FIRE Discussion and Resources

[SuperSaints1877]

Just now, oaksoft said:

Ah the old, "attach our  business to a charity, that way people will trust us" tactic. 

 

Eh no. His son had a brain tumour removed. He takes no proceeds directly. He just provides a link to the Brain Tumour site. There is absolutely no obligation to donate to charity.

[resk]

14 minutes ago, ThatBoyRonaldo said:

Escape capitalist exploitation by simply becoming one of the people doing the exploiting. Appropriately cynical bullshit for the hopeless age we live in.

By "exploiting", are you talking about investing in the stock market generally, or specifically about these mythical FIRE scammers that are definitely a thing?

[SuperSaints1877]

Just now, oaksoft said:

I didn't say there was.

you never even checked it out you stupid cnut. 

[Benjamin_Nevis]

I’m literally planning on dying with loads of unsecured debt, no point hoarding money; can’t be the richest person in the graveyard.

Just take out a shit ton of sub 3k loans. You can't be sequestrated [emoji23]

[Thorongil]

I’m 42 now and intend to be done by 52 to the point that any work is optional and will only be easy and stress free. 

We built our house 6 years ago. We’re overpaying our mortgage and  aggressively paying off all consumer debt. Debt will all be gone this financial year.

investing this year also in solar electricity and air source heating for our home and fully expecting that in 10 years we will have property and pension assets of circa £1m between us and expecting that cost of living will be low as no more mortgage, no more mortgage insurances, no heating or electricity bills, no nursery fees, no childcare costs of any kind. 
 

So it will be 3 years of living on savings as can’t access pensions till 55, though my wife will be 55 when I’m 52 so that will help also. 

Then coast for a few years, then eventually sell up, downsize and live off the proceeds. 

There’s one potential jewel in the crown as well, we have a building plot near to Stornoway so we could build on that and monetise it. AirBNB for 10 years would pay for it, then sell it. 

I work in financial services (kind of) and I don’t personally understand or trust funds as such. Just seems like gambling to me.

[SweeperDee]

First thing I’d do - if you’re interested in this - is read a simple path to wealth. It’s all there.
The basic steps are, firstly get rid of all consumer debt. That’s not your mortgage, that’s credit cards, personal loans, PCP etc. Pay it down as hard and fast as you can.
Secondly contribute to your work place pension and get the maximum employer match, that’s a free pay rise if you’re not already doing it.
Thirdly create a cash emergency fund. There’s a lot of debate in the community of what a sufficient emergency fund is. Some say three months worth of expenses, some say three years. No right or wrong answer, but have this in an easy access savings account.
Fourthly invest in low cost tracker funds. Vanguard FTSE global all cap index fund - accumulation is probably the most popular for those wanting FI. You get a bit of everything and - crucially - the fees are low. Fidelity and other companies offer similar funds though, the provider isn’t really important just avoid high fee financial advisers like St James’ Place etc.
That’s it, then you wait. The nuance is your savings rate and your annual expenses, and everyone is different in that respect. People talk about fat fi and lean fi. If you want luxury holidays and fancy cars post retirement you’ll need a bigger pot. If you’re happy living in a van and foraging berries you’ll hardly need anything. Naturally most people are somewhere in the middle.
Mr Money Moustache made a famous blog post more than ten years ago now - https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/01/13/the-shockingly-simple-math-behind-early-retirement/ - it’s still regularly talked about and his table is broadly correct.

Absolute fucking tosh.

[beefybake]

1 hour ago, oaksoft said:

I didn't say there was.

Neither did I say he was taking a cut.

Overall, you've plenty of words, but little to say.

[SuperSaints1877]

2 minutes ago, oaksoft said:

Well aren't you just the most charming of all the cult members today.

I’m only telling the truth. You are a c**t. You can’t dispute that.

You freely criticise people who write books for free to help people improve their finances without even checking them out yet can’t face the any criticism over your own work. 

Btw I think I found your new book.

 

 

[beefybake]

1 hour ago, oaksoft said:

I suppose this is what I get for calling out cult members.

It's my own fault really. 

As always, an expert at 'calling out', dissecting everything till you can find

some fabricated reason to shout "Shiiit...".   

