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A Message to All Stirling Albion Trust Members


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17 minutes ago, BazMac said:

I just truly don't understand the sense of wanting rid of Stuart Brown because he has 'no idea about getting it right on the park'.  Darren Young has had some success at this level, and he's got a good budget.  What more can a Board do than appoint a manager who's capable of success and give them a good budget??  Do people want the board to give team talks?
 

You won’t get a coherent answer to that. We just keep getting told the club is FAILING (caps are mandatory apparently). And sound bites like “we need to take the club forward” are thrown around without any plan how to make that happen. 
 

We’ve literally just appointed a new manager and we have a good budget. Our success next season comes down to Darren Young’s recruitment and coaching. Stuart Brown doesn’t take the free kicks and John Daly doesn’t make goal line clearances.
 

The idea that losing all the people who know how the club works and assuming newer, better, people will magically appear and work for tuppence with no transition period yet somehow lead to better results on the park is somewhere between naive and unfuckingbelievable. 

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Just reading that Colin Rowley statement. Strong second hand embarrassment for what the hell is going on at your club.

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Given the high-profile decisions made by other clubs resulting in headlines, surely, we can agree that the club board hasn’t committed any heinous crime?

Someone correct me if I'm wrong but I just read that as patting yourself on the back for not signing David Goodwillie?

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I understand the frustration of the league, especially given we sat 2nd spot after the first 9 league matches (Tongue in cheek – I note there were no cries to remove Stuart or John back then, nor congratulations for them doing an amazing job of reaching such unexpected highs!)

Strange tone for what should be a serious statement?

On the whole a bizarre comment that 25% of season games is a prime time to congratulate or condemn.

I've trotted up the stat plenty of times for us this season but in Jim Goodwin's promotion season the first quarter we had only beaten the bottom two after the first round of fixtures. Ultimately a season can be judged after a suitable sample size. Often that is over the entirety of it unless it's an absolute disaster.

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The lines have been blurred between fan ownership and fan operations.

Being fair, there needs to be a defined criteria. The board should set the framework for how the football club is run. The owner should evaluate whether that framework is fit for purpose. As owner though a supporters trust is a schizophrenic entity.  It's messy in comparison to a benevolent dictator which I'm told is the best scenario. Just because something is democratic and popular does not guarantee success.

Anyway the democracy of the trust is not magically right by the power of popularity. See Plato and Socrates for relevant reading.

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Most of us acknowledge that having paid professionals doing the work we do would be everyone’s preference, however, sacrificing what little playing budget we have without building up the necessary reserves to deliver success both on and off the park requires patience and a lot of money.

Again strikes me as very incoherent.

Professionals covering roles costs money from the playing budget. True but only if they're not generating value for the club.
Sacrificing playing budget builds reserves. True but does do it optimally?
Reserves deliver success both on and off the park. Absolutely not. Efficiency will allow a smaller budget and a smaller team to function at a much higher level.
Building the reserves costs patience and a lot of money. Completely undefined goal that can be moved at any time. How big does the reserve need to be? And is there a defined timeline for building it?

Upheaval is generally a detracting factor from success. I was worried that DY would bring some success but on this view at least this page won't need to change any time soon.
https://www.alloaathletic.co.uk/alloa-closest-rivals

Edited by LeodhasXD
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I just truly don't understand the sense of wanting rid of Stuart Brown because he has 'no idea about getting it right on the park'.  Darren Young has had some success at this level, and he's got a good budget.  What more can a Board do than appoint a manager who's capable of success and give them a good budget??  Do people want the board to give team talks?
When you see Raith signing Goowdwillie... Even Edinburgh City sacking Naysmith when in a decent position.  These are the sorta things that would make me question the abilities of a board.  I don't see that at Forthbank.
Just seems like personal vendettas to me.  Especially given the lack of 'better' option provided, as far as I can see.
 


