Arbroath v Rovers

[killiefaetheferry]

I have it on good authority that the alleged part-time players do all of their fitness work individually away from the ground, only doing ball work together as a squad, but effectively putting in as many hours as full time players. So they're not even just hybrid, they're actually a full time club working from home on shifts. 

[KTID65]

9 hours ago, ecto said:

Not upset, just pissed off at some of this garbage today, especially from supporters of some of the eight clubs below us, who would exchange league places with us in a heartbeat, clubs who should in all honesty be embarrassed that how their season has gone, 10 games we were top of the league, 10, Kilmarnock, who really should have skooshed the league and might yet win by a healthy margin, were forced to sack their manager and reinvest in their squad in January, not because they were chasing one of the so called big teams in the league, the fact they were chasing us part time not hybrid, part time Arbroath, we have had a brilliant season and no one is going to take that away from us, none of the teams around us is going to fancy playing us in the playoff or will Dundee or St Johnstone for that matter, if it comes to that, we genuinely have nothing to lose, club is in a brilliant place just now, playing in the championship next season is not going to effect us one bit, we genuinely have nothing to lose, not every club in the league can say that, are you a troll?, probably more an annoying rash , who can’t help himself, but only two aliases, really

I don’t know why you think Killie should have skooshed the league, we lost most of our players( mainly to St Mirren) and had to build a totally new team consisting mostly  of championship and league one players. Changing the manager  and getting Lafferty has been the turning point but  I take your point, the last team I thought would be challenging us right to the end of the season would be Arbroath and despite what some people would have you believe it is far from over yet. 

[lichtie23]

Rent free in the heads of the full time clubs support. Lovely stuff 

[Lichtie78]

Barely read this thread but what I have has been a tough read. Hopefully antell never plays again

[stevoraith]

It is correct. They have full time players playing for them. Therefore they don’t have a part time squad.  They have a hybrid squad of full time and part time players. 
The press, they’re own fans, you, saying their part time doesn’t really scan does it? Given they have full time players who play for them. How many times Campbell gets to work with them each week is totally irrelevant here.

How many times each week Campbell gets to work with them is the only relevant thing here.

The general consensus these days is part time players in general do a lot of fitness work away from their official training days with the club so the gap in fitness between full-time and part-time is small.
The only difference perhaps being that full-timers get more rest.

The benefit of having a full-time squad is the players developing a better understanding with each other and the manager having more time to work with the squad.

The full-time loan players Arbroath have give them neither of those benefits.

But if saying they are hybrid makes you feel better about your full-time teams failings this season then bash on.

[TheScarf]

1 minute ago, stevoraith said:

How many times each week Campbell gets to work with them is the only relevant thing here.

The general consensus these days is part time players in general do a lot of fitness work away from their official training days with the club so the gap in fitness between full-time and part-time is small.
The only difference perhaps being that full-timers get more rest.

The benefit of having a full-time squad is the players developing a better understanding with each other and the manager having more time to work with the squad.

The full-time loan players Arbroath have give them neither of those benefits.

But if saying they are hybrid makes you feel better about your full-time teams failings this season then bash on.

You're missing the point here.  I actually agree that the part time/full time quality and fitness gap is negligible in 2022 due to what you mentioned.

The point is that the media and Arbroath fans are claiming their squad is part time and that this season is some sort of fairytale, its plainly wrong.  They have full time players playing for them, like every other team in the league has.

The Caley's season or indeed your clubs even more laughable attempt at winning the league, is again irrelevant to the discussion.

[McGuigan1978]

Did Arbroath fans genuinely start singing, “So fucking easy” when it was 3-3? 

That’s quite odd if so. 

[keptie]

1 hour ago, McGuigan1978 said:

Did Arbroath fans genuinely start singing, “So fucking easy” when it was 3-3? 

That’s quite odd if so. 

They were taking the piss out of  the Rovers supporters, the Rovers supporters were singing that at 3-1. 

[renton]

11 minutes ago, keptie said:

They were taking the piss out of  the Rovers supporters, the Rovers supporters were singing that at 3-1. 

