The Big Queen's Park FC Thread

[williebraveheart]

20 minutes ago, Tangled web said:

I get it. Money was spent, time was used. Someone made a mistake, we're out of the cup. If it had been player error would you be calling for resignation? If the individual is indeed a volunteer are you going to volunteer to replace them? I'm sure they feel bad enough without a crowd at the door with torches and pitchforks. We can move on now or move on later. I'm choosing to move on now.

With respect, I don't think you do get it. Queens Park is a business with significant turnover and club secretary or whatever should not be a volunteer. It is a very responsible position within a business. That person, friendly volunteer or not, should be moved on and replaced with a responsible salaried appointment with a professional attitude. The damage caused is significant. Player error is irrelevant in this situation.

[annan4eva]

1 hour ago, williebraveheart said:

I think they do. That was gross misconduct was it not? It was not just a simple error. It has cost the club thousands of pounds, not to mention the cost and disappointment to fans and potential affect on the players.  Is that OK in your book?

There is no doubt you are correct. Someone is being payed handsomely I suggest to take care these things ? 

[spiders4ever]

8 minutes ago, williebraveheart said:

With respect, I don't think you do get it. Queens Park is a business with significant turnover and club secretary or whatever should not be a volunteer. It is a very responsible position within a business. That person, friendly volunteer or not, should be moved on and replaced with a responsible salaried appointment with a professional attitude. The damage caused is significant. Player error is irrelevant in this situation.

Really? Volunteer or salaried person is irrelevant. We don't know how the mistake was made or by whom yet some of you want a particular person's head.

 

[an86]

Just now, spiders4ever said:

Really? Volunteer or salaried person is irrelevant.

It really, really isn’t. If one of the key functions of a professional football club is being carried out by a volunteer then that is most certainly extremely relevant. I don’t know whether that is the case or not, which I think says everything about where we are as a club. Nobody really knows what the structure is.

[spiders4ever]

5 minutes ago, an86 said:

It really, really isn’t. If one of the key functions of a professional football club is being carried out by a volunteer then that is most certainly extremely relevant. I don’t know whether that is the case or not, which I think says everything about where we are as a club. Nobody really knows what the structure is.

Paying someone doesn't make them more reliable. It's the individual and their qualities that's important not whether or how much they're paid.

[Tangled web]

14 minutes ago, williebraveheart said:

With respect, I don't think you do get it. Queens Park is a business with significant turnover and club secretary or whatever should not be a volunteer. It is a very responsible position within a business. That person, friendly volunteer or not, should be moved on and replaced with a responsible salaried appointment with a professional attitude. The damage caused is significant. Player error is irrelevant in this situation.

Queens park is a 'business' with a committee and members. The CEO is not perhaps a CEO in the traditional sense. Maybe Ms Dempster would welcome more salaried employees as it would increase her control and influence. After all what CEO would want to be accountable to a committee? Maybe the directors should draw salaries too? 

[an86]

7 minutes ago, spiders4ever said:

Paying someone doesn't make them more reliable. It's the individual and their qualities that's important not whether or how much they're paid.

I hate to keep repeating myself, but we are a professional football club. Professional football clubs appoint professional people with specific skill sets to carry out specific roles.

We have to set professional standards. Do you think Celtic, Rangers, Hearts or Hibs would have a volunteer in the office dealing with their transfer activity and registrations? 

[Tangled web]

8 minutes ago, an86 said:

I hate to keep repeating myself, but we are a professional football club. Professional football clubs appoint professional people with specific skill sets to carry out specific roles.

We have to set professional standards. Do you think Celtic, Rangers, Hearts or Hibs would have a volunteer in the office dealing with their transfer activity and registrations? 

You are comparing Queens park to Celtic, Rangers, Hibs and Hearts. Interesting. Where do you stand on the Gretna comparison?

[spiders4ever]

3 minutes ago, an86 said:

I hate to keep repeating myself, but we are a professional football club. Professional football clubs appoint professional people with specific skill sets to carry out specific roles.

We have to set professional standards. Do you think Celtic, Rangers, Hearts or Hibs would have a volunteer in the office dealing with their transfer activity and registrations? 

We have professionals running the rebuild of Lesser and that seems to have been an unmitigated disaster.  This discussion is a bit like saying that unless you pay for something through the nose it won't be worth it. What is important is what skills and experience someone brings to the job not whether they are paid.  Fred the Shred was paid millions but still managed to destroy RBS. 