This 100%
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2 hours ago, BinoBalls said:

You won’t get a coherent answer to that. We just keep getting told the club is FAILING (caps are mandatory apparently). And sound bites like “we need to take the club forward” are thrown around without any plan how to make that happen. 
 

We’ve literally just appointed a new manager and we have a good budget. Our success next season comes down to Darren Young’s recruitment and coaching. Stuart Brown doesn’t take the free kicks and John Daly doesn’t make goal line clearances.
 

The idea that losing all the people who know how the club works and assuming newer, better, people will magically appear and work for tuppence with no transition period yet somehow lead to better results on the park is somewhere between naive and unfuckingbelievable. 

At one level you are right, new managers will not solve problems on the park.

I believe our larger troubles are off the park, the chairman was appointed as chief operations officers in which post he has been reasonably successful, he talked this up to becoming chairman. From then on, he has put every effort into emasculating the owners Trust Board, and done it successfully. He does not acknowledge any accountability to the owners, the club board's actions are less than transparent and he appoints sycophants only, without reference. The Trust Board must share some blame, in that after the mass resignation, successive boards have been too conciliatory instead of exercising their authority, which has only further encouraged the chairman's power grab. That said, a number of good men have tried as Chairmen of the Trust to work with the club board but given up in frustration at the club chairman's refusal to collaborate. 

I hope it's not too late for the Trust Board to reassert their authority over the executive, but at this stage I fear the heart is being ripped out of the club. 

As the saying goes - power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely.

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1 minute ago, AlbionMan said:

At one level you are right, new managers will not solve problems on the park.

I believe our larger troubles are off the park, the chairman was appointed as chief operations officers in which post he has been reasonably successful, he talked this up to becoming chairman. From then on, he has put every effort into emasculating the owners Trust Board, and done it successfully. He does not acknowledge any accountability to the owners, the club board's actions are less than transparent and he appoints sycophants only, without reference. The Trust Board must share some blame, in that after the mass resignation, successive boards have been too conciliatory instead of exercising their authority, which has only further encouraged the chairman's power grab. That said, a number of good men have tried as Chairmen of the Trust to work with the club board but given up in frustration at the club chairman's refusal to collaborate. 

I hope it's not too late for the Trust Board to reassert their authority over the executive, but at this stage I fear the heart is being ripped out of the club. 

As the saying goes - power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely.

Yeah I hear a lot of what you’re saying and the irony here is I do have concerns over Brown and I’m embarrassed our 2 boards seem to have constant issues working with each other. It’s like 2 kids arguing in the playground, you don’t know who to believe. 

So as much as I’m not much of a Brown fan, these proposals would be a disaster. I know it’s a democracy but maybe the trust should have some sort of filter before allowing proposals like this to go to a mass vote. The Trust owns the club yet they are asking us to vote on a proposal that would be leave us with nobody running the club and no handover, and they haven’t sought to clarify any of it. It’s crazy and if it goes through a lot of people are going to look pretty irresponsible. 

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22 minutes ago, BinoBalls said:

Yeah I hear a lot of what you’re saying and the irony here is I do have concerns over Brown and I’m embarrassed our 2 boards seem to have constant issues working with each other. It’s like 2 kids arguing in the playground, you don’t know who to believe. 

So as much as I’m not much of a Brown fan, these proposals would be a disaster. I know it’s a democracy but maybe the trust should have some sort of filter before allowing proposals like this to go to a mass vote. The Trust owns the club yet they are asking us to vote on a proposal that would be leave us with nobody running the club and no handover, and they haven’t sought to clarify any of it. It’s crazy and if it goes through a lot of people are goi g to look pretty irresponsible. 

The two boards do have trouble working with each other, there needs to be a balance between the authority of the owners and the operational responsibility of the executive, but at the moment collaboration is a one way street. There is supposed to be a joint working group of the two boards to find a way to improve the governance of the club. However since since June last year when the JWG was first notionally formed the executive have not contributed. I understand that they have declined invitations to meet, to the frustration of the Trust Board. At that level it appears that the executive are not interested in working together.

