FIRE Discussion and Resources

[invergowrie arab]

The Christmas period is a horrifying glimpse into what I would become if retired.

[scottsdad]

When the time comes I could do what a colleague of mine did and work 3 days per week (no teaching, just research). That would appeal to me much more than a complete finish. 

[Lex]

The retiring early part of financial independence is certainly not for everyone, it's just having the freedom to choose. That Choose FI podcast does regular case studies and the vast majority of those who have reached their 'number' continue working. Sometimes in the job they were already in, sometimes they change career, sometimes they work six months of the year and take six off, sometimes set up their own business in something they are passionate about or just do charity/volunteer work etc. 

Having FI also empowers you in your employment. You hear regular stories of people asking for six weeks off or similar, their boss saying no, them saying they quit because they can afford to, then they get the time off they wanted. 

Edited March 14, 2022 by Lex

[SweeperDee]

The best financial advice I can give my kids is to 
- avoid consumer debt
- spend less than you earn
- invest the difference.
The power of compound interest has huge impact on young people who squirrel away money into LISAs and SIPPS rather than buy the latest smart phones, flash cars and expensive clothes. Even a relatively small amount every month will pay massive dividends later on in life.
Too many people are too busy buying things trying to impress people they don’t even like anyway!

f**k that. I’m not working for a pension I’ll never get to see because there won’t be a retirement age/pension when I’m older. I don’t buy flashy phones or cars, complete waste of money. I spend my money on my hobbies, my partner and my dog. We have a roof over our head, a nice TV, we eat nice food and sleep in a comfy bed. I’m not going to worry about money and compound interest, life is far too short.

[RH33]

I don't even know what compound interest is.

 

[highlandcowden]

6 hours ago, DA Baracus said:

Are there seriously folk who would feel guilty not working?! Why? 

If I could, I'd never work again. Sadly I cannot, so work I must. It's shite.

i decided to do this and left just before christmas.ive had these feelings of guilt on and off since though i concede its early on yet and im sure ill settle into it.other peoples expectations of what you may or may not do is a right bugger

[Granny Danger]

3 hours ago, coprolite said:

I am totally on board with you boring b*****ds amassing as much savings as possible. 

You'll be subsidising my low quality state nursing care with them. 

[Aufc]

Can't speak for@scottsdad but for many years, my hobby was also what I did for a living.
Lots of people love their jobs.

I feel sorry for people like this

[highlandcowden]

4 minutes ago, Aufc said:

I feel sorry for people like this

im quite envious-itd be great to get paid doing something you enjoyed.i fucking hated my job,hence my leaving...eventually

[Aufc]

im quite envious-itd be great to get paid doing something you enjoyed.i fucking hated my job,hence my leaving...eventually

Guess that is true. But I reckon they are in the minority. However, I am very much work to live rather than live to work

[beefybake]

5 hours ago, Lex said:

The retiring early part of financial independence is certainly not for everyone, it's just having the freedom to choose. That Choose FI podcast does regular case studies and the vast majority of those who have reached their 'number' continue working. Sometimes in the job they were already in, sometimes they change career, sometimes they work six months of the year and take six off, sometimes set up their own business in something they are passionate about or just do charity/volunteer work etc. 

Having FI also empowers you in your employment. You hear regular stories of people asking for six weeks off or similar, their boss saying no, them saying they quit because they can afford to, then they get the time off they wanted. 

It used to be called having... 'F*ck Off money', ie, having sufficent money to be able to make your own decisions, rather than having them forced on you.

[beefybake]

12 hours ago, Satoshi said:

.....basic principles will broadly help everyone) and there is a moral quandry that if you retire early and live off the increasing value of ETFs - the work is still happening you are just not doing it (even though you are still able to). I assuage my guilt on the latter by being so bad at my job, it's probably better for everyone that I'm no longer involved going forward. Conversely, the more people take up FIRE the more reduced spending will negatively impact the world economy and the harder FIRE will be to achieve.

On my personal journey, I'm aiming to be Financially Independent by around 40. This is ambitious but certainly achievable, and very much dependent on my short term career trajectory. I probably won't stop working entirely but intend to spend my 40s and 50s working on my terms, not others.

Shortcuts to FIRE include drug dealing and/or robbing drug dealers.

There's lots of other stuff about van living and moving abroad but this post is already too long as it is. Let's hear your thoughts.

 

Some resources for those interested (I can keep this updated)

Mr Money Moustache (blog)

Monveator (blog)

Your money is your life (book)

How to own the world (book)

The Simple Path to Wealth (book)

The Barefoot Investor (book)

Financial Independence UK (facebook group)

Full disclosure, I've actually only read two of the books (and none of the blogs).

Monevator.com is very much about money, pure and simple.  Investing. Passive index funds is the focus. 

