Cost of Living Crisis

[Granny Danger]

38 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

A lot of people would welcome a fall in house prices.

Yeah I’m sure Tory voters are organising street parties as I type this.

[welshbairn]

11 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

Yeah I’m sure Tory voters are organising street parties as I type this.

I was thinking more of the current generation of 20 somethings.

[Todd_is_God]

22 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

I was thinking more of the current generation of 20 somethings.

Wrong as usual, of course

[DeeTillEhDeh]

The idea that inflation caused by high fuel/ energy prices,foodstuffs etc can be controlled by increasing interest rates is absurd.

They'd have more success if they decoupled electricity from gas pricing.

The energy market has been manipulated for far too long.

[Dawson Park Boy]

5 minutes ago, DeeTillEhDeh said:

They'd have more success if they decoupled electricity from gas pricing.

The energy market has been manipulated for far too long.

Yes, but why can’t they?

Have any other countries managed this?

All seems strange to me.

[Todd_is_God]

1 hour ago, Dawson Park Boy said:

Yes, but why can’t they?

Have any other countries managed this?

All seems strange to me.

Presumably because renewable energy producing contracts would have been signed which ties the price for the energy they produce to the merit order.

[Bedford White]

 

Get this bald beauty in. He will sort it out. Tax the rich b*****ds.

[Granny Danger]

Not a new stat, but a thoroughly sad, depressing and worrying one.  As usual those with least will suffer most.

[Salt n Vinegar]

I've seen a fair amount of coverage about the kinds of measures the Chancer of the Exchequer may put forward in his budget. Cutting the energy bill support, not raising personal allowances by inflation for many years, reducing the starting point for the top rate of tax by 25k, increasing that rate to 50%, even introducing vehicle tax for electric vehicles (currently £0).

Airports better get ready for the flood of economic refugees fleeing the UK because they'll be paying more in tax! That's what we hear all the time, isn't it? Or does the fleeing hoard problem only apply to Scottish Government-decreed tax changes? 

Edited November 13, 2022 by Salt n Vinegar

[Granny Danger]

I’m trying to get accurate figures on inheritance tax revenue but it’s hard.  It’s an area where changes create a huge opportunity to raise revenue whilst arguably ‘levelling up’ but I don’t see the Tories (or Labour) doing it.

At the same time it’s the worst example of double taxation for many but eggs and omelettes I suppose…

[parsforlife]

13 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

I’m trying to get accurate figures on inheritance tax revenue but it’s hard.  It’s an area where changes create a huge opportunity to raise revenue whilst arguably ‘levelling up’ but I don’t see the Tories (or Labour) doing it.

At the same time it’s the worst example of double taxation for many but eggs and omelettes I suppose…

How is inheritance tax double taxation?   The person receiving that income hasn't paid a penny of tax on it before.

A truly equal society would have inheritance tax at 100%

Edited November 13, 2022 by parsforlife

[Granny Danger]

23 minutes ago, parsforlife said:

How is inheritance tax double taxation?   The person receiving that income hasn't paid a penny of tax on it before.

A truly equal society would have inheritance tax at 100%

In the U.K. it is not the person who inherits who pays tax, it is the estate of the deceased.  Most folk, though admittedly not everyone, who has accumulated money that is then bequeathed will have paid tax on all or most of that money.  Hence it is double taxation.

BTW, a ‘truly equal’ society wouldn’t need to have inheritance tax; but utopia is not what we’re discussing here.

[parsforlife]

4 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

In the U.K. it is not the person who inherits who pays tax, it is the estate of the deceased.  Most folk, though admittedly not everyone, who has accumulated money that is then bequeathed will have paid tax on all or most of that money.  Hence it is double taxation.

.

The estate IS the people who inherit the money.    It absolutely mental to claim a dead person has money,  they don't they are a lump of meat soon to be burnt or be maggot feed,  they can't own anything in the same way a pile of wheat doesn't own anything.

Edited November 13, 2022 by parsforlife

[Granny Danger]

1 minute ago, parsforlife said:

The estate IS the people who inherit the money.    It absolutely mental to claim a dead person has money,  they don't they are a lump of meat soon to be burnt or be maggot feed,  they can't own anything in the same way a pile of wheat doesn't own anything.