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4 hours ago, BazMac said:

Darren Young has had some success at this level, and he's got a good budget.  What more can a Board do than appoint a manager who's capable of success and give them a good budget??

What are you talking about here?  The budget for 2021/2 or that for 2022/23 - the indicative budget referred to earlier in this thread?

Please quantify what the budget is in cash terms?  By what yardstick do you assess whether a budget is "good", or not?   

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I'm trying to understand what is happening here.

The Trust own the Club and has appointed a Board of Directors to carry out the day to day running of the Club. Nothing to see here, all perfectly normal so far.

The Board of Directors apparently have put up 2 fingers to the owners and are running the Club to suit themselves. Yes, no?

The owners have tried and failed to engage with the Club Board in an attempt to get governance and accountability into the organisation. Yes, no?

The Club are in a good place financially but has failed on the park.

Looking at the stats, 2 relegations and one promotion since 2010. I remember when it was the yo-yo club. Now its just a yo club. Bad joke but best I can manage.

A trust member, unhappy with the performances on the park wants changes at Board room level and has  directed his attention towards the chairman.

So far so good. Yes, no?

The Club are not happy so enlist 70 non Albion fans to become members of the Trust and so rig the vote.

Another Director then goes online to say, if the chairman is removed, the whole board will walk. Blackmail or what?

What the hell is going on?

Nobody is a winner here if the vote is being manipulated. Everyone is going to claim victory when in fact everyone loses.

Mr Liston, can I suggest you withdraw your motion, tell both boards to get round the table and get it sorted. Give them 6 weeks, if not, bring it back.

 

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20 minutes ago, Boris Badenov said:

I'm trying to understand what is happening here.

The Trust own the Club and has appointed a Board of Directors to carry out the day to day running of the Club. Nothing to see here, all perfectly normal so far.

The Board of Directors apparently have put up 2 fingers to the owners and are running the Club to suit themselves. Yes, no?

The owners have tried and failed to engage with the Club Board in an attempt to get governance and accountability into the organisation. Yes, no?

The Club are in a good place financially but has failed on the park.

Looking at the stats, 2 relegations and one promotion since 2010. I remember when it was the yo-yo club. Now its just a yo club. Bad joke but best I can manage.

A trust member, unhappy with the performances on the park wants changes at Board room level and has  directed his attention towards the chairman.

So far so good. Yes, no?

The Club are not happy so enlist 70 non Albion fans to become members of the Trust and so rig the vote.

Another Director then goes online to say, if the chairman is removed, the whole board will walk. Blackmail or what?

What the hell is going on?

Nobody is a winner here if the vote is being manipulated. Everyone is going to claim victory when in fact everyone loses.

Mr Liston, can I suggest you withdraw your motion, tell both boards to get round the table and get it sorted. Give them 6 weeks, if not, bring it back.

 

You have summed up the situation perfectly.  Thank you. 

Answer to all your questions is 'yes'

Edited by TheVoiceofReason
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38 minutes ago, Boris Badenov said:

I'm trying to understand what is happening here.

The Trust own the Club and has appointed a Board of Directors to carry out the day to day running of the Club. Nothing to see here, all perfectly normal so far.

The Board of Directors apparently have put up 2 fingers to the owners and are running the Club to suit themselves. Yes, no?

The owners have tried and failed to engage with the Club Board in an attempt to get governance and accountability into the organisation. Yes, no?

The Club are in a good place financially but has failed on the park.

Looking at the stats, 2 relegations and one promotion since 2010. I remember when it was the yo-yo club. Now its just a yo club. Bad joke but best I can manage.

A trust member, unhappy with the performances on the park wants changes at Board room level and has  directed his attention towards the chairman.

So far so good. Yes, no?

The Club are not happy so enlist 70 non Albion fans to become members of the Trust and so rig the vote.

