't control what you post but still cringe like hell reading. Are you playing a part of a self hater or is it genuine? I don't even know what is sadder! 7 hours ago, Binos said: We used to produce these players and everyone marvelled at our output Now we create a few full backs, a few hard working midfielders No creative players, no goal scorers Things we used to be famed for How else can modern day youth development be described in this country than embarrassing Complete nonsense, we have an excellent record producing diminutive creative midfielders recently. The myth about Scotlands youth focusing on physical players have never been more stark given our actual output. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordopolis Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 Thats still only 204 goals that weren't pens, pitiful. There was definitely a time where Rhodes was a fair shout and should have got his chance. As it turns out the way his career went he maybe was never good enough. Which is a shame, but you look at those early career season stats and anybody going to think "wow the boys got a chance"Yeah he was superb for 4 or 5 seasons.Scored 40+ in League One, firing Huddersfield to promotion in the playoffs. At that stage you're hopeful but still thinking "aye but it's League One".But then he gets an £8m move to Blackburn - newly relegated from the EPL and a strong shout to go straight back up. He hits the ground running and scores 30 that season on the Championship, still aged only 22/23. At that point there was noise about EPL clubs swooping too. So it wasn't at all unreasonable to be getting excited about him in a Scotland context as our long awaited goalscorer.He sort of plateaued after that, spending the next 3 and a bit seasons in the Championship with Blackburn and netting 25 ish each year. Still easily Scotland contention level, but his style of play just didn't seem to sit well with Strachan. I do think we missed a trick during that spell in not utilising him more.Then it's hard to say exactly why he fell away so much after his Middlesbrough move. He's not suffered any major injuries AFAIK, and has never really had pace to lose. A career of two halves, you could say.Interestingly, Ross Stewart is following a similar trajectory as Rhodes after his 26 goals in League One (again netting in the playoffs). A bit less of a spectacular tally, and he doesn't look likely to jump to a top of the table club. Also he's 26, so hardly a youngster. Still, there's potential there. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFTD Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 The thing that annoyed me about Rhodes was that he didn't get a proper run in a Scotland shirt; hard to believe he managed to amass 14 caps in the end. Think he maybe only started about three games spread out, which seems a waste for someone in such goalscoring form, but I guess the manager felt we didn't have the players for him to do that in a Scotland shirt. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordopolis Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 2 hours ago, BFTD said: The thing that annoyed me about Rhodes was that he didn't get a proper run in a Scotland shirt; hard to believe he managed to amass 14 caps in the end. Think he maybe only started about three games spread out, which seems a waste for someone in such goalscoring form, but I guess the manager felt we didn't have the players for him to do that in a Scotland shirt. Yeah, basically that. Three starts is what I make it as well, and two of those were in friendlies at the tail end of Craig Levein's time and Billy Stark's caretaker game. interestingly, Rhodes scored his three international goals in those two games. His only competitive start was vs Serbia away, and to be fair, he - and the rest of the team - were utter gash that night. However, for a nation that has more often than not struggled to score goals, it felt awfy frustrating to persevere in every other game of Rhodes' era with Fletcher up front and for us to continue to labour to get goals, while Rhodes was sitting on the bench. To be clear: Fletcher is probably twice the player Rhodes is - much more of a team forward and more capable of playing with his back to goal etc. I get that. It's just that sometimes it's not about putting out the best 11 players. In that respect, I think Strachan could have been braver in his approach in certain games. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Binos Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 17 hours ago, Satoshi said: You really do like picking much bigger nations don't you? Not to mention the much larger nations we are doing better than of course. But by all means by embarrassed you don't control, I don't control what you post but still cringe like hell reading. Are you playing a part of a self hater or is it genuine? I don't even know what is sadder! Complete nonsense, we have an excellent record producing diminutive creative midfielders recently. The myth about Scotlands youth focusing on physical players have never been more stark given our actual output. Happy clapper 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Tunbridge Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 So do we think that is now Oli McBurnies international career completely done? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red23 Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 1 hour ago, Scotty Tunbridge said: So do we think that is now Oli McBurnies international career completely done? aye, replace him with Karlan Grant and i'm happy (provided he wants to play) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuttonDressedAsLahm Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 5 hours ago, Gordopolis said: Yeah, basically that. Three starts is what I make it as well, and two of those were in friendlies at the tail end of Craig Levein's time and Billy Stark's caretaker game. interestingly, Rhodes scored his three international goals in those two games. His only competitive start was vs Serbia away, and to be fair, he - and the rest of the team - were utter gash that night. However, for a nation that has more often than not struggled to score goals, it felt awfy frustrating to persevere in every other game of Rhodes' era with Fletcher up front and for us to continue to labour to get goals, while Rhodes was sitting on the bench. To be clear: Fletcher is probably twice the player Rhodes is - much more of a team forward and more capable of playing with his back to goal etc. I get that. It's just that sometimes it's not about putting out the best 11 players. In that respect, I think Strachan could have been braver in his approach in certain games. In fairness, we did have the situation of Fletcher also being out when he was by far our best striker of the time. Thanks, Levein. It does seem to be a particular Scottish trait where we somehow contrive not to play the one player who is an actual proven goalscorer. Oddly, this isn't a problem we're currently suffering from. Rhodes, Fletcher, Boyd, and Griffiths, have all returned remarkable numbers at club level at times in a 15-year period, and seemed either to barely play, or are only given a chance when their performances/ability is on the slide. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eez-eh Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 Fletcher was dropped for thinking he could just turn up to squads whenever he fancied it. It was annoying it dragged on for so long but the manager needs to command some level of respect, and you don’t get that by letting players walk all over you. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordopolis Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 In fairness, we did have the situation of Fletcher also being out when he was by far our best striker of the time. Thanks, Levein. It does seem to be a particular Scottish trait where we somehow contrive not to play the one player who is an actual proven goalscorer. Oddly, this isn't a problem we're currently suffering from. Rhodes, Fletcher, Boyd, and Griffiths, have all returned remarkable numbers at club level at times in a 15-year period, and seemed either to barely play, or are only given a chance when their performances/ability is on the slide.I wouldn't say Fletcher's club numbers were remarkable. 10-12 EPL goals for a season or two is solid and respectable, but doesn't scream. "goal machine". Then again there is a reason that he played in the top flight while Boyd, Griffith's and Rhodes (excepting 2 or 3 run outs at 'Boro) never did. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eez-eh Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 Funnily enough Kenny Miller also threw the toys out the pram under Levein by leaking the 4-6-0 team to the papers because he was pissed off at not starting, although there were no consequences to that as far as I remember. The Burley and Levein “eras” had plenty of players spitting the dummy out, particularly strikers. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigkillie Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 Miller always leaked the teams but there was never an issue with him not turning up the way there was with others. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bing.McCrosby Posted June 24, 2022 Share Posted June 24, 2022 10 hours ago, craigkillie said: Miller always leaked the teams but there was never an issue with him not turning up the way there was with others. 2 wrongs don't make a right, he shouldn't have been doing that either 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Saintsible Posted June 24, 2022 Share Posted June 24, 2022 17 hours ago, eez-eh said: Funnily enough Kenny Miller also threw the toys out the pram under Levein by leaking the 4-6-0 team to the papers because he was pissed off at not starting, although there were no consequences to that as far as I remember. The Burley and Levein “eras” had plenty of players spitting the dummy out, particularly strikers. The 4-6-0 is a bit of a myth Scotland lined up that night with Naismith and Mackie as wide forwards and Dorrans as a false 9 Its a formation that is widely used now and was used much of last season by Man City 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Saintsible Posted June 24, 2022 Share Posted June 24, 2022 (edited) 19 hours ago, Gordopolis said: I wouldn't say Fletcher's club numbers were remarkable. 10-12 EPL goals for a season or two is solid and respectable, but doesn't scream. "goal machine". Richarlison has averaged 9.6 league goals per season in the EPL Edited June 24, 2022 by Captain Saintsible 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bing.McCrosby Posted June 24, 2022 Share Posted June 24, 2022 1 hour ago, Captain Saintsible said: The 4-6-0 is a bit of a myth Scotland lined up that night with Naismith and Mackie as wide forwards and Dorrans as a false 9 Its a formation that is widely used now and was used much of last season by Man City Indeed, its actually rumoured that Guardiola has based his football philosophy and tactics after that game. So blown away he was with the forward thinking tactics and silky football. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordopolis Posted June 24, 2022 Share Posted June 24, 2022 Richarlison has averaged 9.6 league goals per season in the EPL Genuinely: what's your point? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Saintsible Posted June 24, 2022 Share Posted June 24, 2022 1 hour ago, Gordopolis said: 2 hours ago, Captain Saintsible said: Richarlison has averaged 9.6 league goals per season in the EPL Genuinely: what's your point? I’m comparing the goal scoring record of a Copa America winning striker valued at £50 million and has 14 goals in 36 appearances with Brazil with a striker whose goal scoring record you wouldn’t say is impressive 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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