You’re talking shite; the estate is the money/property/whatever that is bequeathed.  The people who inherit are the benefactors.  If you want to be taken seriously and get your point across you should avoid talking shite.

[parsforlife]

Just now, Granny Danger said:

You’re talking shite; the estate is the money/property/whatever that is bequeathed.  The people who inherit are the benefactors.  If you want to be taken seriously and get your point across you should avoid talking shite.

I have no idea why you are trying to go down the technicality route, but given you have,  you'd suggest the estate isn't the same as the person who died. Therefore the estate has never been taxed before?

 

[Dawson Park Boy]

1 hour ago, Granny Danger said:

I’m trying to get accurate figures on inheritance tax revenue but it’s hard.  It’s an area where changes create a huge opportunity to raise revenue whilst arguably ‘levelling up’ but I don’t see the Tories (or Labour) doing it.

At the same time it’s the worst example of double taxation for many but eggs and omelettes I suppose…

IHT revenue has surged in recent years mainly due to house prices and a freeze on thresholds. Estimated to produce £9bn by 27/28.

In 19/20 the average amount paid by families was £215k.

A serious revenue producer.

[Dawson Park Boy]

58 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

In the U.K. it is not the person who inherits who pays tax, it is the estate of the deceased.  Most folk, though admittedly not everyone, who has accumulated money that is then bequeathed will have paid tax on all or most of that money.  Hence it is double taxation.

BTW, a ‘truly equal’ society wouldn’t need to have inheritance tax; but utopia is not what we’re discussing here.

You are correct.

[Thistle_do_nicely]

1 hour ago, parsforlife said:

The estate IS the people who inherit the money.    It absolutely mental to claim a dead person has money,  they don't they are a lump of meat soon to be burnt or be maggot feed,  they can't own anything in the same way a pile of wheat doesn't own anything.

New to all of this so may be incorrect, but its something like

i) estate is moveable and heritable property owned by the deceased

ii) executor is the person deals with the estate, and a will can name more than one. gets complicated if someone dies intestate (no will. Also if theres no spouse. Can in theory end up going to the Crown if no-one is found that can claim any share of the estate)

iii) inventory is done on the estate to establish all the assets. Small estates fall below a certain threshold. Bank accounts, life insurance policies, certain pension funds, all needs to get identified.

iv) creditors (dwp, hmrc, utilities, whoever) have to be given time to claim against the estate

v) something something Confirmation in Scotland, something something Probate in England and Wales. This bit im hazy on and may be an earlier or later step. Its easier with a will, afaik.

vi) after all debts and liabilities are paid, estate is then divided as per will or rights if its intestate.

Law contingent on p&b may be twitching reading that, but its the broad strokes as far as i understand it. With a will the money all goes to an escrow type account held by the lawyer.

I'll recuse myself from this as im involved in dealing with an estate the now so probably wont have a fair opinion; would suggest a 100% inheritence tax cant work as it'd surely just get circumvented by people signing over their assets to beneficiaries well before they pass away, in a Shawshank style "do you trust your wife" kinda deal?

Edit: which tbf could then fall under the scope of capital gains tax at some point i suppose

Edited November 13, 2022 by Thistle_do_nicely

[parsforlife]

1 minute ago, Thistle_do_nicely said:

; would suggest a 100% inheritence tax cant work as it'd surely just get circumvented by people signing over their assets to beneficiaries before they pass away, in a Shawshank style "do you trust your wife" kinda deal?

That can be applied to any form of inheritance tax.   We already have some defense against that with assets given could have inheritance tax applied if they die within 6 years.  
 

The biggest problem we have is the complete lack of interest to close trust funds and other tax scams by the government.   Just taxing one man(Duke of Westminster) at the normal rates would have paid for the entire NHS for 4 years, but no, it was more important to the government to let one posh boy cash in than help 60+ million.

[Thane of Cawdor]

1 hour ago, Granny Danger said:

You’re talking shite; the estate is the money/property/whatever that is bequeathed.  The people who inherit are the benefactors.  If you want to be taken seriously and get your point across you should avoid talking shite.

Before you accuse people of "talking shite" you should learn the difference between beneficiaries and benefactors.