Another Director then goes online to say, if the chairman is removed, the whole board will walk. Blackmail or what?

What the hell is going on?

Nobody is a winner here if the vote is being manipulated. Everyone is going to claim victory when in fact everyone loses.

Mr Liston, can I suggest you withdraw your motion, tell both boards to get round the table and get it sorted. Give them 6 weeks, if not, bring it back.

 

I wish it was as simple as that. 😀

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8 hours ago, Neilly said:

How can running a diddy club end up this confusing guys?

It's all a bit bewildering from the outside looking in.

 

Yes Indeed  how can running a diddy club end up this confusing you may well ask. This situation has been rumbling along in the background for a number of years now and it has allowed one man Stuart Brown the current Chairman to in effective ignore the wishes of the owners of the Club the Supporters Trust.

How to fix it, its going to be bloody imo 

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8 hours ago, Neilly said:

How can running a diddy club end up this confusing guys?

It's all a bit bewildering from the outside looking in.

 

It’s an absolute embarrassment for sure. Some grown men refusing to talk to other grown men. Club board allegedly refusing to answer queries from trust board. Pettiness and stubbornness are rife and it’s been going on for years.

However the current resolutions will make things disastrously worse so the vast majority seem to be against them. 

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4 hours ago, BinoBalls said:

 

It’s an absolute embarrassment for sure. Some grown men refusing to talk to other grown men. Club board allegedly refusing to answer queries from trust board. Pettiness and stubbornness are rife and it’s been going on for years.

However the current resolutions will make things disastrously worse so the vast majority seem to be against them. 

Yes, the vast majority of the new members who have come close to doubling the membership numbers in the past 10 days will vote against the motions. Club directors and associate directors have signed up these 'supporters of Stirling Albion'  in an attempt frustrate the trust membership's will (which is unclear if the contentious motion would have passed anyway) and to keep themselves in position. All this to support the vanity of one man who cannot believe that he is not Tam Fergusson, and Peter McKenzie in one body. 

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I have just had an email from the Supporters Trust saying that voting on the AGM Resolutions has been suspended due to irregularities and the matter has been referred to Police Scotland.  

I wonder who will be getting a knock on the door soon?

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So in this whole sad affair, who’s going to be the first person to apologise to Stuart Brown and the club board for the slandering that has taken place in the accusations that they have tried to rig the vote??

The statement from the Junior Academy is exactly the reason why people should watch what they are accusing others of doing, especially when we do not have all the facts.

The sooner this is all put to bed the better!

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1 hour ago, BB_Bino said:

So in this whole sad affair, who’s going to be the first person to apologise to Stuart Brown and the club board for the slandering that has taken place in the accusations that they have tried to rig the vote??

The statement from the Junior Academy is exactly the reason why people should watch what they are accusing others of doing, especially when we do not have all the facts.

The sooner this is all put to bed the better!

Agree the sooner Stuart Brown and his cabal are removed the better, we the fans own this Club or so I`m led  to believe. Not Stuart Brown. 

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1 hour ago, BB_Bino said:

So in this whole sad affair, who’s going to be the first person to apologise to Stuart Brown and the club board for the slandering that has taken place in the accusations that they have tried to rig the vote??

The statement from the Junior Academy is exactly the reason why people should watch what they are accusing others of doing, especially when we do not have all the facts.

The sooner this is all put to bed the better!

I had to look for this statement for the junior academy. First of all well done. 50 coaches is quite some doing.

The problem BB Bino is 50 people joining just to interfere with the way the Club is run is vote rigging. Maybe well intention but vote rigging it is.

It's maybe too late but is there any high profile person can sit in a room with them and bang some heads together.

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56 minutes ago, rhliston said:

Agree the sooner Stuart Brown and his cabal are removed the better, we the fans own this Club or so I`m led  to believe. Not Stuart Brown. 

Who replaces him then? 

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