 

Mr Money Mustache is very much not just about money. It's about how you live your life, and what you do with your money,

and how much you invest.  Mr Money Mustache himself has little interest in the stock/share picking, or the mechanics and study

of the subject, he just pours his investiing monies into a Total World index fund, and lets compounding do the rest. . His chosen one was the Vanguard version.

The overall message is pushback against consumerism, refrain from buying sh*t you don't actually need, and investing a substantial percentage

of your earnings.

 

Your Money or Your Life ( Book by : Vicki Robin )

This is also a study of how you live your life, and enables you to examine how much 'Life Energy' you are putting into your paid employment,

and how much you are really getting out,  as compared with what you think you're getting out.  On expenditures, she says that by doing the stuff

she recommends in the book, most people can reduce their expenditures by around 25% without feeling in any way that they have sacrificed anything

important to them.

 

Re:  "Conversely, the more people take up FIRE the more reduced spending will negatively impact the world economy and the harder FIRE will be to achieve... ".

Not really, you've fallen into the traditional economics focus on constantly increasing GDP as a measure of economic health.

Suggest you read around a bit on the subject of New Economics, for example 'Doughnut Economics' by Kate Raworth.  That's what a large chunk

of what Money Mustache, and the Vicki Robin book, are about, except their ways of expression are different to those of an economist, which is what Raworth does.

 

As said, Monevator is just about money. The other two have the recognition that we live in a world of finite natural resources, and that we must use them

wisely.

 

[Left Back]

14 hours ago, RH33 said:

I don't even know what compound interest is.

 

It’s interest that’s compounded.

[101]

15 hours ago, RH33 said:

I don't even know what compound interest is.

 

Put simply it's earning interest on interest payments so multiplying money you didn't spend other than by having an account. 

[Fullerene]

15 hours ago, RH33 said:

I don't even know what compound interest is.

It is when you travel around the country looking at compounds and occasionally say "well that one looks interesting".

HTH

[Sergeant Wilson]

54 minutes ago, Fullerene said:

It is when you travel around the country looking at compounds and occasionally say "well that one looks interesting".

HTH

It's beautiful!

[Nkomo-A-Gogo]

I had a year off work after leaving school and before getting a job and spent most days with another couple of mates who dropped out of school whacking golf balls around the park, burning stuff and the occasional carry out. I certainly wasnt bored.

[The Moonster]

I find these discussions are for folk who earn decent wages. Yer man Satoshi talking earlier about how he never really changed much of his spending habits but has still the ability to save huge amounts that will allow him to retire at 55. I see videos of financially independent folks on youtube and it's always "take your paycheck and split it in half, put one half away. Then split what you have left and spend half". Thats fine if you're Kevin Hart or Shaq O'Neill and you can buy a new Ferrari with the wee bit you've got left but someone working in B&M on a zero hour contract probably wouldn't be able to eat if they did that with every paycheck. So I guess that's my question for supporters of this "community" - how does a poor c**t do this but live a healthy and enjoyable life? 

[Lex]

So I guess that's my question for supporters of this "community" - how does a poor c**t do this but live a healthy and enjoyable life? 

First thing I’d do - if you’re interested in this - is read a simple path to wealth. It’s all there.
The basic steps are, firstly get rid of all consumer debt. That’s not your mortgage, that’s credit cards, personal loans, PCP etc. Pay it down as hard and fast as you can.
Secondly contribute to your work place pension and get the maximum employer match, that’s a free pay rise if you’re not already doing it.
Thirdly create a cash emergency fund. There’s a lot of debate in the community of what a sufficient emergency fund is. Some say three months worth of expenses, some say three years. No right or wrong answer, but have this in an easy access savings account.
Fourthly invest in low cost tracker funds. Vanguard FTSE global all cap index fund - accumulation is probably the most popular for those wanting FI. You get a bit of everything and - crucially - the fees are low. Fidelity and other companies offer similar funds though, the provider isn’t really important just avoid high fee financial advisers like St James’ Place etc.
That’s it, then you wait. The nuance is your savings rate and your annual expenses, and everyone is different in that respect. People talk about fat fi and lean fi. If you want luxury holidays and fancy cars post retirement you’ll need a bigger pot. If you’re happy living in a van and foraging berries you’ll hardly need anything. Naturally most people are somewhere in the middle.
Mr Money Moustache made a famous blog post more than ten years ago now - https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/01/13/the-shockingly-simple-math-behind-early-retirement/ - it’s still regularly talked about and his table is broadly correct.

[The Moonster]

If you think someone on a minimum wage, zero hour contract can afford to put money towards a pension, an emergency fund and further investments from one paycheck then you're all but proving my point. This stuff is for people with disposable income. Which is fine, but some of it comes across as preachy and that everyone can just do it if they wanted to.