3-1 and you fucked it up would have been the appropriate response. 

Singing so fucking easy back makes no sense. No one sings that when you aren't winning, certainly no one should sing it when it's not actually a good scoreline for you.

Can't take the piss when you sound stupid trying.

[Hammerafc]

3-1 and you fucked it up would have been the appropriate response. 
Singing so fucking easy back makes no sense. No one sings that when you aren't winning, certainly no one should sing it when it's not actually a good scoreline for you.
Can't take the piss when you sound stupid trying.

Sounding stupid is the theme of this thread though.

[CALDERON]

I think the Part time/Full time thing gets overplayed a bit really.  Arbroath are where they are, and have done what they have done, down to the strength of their squad.  What can't be underestimated is the job that Campbell has done in building that squad with the right players.

 

From an outsider looking in, it appears that Mckenna and Low are two examples of players that make them tick.  I'm not sure how much better they would be if they were full time - and on the flipside, does being Part time make them any worse?  Im guessing here, but I'm assuming that part time players have decent access to gym/fitness equipment to keep themselves fit most evenings etc.  The gap in fitness is nowhere near what it was, thats for sure.

 

We've seen it ourselves in League 1 - being Full time is not a golden key to success, and being part time isnt an instant barrier.  Barry Smith assembled a squad of shite - in the hope that being Full time would suddenly make the difference - in the same season that Arbroath assembled easily the best squad of footballers in the league.  Don't get me wrong, there should and probably are benefits to being Full time.  Some of the passing football seen at Starks Park earlier in the year I'm guessing is the fruits of being able to spend large portions of the day on drills etc.

 

However, if you can build a squad of good footballers, on the reduced wages you get with Part time, then its a winner.  But thats not an easy thing to do - hence the reason why very few teams, if any, have done what Arbroath have done with the relevant resources.

 

That said - the likes of Nouble et al coming in on loan will have helped massively - but theres nothing wrong with that.  Rovers won the old 2^nd Division with Kevin Smith scoring the guts of 20 goals on loan.  

 

What I would say, again, is that I do find it a bit strange the messaging coming from Arbroath in recent weeks.  A few weeks ago they were "absolutely going for the Championship" - now the quote from Campbell over the weekend was "I'm no bothered about Championships or Playoffs" - I still cant get my head around that, given Arbroath are 4 points off the top with 5 to play, including the leaders whom they are unbeaten against this season.  I understand that there is probably a bit of managing expectations - particularly when points are dropped - but this could be a once in a lifetime chance that wont come back again.  I don't see a problem in being a bit more bullish. 

[SimonLichtie]

7 hours ago, TheScarf said:

It is correct. They have full time players playing for them. Therefore they don’t have a part time squad.  They have a hybrid squad of full time and part time players. 

The press, they’re own fans, you, saying their part time doesn’t really scan does it? Given they have full time players who play for them. How many times Campbell gets to work with them each week is totally irrelevant here.

Does it equally annoy you when Albion Rovers, Stirling Albion and Cowdenbeath are referred to as part time? We're in exactly the same boat playing squad wise in terms of the make up/ hours we have them/ they are contracted to us for as those clubs.... 

Do you really consider there to be 50+ odd clubs in the country who shouldn't be referred to as having a part time squad?  

6 hours ago, killiefaetheferry said:

I have it on good authority that the alleged part-time players do all of their fitness work individually away from the ground, only doing ball work together as a squad, but effectively putting in as many hours as full time players. So they're not even just hybrid, they're actually a full time club working from home on shifts. 

This is more of a point/ argument for more Fort William players being full time than Arbroath's.

Extra laughter for the insinuation that we have an advantage because our players go to the gym/ do fitness work outside of training sessions, unlike the majority of sports players/ athletics at a semi pro level in the country.

No-one has ever been annoyed at Alloa, Brechin, Cowdenbeath etc. at this level being referred to as part time. It's only now a club is competiting at the other end and getting in the way that people have an issue. It's very funny  

 

[TheScarf]

More emojis needed to show us how unrattled you are I'd say.

