Satoshi Posted August 10, 2022 Share Posted August 10, 2022 So Man Utd were more successful in the past than they are? Good god! Who knew? And Fletcher and McTominay aren't exactly the same player? Please, someone stop the revelations. The point was that both suffered unfair criticism during their playing careers, and both look like rising above it and making plenty of appearances regardless. There are countless examples of players idiot fans don't rate but managers do. Everton fans used to insist Phil Neville was a pub team player as he made 242 Premier League appearances. Fans clearly have blind spots towards certain players. There was a pretty good McFred article on the Athletic, not saying they are both horrifically bad players, but rather that they are players with certain qualities who don't necessarily work well together and in this Man Utd side (but points out they definitely did work together very well during the closed door games). That's a balanced analysis, not trying to insist two experienced internationals with loads of top level appearances have suddenly become terrible players. If Varane didn't have such a great pedigree he would probably be getting the same treatment. Man Utd have never seriously looked to sell McTominay, he's clearly rated in the club and by every manager he has ever had. I know some people hate it, but it's a fact. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Derry Posted August 10, 2022 Share Posted August 10, 2022 Man Utd will never be taken seriously as long as shite like Shaw, Maguire, Rashford and Fred get a game. I love it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthernLights Posted August 10, 2022 Share Posted August 10, 2022 (edited) Edited August 10, 2022 by NorthernLights 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derry Alli Posted August 10, 2022 Share Posted August 10, 2022 1 hour ago, NorthernLights said: They only uploaded that because he's not English. If Harry Maguire done that we'd never have seen it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bairnardo Posted August 10, 2022 Share Posted August 10, 2022 1 minute ago, Mr. Alli said: They only uploaded that because he's not English. If Harry Maguire done that we'd never have seen it. Tbf, only an absolute fucking moron* would care if a player can do good keepy uppys. *So guaranteed to go viral in the world of #Barclays then 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loominous Posted August 10, 2022 Share Posted August 10, 2022 The moment professional football coaches and managers start listening to fan and media opinions regarding team selection is the time to start worrying. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrewDon Posted August 10, 2022 Share Posted August 10, 2022 On 09/08/2022 at 16:55, Salvo Montalbano said: that Man Utd fan (Goldbridge, Goldberg?) Show some damn respect. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bairnardo Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 Just catching up on the De Jong to Chelsea rumours. Tremendous bantering of United if he goes to another #Barclays franchise having spent the whole summer desperately begging him to come. Will also give Ten Hag serious alarm bells that they were so unable to land his main target. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonksy+HisChristianParade Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 On 10/08/2022 at 06:01, Mr. Alli said: Trying to compare Fletcher and McTominay. Fletcher had a role and executed it very well, he was ridiculed at the beginning because he wasn't doing as such. Much the same as Ji Sung Park was. It wasnt because he wasn't English either. McTominay is being ridiculed - quite rightly - because he's trying to do more than the sum of his parts. There's no reason he can't stay at United as back up if he learns discipline and the fact that he just isn't as good technically as those around him. This is spot on. Fletcher excelled in a certain role in that Man United era, and he played alongside midfielders of genuine quality like Scholes, Carrick & Keane. The teams were well balanced, rock solid at the back/keeper (Vidic/Ferdinand) & had excellent players like Tevez, Rooney, Ronaldo & Berbatov going forward. McTominay would probably be adequate in a similar role, however he gets to play alongside Fred, Fernandes, pensioner Ronaldo, Maguire, Lindelof etc. The drop in standard from the players above is laughable. So he looks a bit rubbish as he’s not got the quality to play the way he’s trying to/being asked to. As long as I’ve watched Man United, they’ve have always had youth academy graduates who were fairly average but were good squad players and played a bunch of games - many of whom eventually found their level at lesser clubs. Darren Fletcher, John O’Shea, Jonny Evans, Wes Brown, Phil Neville, Tom Cleverley, Danny Welbeck, Jesse Lingard etc etc all did to a greater or lesser extent. Also laughable that Satoshi highlighted about ten players who ‘play for the big six’ in an earlier post. About two of them actually started at the weekend. Naming the likes of Winks is ridiculous given he doesn’t get a game. McTominay wouldn’t get a regular game for any of Spurs, Arsenal, Man City, Liverpool or Chelsea. That’s an issue. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheScarf Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 4 minutes ago, Bonksy+HisChristianParade said: This is spot on. Fletcher excelled in a certain role in that Man United era, and he played alongside midfielders of genuine quality like Scholes, Carrick & Keane. The teams were well balanced, rock solid at the back/keeper (Vidic/Ferdinand) & had excellent players like Tevez, Rooney, Ronaldo & Berbatov going forward. McTominay would probably be adequate in a similar role, however he gets to play alongside Fred, Fernandes, pensioner Ronaldo, Maguire, Lindelof etc. The drop in standard from the players above is laughable. So he looks a bit rubbish as he’s not got the quality to play the way he’s trying to/being asked to. As long as I’ve watched Man United, they’ve have always had youth academy graduates who were fairly average but were good squad players and played a bunch of games - many of whom eventually found their level at lesser clubs. Darren Fletcher, John O’Shea, Jonny Evans, Wes Brown, Phil Neville, Tom Cleverley, Danny Welbeck, Jesse Lingard etc etc all did to a greater or lesser extent. Also laughable that Satoshi highlighted about ten players who ‘play for the big six’ in an earlier post. About two of them actually started at the weekend. Naming the likes of Winks is ridiculous given he doesn’t get a game. McTominay wouldn’t get a regular game for any of Spurs, Arsenal, Man City, Liverpool or Chelsea. That’s an issue. Yeah, people never mention the utter shite McTominay plays with when comparing him to Fletcher. Fletcher played in one of the best English sides of all time (06-09, that era squad was fucking ridiculous). It doesn't suit their argument. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Angelo Barksdale Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 Fletcher was a better player than McTominay, but if you swapped the 2 around it probably wouldn't make any difference to the amount of success either of their teams achieved. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satoshi Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 On 09/08/2022 at 16:03, Bonksy+HisChristianParade said: Yeah, because no one ever criticises Harry Maguire. McTominay and Fred are mince. By far the worst midfield of any of the ‘big six’. On 09/08/2022 at 19:46, Bonksy+HisChristianParade said: I mean, he’s been a part of the worst United era of my lifetime. He wouldn’t get a game for any of the other big six and when he’s punted from United he won’t sign for any of them. He’ll get picked up by a lower half team - could see the likes of Everton signing him. I'm hardly talking about youth players, every player mentioned has made plenty of appearances for the 'top six' (and is still in the squad) or was just signed and is starting. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonksy+HisChristianParade Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 8 minutes ago, Satoshi said: I'm hardly talking about youth players, every player mentioned has made plenty of appearances for the 'top six' (and is still in the squad) or was just signed and is starting. It is the worst midfield out of all of them by a considerable distance, I’m not sure why you’re trying to argue that. Most of the players you named are either not guaranteed starters or are due to be punted/weren’t even in Saturday’s squad (Winks, Ndombele, Lo Celso). And you’re trying to compare them to nailed on starters for Man U for some reason. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewing Taffies Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 (edited) 20 minutes ago, Bonksy+HisChristianParade said: It is the worst midfield out of all of them by a considerable distance, I’m not sure why you’re trying to argue that. Most of the players you named are either not guaranteed starters or are due to be punted/weren’t even in Saturday’s squad (Winks, Ndombele, Lo Celso). And you’re trying to compare them to nailed on starters for Man U for some reason. Exactly this. Those players mentioned have all been deemed not good enough for Spurs. A Spurs team who finished 13 points ahead of Man Utd. McTominay would not be a starter for any of the teams that finished top 5 last season. Edited August 11, 2022 by Chewing Taffies 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satoshi Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 (edited) 27 minutes ago, Bonksy+HisChristianParade said: It is the worst midfield out of all of them by a considerable distance, I’m not sure why you’re trying to argue that. Most of the players you named are either not guaranteed starters or are due to be punted/weren’t even in Saturday’s squad (Winks, Ndombele, Lo Celso). And you’re trying to compare them to nailed on starters for Man U for some reason. Two of the three were big money signings, and will be on far higher wages than McTominay. You can add Keita and Henderson to the list - the latter who was getting hounded around McTominays age and almost sold to Fulham. Sometimes good players don't work at a team for whatever reason. McFred was the partnership when Man Utd finished second. To suddenly paint them as awful players is wrong, they are playing in a dysfunctional team and every player is struggling (including the far higher profile ones getting paid 3x as much). Would Varane start for any of the other top six in your view? On his Man Utd form probably not, but there's equally no doubt he is about 5x as good as Eric Dier or Ben White will ever be. Edited August 11, 2022 by Satoshi 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewing Taffies Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 12 minutes ago, Satoshi said: Two of the three were big money signings, and will be on far higher wages than McTominay. Yes and then they got a decent manager who has binned them. That's why they finished top 4. McTominay continues to play and Man Utd are getting worse. You seem to be missing the point entirely. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bully Wee Villa Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 Bournemouth 33/1 to win at Man City on Saturday. Has any Premier League side been longer odds? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satoshi Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 25 minutes ago, Chewing Taffies said: Yes and then they got a decent manager who has binned them. That's why they finished top 4. McTominay continues to play and Man Utd are getting worse. You seem to be missing the point entirely. He was a regular when Man Utd finished second. Mourinho created the managers player of the year for him. He plays in a dysfunctional team where nobody is performing. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewing Taffies Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Satoshi said: He plays in a dysfunctional team where nobody is performing. So none of it is his fault? Did you actually watch the game on Sunday? Do you genuinely believe he would be a starter for a top 4 team this season? Edited August 11, 2022 by Chewing Taffies 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSaints1877 Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 36 minutes ago, Chewing Taffies said: Yes and then they got a decent manager who has binned them. That's why they finished top 4. McTominay continues to play and Man Utd are getting worse. You seem to be missing the point entirely. McTominay can’t even get a starting slot in the Scotland midfield. Fletcher was a first pick for Scotland when fit. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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