Yuk. You contribute nothing.

[Shandon Par]

5 minutes ago, oaksoft said:

Thank the Lord someone has finally recognised me for it.

I was beginning to think I was just wasting my time.

Some of us appreciate you Jilly.

[Satoshi]

9 hours ago, WeAreElgin said:

f**k this seminar, self help nonsense. Just marry someone with rich parents. Financial planning at its best.

This kinda touches on another important aspect, it's important to find a partner who shares your financial goals. If you are a pair of DINKS (goole it!) with professional salaries working towards financial indepdence you will be able to do it fairly quickly. However, even someone with a great wage will struggle if their partner gets free drinks at the casino.

There is FIRE dating in the US I think, can't say I've ever partaken myself.

8 hours ago, ThatBoyRonaldo said:

Escape capitalist exploitation by simply becoming one of the people doing the exploiting. Appropriately cynical bullshit for the hopeless age we live in.

Hmm, not sure I agree with this. If you stay in a job you are being exploited, but retiring and living off investments you are exploiting? For me exploiting would be running a business that exploits people not being a passive investor. But fair enough if you disagree, I guess the only way to truly get out of the cylce is convent living.

11 hours ago, SuperSaints1877 said:

This thread has been started by an individual who is keen to share. If one person takes the first positive steps as a result it will be worth it.

 

Indeed, the thread is for discussion and resources (finally updated the first post!) it certainly doesn't have to be all positive discussion though - there are negative aspects of FIRE, it's fair enough that these are called out. I had it in my head when I was younger that I would like to do something like this, but not the practical steps on how to achieve it. If the thread reaches even one person it's definitely a success.

Have to admit, I didn't think someone would think it was as a cult. I haven't spend a single penny on this hobby (I even downloaded the two books I read for free), and a weekend away / seminar bullshit sounds very much like Rich Dad Poor Dad which is disavowed in every FI community I've been in. The whole point is to spend less, anyone hawking products is better targeting pretty much any other demographic.

What I do agree with is that there has become a fairly standard route for someone (usually a couple) to retire very early (usually in the US) and write a book / blog about their experience of staying in a van and living off beans. There's been a few and I imagine they're quite ubiquitous. And it's fair enough, seems an easy way to make extra cash but beyond possibly being quite entertaining I'm not sure it's really going to help anyone (compared to the books listed in the first post). And, of course, you don't have to pay for books anyway (possible moral quandray though).

I've only come across Oaksoft once before, where he pretended to know about the Energy Industry on the Energy Prices thread (even though he clearly didn't). And that's the great thing about being retired, you can choose to spend your time how you desire (including writing nonsense on the intenet). If he really thinks FIRE is like his recollection of newspaper based petrol scams then fair enough, I actually think he just likes having people to talk to and finds being contrarion anagolous to being interesting.

If he thinks you should pursue FIRE without spending any money on it, then maybe he's in the cult without even knowing it 

[The Moonster]

It's becoming clear this is just life coaching for corporate wankspeakers. Give everything an acronym to make it sound more sophisticated than it is. 

[Mark Connolly]

I decided to follow the advice and start thinking of "disposable income" as "discretionary income".

Suddenly, I'm saving almost 12p extra per year!

[vikingTON]

6 minutes ago, The Moonster said:

It's becoming clear this is just life coaching for corporate wankspeakers. Give everything an acronym to make it sound more sophisticated than it is. 

You forgot about the dating aspect of it as well, which sounds in no way absolutely fucking tragic (although handily shunts them down a nice wee cul-de-sac away from the rest of society). 

[Thorongil]

7 minutes ago, The Moonster said:

It's becoming clear this is just life coaching for corporate wankspeakers. Give everything an acronym to make it sound more sophisticated than it is. 

It clearly is. The culty zeal is sad and (on a level) amusing to read. It is amazing to me that people can be so dishonest with others and with themselves. 

[Shandon Par]

6 hours ago, Satoshi said:

This kinda touches on another important aspect, it's important to find a partner who shares your financial goals. If you are a pair of DINKS (goole it!) with professional salaries working towards financial indepdence you will be able to do it fairly quickly.

I do like a nice pair of dinks.