 

 

[an86]

8 minutes ago, Tangled web said:

You are comparing Queens park to Celtic, Rangers, Hibs and Hearts. Interesting. Where do you stand on the Gretna comparison?

I may have huge reservations about her performance, but we literally recruited Chief Executive and Head of Foundation from one the biggest clubs in the country. It’s self-evident that we are trying to compete with top clubs off the pitch. 

7 minutes ago, spiders4ever said:

We have professionals running the rebuild of Lesser and that seems to have been an unmitigated disaster.  This discussion is a bit like saying that unless you pay for something through the nose it won't be worth it. What is important is what skills and experience someone brings to the job not whether they are paid.  Fred the Shred was paid millions but still managed to destroy RBS. 

 

 

The problems at Lesser Hampden pre-date Leeann Dempster. It would be an understatement to say that she has managed it badly, but the root cause all goes back to awarding the contract to an organisation with no experience of building a stadium. 
 

If you were setting a recruitment criteria for the role, the first thing you’d put in the job description would be desirable experience in a full-time professional football environment. No brainer stuff. We may well have done that, but I don’t have any recollection of such a role being advertised.

[Grumpy Soo-sider]

50 minutes ago, Tangled web said:

Queens park is a 'business' with a committee and members. The CEO is not perhaps a CEO in the traditional sense. Maybe Ms Dempster would welcome more salaried employees as it would increase her control and influence. After all what CEO would want to be accountable to a committee? Maybe the directors should draw salaries too? 

It might be useful to view the committee as non-executive directors rather than the traditional committee that we had in the past. However we view them, they need to up their game. The aspect that most concerns me are the communications with the fans, season ticket holders and members. We are generally kept in the dark - even the "we will talk to the supporters association" from the last statement seems to have disappeared into the black hole. Members used to get regular email updates from the club and it would be useful if these were reinstated - but to all registered fans and followers (by 'registered' I mean via email to get on a circulation list).

[Spider Rico]

A failure of internal control and governance that has had hugely significant financial and sporting consequences and some people are actually advocating that we simply “move on”? 

 

[Spider Rico]

Professionalising the admin/back office was one of the first commitments made by Leeann Dempster. 

[Bring Your Own Socks]

5 hours ago, QPoriginal said:

Scottish Cup 

is the case on this now closed?  Club missing next round bonus(at least), gate money. Players missing chance of win bonus plus cup upset. Supporters out of pocket, taken time off work? The full embarrassment of this.

Is this not the second time a substantial mistake has been made (team lines Cowdenbeath) .

while the individual involved is an unpaid volunteer, there has to be accountability for a second major error. I would have thought at least resignation from Committee and role has to come. The Club must now look to employ or include this in a current paid job description.

I doubt if anyone on here can say with certainty the individual is unpaid. That was the case in the Cowden incident. After the recent AGM, it’s not clear where money’s going to, or getting used for, at all. When the treasurer can’t properly explain where the claim settlement is accounted for, anything can happen.

[Bring Your Own Socks]

Interesting debate. Wonder if this would gave happened if Christine was still in her job?

[an86]

1 minute ago, Bring Your Own Socks said:

Interesting debate. Wonder if this would gave happened if Christine was still in her job?

Happened when she was here before tbf. Still doesn’t excuse it happening now, particularly given that we’re full-time pro. Procedures should be more robust in every area. 

[Tangled web]

2 hours ago, Spider Rico said:

A failure of internal control and governance that has had hugely significant financial and sporting consequences and some people are actually advocating that we simply “move on”? 

 

Ok I'll bite  I am intrigued as to what not moving on looks like. Is action being taken? Are banners being made? What happens now? 

[Bring Your Own Socks]

From the official SFA YouTube channel. All the “goals” from the SC round 4. Including the game that never happened.

They hate us, don’t they

 

[Anonymous Spider]

1 hour ago, Tangled web said:

Ok I'll bite  I am intrigued as to what not moving on looks like. Is action being taken? Are banners being made? What happens now? 

As things stand do you have any confidence that something like this won’t happen again? I don’t.

It would be mad to ‘move on’ without some assurances that we’re taking steps to make sure this never happens again - be that people, support or processes.

This isn’t a witch-hunt,  there’s a bigger point here. This episode is symptomatic of the off-field chaos at the moment. Something has to change. 
 

 

Edited February 6, 2023 by Anonymous Spider

[Zen Archer (Raconteur)]

Spokesman found to take responsibility.