Melanius Mullarkey Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 What other Orange things can we ban? Dundee Utd? Kumquats? Charlottes Locks by Farrow and Ball? All horrible b*****ds IMO. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
10menwent2mow Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 (edited) They used to irritate the hell out of me when I lived in Glasgow, but the same went for the Republican mob and that was only because they woke me a few times when I had a raging hangover. It was always the hangers on in the Rangers/Celtic tops that were the most bizarre though. They seem to be allocated disproportionate resources and to be fair, privileges for the number of folk taking part. If any other group of a couple of hundred folk went to Glasgow City Council wanting roads closed and the number of police required to pass these things off safely, I'd suggest that would be a no. ETA - we could send them to Stonehaven on Hogmanay, get them to walk alongside the folk that march there that night. Edited March 28, 2022 by 10menwent2mow 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hk blues Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 7 minutes ago, Melanius Mullarkay said: What other Orange things can we ban? Dundee Utd? Kumquats? Charlottes Locks by Farrow and Ball? All horrible b*****ds IMO. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteRoseKillie Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 12 hours ago, Busta Nut said: Why do they get so pissed off when you cross the road in the 20 yard gaps between their wee squads? Because focus-free anger and resentment of anyone who is "no' wan ae us" is their default setting. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteRoseKillie Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 11 hours ago, Glen Sannox said: They give Protestants a bad name. You never see marches in North Berwick or Gifford. These walks are always in some Godless, post industrial, dystopian wasteland, attended by chavs in Sevco tops. The lowest of the low. Utter detritus. .. yet I'll guarantee they hold almost identical political and social views to, er, you. Minter, indeed. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross. Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 11 minutes ago, 10menwent2mow said: It was always the hangers on in the Rangers/Celtic tops that were the most bizarre though. I think the rest of the country need to stop accepting the "Hangers on" excuse. If they are there to enjoy or support the walk, they are part of it and the organisers need to accept that. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monthefife Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 I wish I could just say "Yes, ban these bigoted, hate-fests once and for all", but the more I think about it, the more I believe that banning them is exactly what the Orange Order imbeciles would love to happen, and that it would be playing right into their hands, thus making things worse. It would only put them further in the spotlight and they'll be crying out as if they're victims of being silenced/erased etc. I don't know what the right approach is to this issue. I'd have hoped that education and early intervention in schools (particularly in the Central/West of Scotland areas) would be a starting point, but ideology is passed down from family generation to generation and a "sense of belonging" trumps all of that. Having state-funded denominational (faith) schools is of no help either. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melanius Mullarkey Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 12 minutes ago, hk blues said: Chris Evans as well. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
10menwent2mow Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 3 minutes ago, Ross. said: I think the rest of the country need to stop accepting the "Hangers on" excuse. If they are there to enjoy or support the walk, they are part of it and the organisers need to accept that. It's bizarre though. Like, I get standing at the side of the road during a marathon for example, because you are offering your support to folk trying to accomplish something. Standing at the side of the road wearing a football top for a few folk walking down the road dressed a bit funny and playing a few tunes (this applies to both sides) is just downright odd. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross. Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 1 minute ago, 10menwent2mow said: It's bizarre though. Like, I get standing at the side of the road during a marathon for example, because you are offering your support to folk trying to accomplish something. Standing at the side of the road wearing a football top for a few folk walking down the road dressed a bit funny and playing a few tunes (this applies to both sides) is just downright odd. It is odd when framed like that, but the reality is, in Scotland at least, many(if not most) of them are not there to support the bands, they are there to show those uppity kafflicks* that they are still the people and this is their reminder. *Other flavours of protagonist are available. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 (edited) I think they should close a multi story car park like the SEC on July 12th every year, and let them have a grand old time marching round and round and up and down without bothering anyone. The acoustics would be amazing. Edited March 28, 2022 by welshbairn 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velo army Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 I definitely get all sorts of raging when the OO marches (being a bead rattler from Lanarkshire), but rationally I can't countenance banning it completely. I imagine any legislation the government brought in to do so would also affect marches for causes I concord with. Seeing their wee faces if it got banned would be fucking delicious though. I do however see no reason that they can't be restricted to one day. There is no cause I can think of that has marches going on for a whole fucking month and beyond. The reason for these things has been stated before; chauvinistic triumphalism and intimidation. I would love to see it no more. Marching past catholic churches should be banned, as should walking through the city centre. They're not protesting anything, so there's no reason for mass disruption (pun unintended, but grimly close to my own experiences of this shite). They need to sort out their fucking music as well. I would have some tiny piece of sympathy for this pish if they marched along to some jaunty J.P. Sousa American style marching band music. The fact that it's just piccolos and drums, with no attempt at fucking harmony, descant or some kind of walking bass line (f**k me, just bring in a bass flute and some c**t who can arpeggiate for f**k sake) is utterly abhorrent. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat(The most tip top) Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 11 hours ago, Glen Sannox said: They give Protestants a bad name. You never see marches in North Berwick or Gifford. These walks are always in some Godless, post industrial, dystopian wasteland, attended by chavs in Sevco tops. The lowest of the low. Utter detritus. For all the arguments about pride/triumphalism, hatred/celebration of identity it's easier, from a safe distance, to see this phenomenon as a manifestation of desperate insecurity and fear from people who are left behind. Maybe once it was a display of power and dominance but now it's just a pathetic cry for attention from people who have nothing going for them and feel, correctly, that they're being left behind The outrage being expressed at their existence, when it's not coming from Roman Catholic bigots, is invariably tinged with a rather unpleasant snobbishness that doesn't read back well. As is illustrated particularly well by this example ... 2 hours ago, Day of the Lords said: Nah, as you said yourself they are an absolute underclass, indeed I'd go as far as a subspecies. Of course I'm a hypocrite While Intellectually I will maintain that these people are to be pitied rather than hated it's a lot easier for me in practice to be principled in urban, cosmopolitan, 21st century, central Edinburgh than if I was stuck out in some godforsaken backwards arsehole of a place in Inverclyde. In fact that last sentence wasn't too different to the snobbishness I was criticising earlier, although at least I've got some level of self awareness about it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 17 hours ago, Granny Danger said: Any attempt to ban them or apply conditions relating to charging for policing would open the door to banning or further restricting legitimate protests. Can you explain what "legitimate protest" the Orange Order are carrying out with these marches? It's a celebration for them, not a protest. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat(The most tip top) Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 (edited) 32 minutes ago, velo army said: I definitely get all sorts of raging when the OO marches (being a bead rattler from Lanarkshire), but rationally I can't countenance banning it completely. I imagine any legislation the government brought in to do so would also affect marches for causes I concord with. Seeing their wee faces if it got banned would be fucking delicious though. I do however see no reason that they can't be restricted to one day. There is no cause I can think of that has marches going on for a whole fucking month and beyond. The reason for these things has been stated before; chauvinistic triumphalism and intimidation. I would love to see it no more. Marching past catholic churches should be banned, as should walking through the city centre. They're not protesting anything, so there's no reason for mass disruption (pun unintended, but grimly close to my own experiences of this shite). They need to sort out their fucking music as well. I would have some tiny piece of sympathy for this pish if they marched along to some jaunty J.P. Sousa American style marching band music. The fact that it's just piccolos and drums, with no attempt at fucking harmony, descant or some kind of walking bass line (f**k me, just bring in a bass flute and some c**t who can arpeggiate for f**k sake) is utterly abhorrent. So you seem to be moving in the direction of licensing marches based on musical competence Which would serve to provoke Edinburgh's Norwegian community and they might take another crack at taking Largs Edited March 28, 2022 by topcat(The most tip top) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hk blues Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 44 minutes ago, Melanius Mullarkay said: Chris Evans as well. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velo army Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 1 minute ago, topcat(The most tip top) said: For all the arguments about pride/triumphalism, hatred/celebration of identity it's easier, from a safe distance, to see this phenomenon as a manifestation of desperate insecurity and fear from people who are left behind. Maybe once it was a display of power and dominance but now it's just a pathetic cry for attention from people who have nothing going for them and feel, correctly, that they're being left behind The outrage being expressed at their existence, when it's not coming from Roman Catholic bigots, is invariably tinged with a rather unpleasant snobbishness that doesn't read back well. As is illustrated particularly well by this example ... Of course I'm a hypocrite While Intellectually I will maintain that these people are to be pitied rather than hated it's a lot easier for me in practice to be principled in urban, cosmopolitan, 21st century, central Edinburgh than if I was stuck out in some godforsaken backwards arsehole of a place in Inverclyde. In fact that last sentence wasn't too different to the snobbishness I was criticising earlier, although at least I've got some level of self awareness about it. Good post. My reaction against it is visceral because their marches were seen in our community as a display of power and intimidation. We would go to mass in July and if we heard a lambeg drum in the near distance there would be a palpable tension amongst the congregation. There were reports of nearby churches having bricks thrown through windows by "hangers on" or of the same subset urinating on the walls of churches while singing songs about "****** blood" and other such behaviours, so we knew what we could be in for. I believe that creating fear is the point of it. I also know that I don't have any objectivity when it comes to this issue, and your post is a good reminder to have compassion for the "enemy". It is what that snowflake hippy from palestine taught us after all . As Chaplin said "only the unloved hate" and it's true. These people who go on marches don't look loved and cared for. They look angry as if they're making a collective fist to the world. It also reminds me of something MLK said about Jim Crow, that it was "psychological food" for poor white people who, while being poor were still made to feel superior to blacks. It would also give the inchoate anger of poor white people a direction and focus, even while that focus should have been to those who caused their poverty. In the case of the OO marchers it's fear as a substitute for love. It's also a counterfeit form of belonging. Brene Brown calls it "common enemy intimacy", where our connection is based on hating the same people. I don't feel comfortable with the snobbish language of "scum" and especially "underclass" to describe these people, as it feels like the users of this language are using this specific behaviour as an excuse to punch down under the guise of a moral crusade. I will take exception to your use of "roman catholic bigots" as that seems highly dismissive of those who are often the direct targets of these marches. Catholics, in my experience, are just people who congregate under a particular roof, sing songs, repeat prayers (often mindlessly tbf) and, in my experience, foster a sense of community. It's the same for all religions tbh. CoS, Episcopalians, Methodists, Muslims, Jews etc etc do exactly the same. I never met a single catholic who had a problem with protestants, nor a protestant who had an issue with catholics. There was always a mutual recognition that we were all worshipping the same fella, but that the proddies tended to get a bit more dressed up when they did so. Catholics are expressing outrage as they have been on the receiving end of this "celebration of culture" for centuries. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velo army Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 8 minutes ago, topcat(The most tip top) said: So you seem to be moving in the direction of licensing marches based on musical competence Which would serve to provoke Edinburgh's Norwegian community and they might take another crack at taking Largs This is exactly what I would want the OO to do (if I don't get my first wish of them all self combusting). This is great. The trumpet is a wee bit flat, but that's a minor gripe, and doesn't diminish the overall musicality (). More of this please. I love a brass band. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101 Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 1 hour ago, Melanius Mullarkay said: What other Orange things can we ban? Dundee Utd? Kumquats? Charlottes Locks by Farrow and Ball? All horrible b*****ds IMO. Add Essex into the list please. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melanius Mullarkey Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 1 minute ago, 101 said: Add Essex into the list please. Good point. Wee Donny T as well. Things really stacking up for anything Orange related tbh, 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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