[Lichtie78]

I think the Part time/Full time thing gets overplayed a bit really.  Arbroath are where they are, and have done what they have done, down to the strength of their squad.  What can't be underestimated is the job that Campbell has done in building that squad with the right players.   From an outsider looking in, it appears that Mckenna and Low are two examples of players that make them tick.  I'm not sure how much better they would be if they were full time - and on the flipside, does being Part time make them any worse?  Im guessing here, but I'm assuming that part time players have decent access to gym/fitness equipment to keep themselves fit most evenings etc.  The gap in fitness is nowhere near what it was, thats for sure.   We've seen it ourselves in League 1 - being Full time is not a golden key to success, and being part time isnt an instant barrier.  Barry Smith assembled a squad of shite - in the hope that being Full time would suddenly make the difference - in the same season that Arbroath assembled easily the best squad of footballers in the league.  Don't get me wrong, there should and probably are benefits to being Full time.  Some of the passing football seen at Starks Park earlier in the year I'm guessing is the fruits of being able to spend large portions of the day on drills etc.   However, if you can build a squad of good footballers, on the reduced wages you get with Part time, then its a winner.  But thats not an easy thing to do - hence the reason why very few teams, if any, have done what Arbroath have done with the relevant resources.   That said - the likes of Nouble et al coming in on loan will have helped massively - but theres nothing wrong with that.  Rovers won the old 2^nd Division with Kevin Smith scoring the guts of 20 goals on loan.     What I would say, again, is that I do find it a bit strange the messaging coming from Arbroath in recent weeks.  A few weeks ago they were "absolutely going for the Championship" - now the quote from Campbell over the weekend was "I'm no bothered about Championships or Playoffs" - I still cant get my head around that, given Arbroath are 4 points off the top with 5 to play, including the leaders whom they are unbeaten against this season.  I understand that there is probably a bit of managing expectations - particularly when points are dropped - but this could be a once in a lifetime chance that wont come back again.  I don't see a problem in being a bit more bullish. 

To be fair if there is one thing to be taken from Dick & co’s reign at Arbroath, it’s to ignore literally everything they say in the press.

[Tattie36]

The part-time/full-time thing has nothing to do with fitness and not a great deal to do with the footballing ability of individual players at this level… but how can anyone not see that it’s a big advantage for a management team being able to work with their players on a daily basis in regard to tactics, set-piece drills and just general squad bonding etc as opposed to a couple of hours two evenings a week?

My 11 year old son’s team train together almost as much as Arbroath do. Full time teams have a big advantage in that regard.

I know it’s a windup but to call us “hybrid” is ridiculous. “Our” three full-time players only spend limited time with the rest of the squad so their full-time status makes no big difference.

Edited March 28, 2022 by Tattie36

[McGuigan1978]

There’s definitely a debate to be had around how Arbroath could go from five points clear at the top to four points behind in just a few weeks. 

Whatever way you look at it, it’s been a dreadful collapse, and you have to apportion blame somewhere. 

[Fide]

6 minutes ago, McGuigan1978 said:

There’s definitely a debate to be had around how Arbroath could go from five points clear at the top to four points behind in just a few weeks. 

Whatever way you look at it, it’s been a dreadful collapse, and you have to apportion blame somewhere. 

I think it’s mainly to do with the fact that their squad is hybrid. 

[Lichtie78]

There’s definitely a debate to be had around how Arbroath could go from five points clear at the top to four points behind in just a few weeks. 
Whatever way you look at it, it’s been a dreadful collapse, and you have to apportion blame somewhere. 

A good chunk of the Arbroath support right now believe it is a no go for any form of criticism to be levelled at the players, management or club so this discussion should be bags of fun.

[ecto]

9 hours ago, lichtie23 said:

Rent free in the heads of the full time clubs support. Lovely stuff 

It’s how needy they appear to be

[Fide]

52 minutes ago, ecto said:

It’s how needy they appear to be

At least you’re not upset about it.