 

[Shandon Par]

As a 40 something I just want to walk the dog and listen to podcasts. 18-40 was the time for the high life. My passions were partying, fancy hotels, days/nights out, clothes and performance cars (I had 30 or 40). Planning for when things will be utopian at sone point in the future is a guaranteed recipe for disappointment and divorce. 
 

[coprolite]

6 hours ago, Satoshi said:

This kinda touches on another important aspect, it's important to find a partner who shares your financial goals. If you are a pair of DINKS (goole it!) with professional salaries working towards financial indepdence you will be able to do it fairly quickly. However, even someone with a great wage will struggle if their partner gets free drinks at the casino.

There is FIRE dating in the US I think, can't say I've ever partaken myself.

Hmm, not sure I agree with this. If you stay in a job you are being exploited, but retiring and living off investments you are exploiting? For me exploiting would be running a business that exploits people not being a passive investor. But fair enough if you disagree, I guess the only way to truly get out of the cylce is convent living.

Indeed, the thread is for discussion and resources (finally updated the first post!) it certainly doesn't have to be all positive discussion though - there are negative aspects of FIRE, it's fair enough that these are called out. I had it in my head when I was younger that I would like to do something like this, but not the practical steps on how to achieve it. If the thread reaches even one person it's definitely a success.

Have to admit, I didn't think someone would think it was as a cult. I haven't spend a single penny on this hobby (I even downloaded the two books I read for free), and a weekend away / seminar bullshit sounds very much like Rich Dad Poor Dad which is disavowed in every FI community I've been in. The whole point is to spend less, anyone hawking products is better targeting pretty much any other demographic.

What I do agree with is that there has become a fairly standard route for someone (usually a couple) to retire very early (usually in the US) and write a book / blog about their experience of staying in a van and living off beans. There's been a few and I imagine they're quite ubiquitous. And it's fair enough, seems an easy way to make extra cash but beyond possibly being quite entertaining I'm not sure it's really going to help anyone (compared to the books listed in the first post). And, of course, you don't have to pay for books anyway (possible moral quandray though).

I've only come across Oaksoft once before, where he pretended to know about the Energy Industry on the Energy Prices thread (even though he clearly didn't). And that's the great thing about being retired, you can choose to spend your time how you desire (including writing nonsense on the intenet). If he really thinks FIRE is like his recollection of newspaper based petrol scams then fair enough, I actually think he just likes having people to talk to and finds being contrarion anagolous to being interesting.

If he thinks you should pursue FIRE without spending any money on it, then maybe he's in the cult without even knowing it 

This is superficially reasonable. 

Except the bit in bold.

Getting returns from passive investment is only possible because of the exploitative power relations in the economy that allow business owners to capture the larger part of the surplus from workers' labour. That's then compounded by the tax system in our country being biased towards capital o er labour and taxing returns to labour excessively. 

If you want to defer your consumption until you are to old to enjoy it that's up to you. 

But don't pretend it's some anti establishment rejection of consumerism. It's "if you can't beat em join em" 

[Hedgecutter]

On 14/03/2022 at 14:14, SweeperDee said:

can’t be the richest person in the graveyard.

Since reading the above, I've decided that I'd like my own mausoleum. Will still have my ashes scattered though, so there won't actually be any practical need for it, but Joe Public won't know that.

(actually, folk  will probably just look at it and think "bet that guy was a bit of a tw*t" forever more, as I do whenever I see one.  Maybe this isn't the best idea.  That said, perhaps I could turn it into a museum about my life with a solar-powered sign that lights up saying 'not a w***er' at 30 sec intervals? I could have a reconstruction of my pink mid-80s Ratmobile pedal car on display, amongst many other semi-interesting things)

Edited March 16, 2022 by Hedgecutter

[101]

1 hour ago, Shandon Par said:

As a 40 something I just want to walk the dog and listen to podcasts. 18-40 was the time for the high life. My passions were partying, fancy hotels, days/nights out, clothes and performance cars (I had 30 or 40). Planning for when things will be utopian at sone point in the future is a guaranteed recipe for disappointment and divorce. 
 

You don't need to save up because you can charge based on the vulnerability of your customers