Russian invasion of Ukraine

[dorlomin]

The guy waving hello or something at the centre is Dmitry Rogozin. 

His sign says "Whites of all countries Unite!". I know him mostly as the clown currently running Roscomos. He is running that as he is in the dog house and screwed up his former job as Putins Deputy Prime Minister. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dmitry_Rogozin#/media/File:Expedition_57_Preflight_(NHQ201810100018)_(cropped).jpg

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dmitry_Rogozin

One of the few non ex KGB in the core of the Siloviki, his political career was mostly running Nazi lite parties to pull votes from the likes of the National Bolshoviks into parties that were simply fronts for United Russia politicians and could ensure the Duma was stacked with opposition parties that were actually simply pro Putin.

Someone with a raging hard on for Putin posted  a news Twitter account with 1500 followers (few posts above mine) talking about 200 odd people from a small battalion that is now hors de combat. Meanwhile the man hand picked by Putin to be his 2IC ran neo nazi fronts for him. He also has a long history with Russia taking over bits of land that are not really Russian. All the wailing about NATO expansion, Rogozin was part of the group that took Transetstria in 1992. So yeah... that old chestnut eh. 

In Ukraine's last parliamentary elections the far right got 2% of the vote in the last elections. This is in a Europe of AfD, le Pen and Orban. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Ukrainian_parliamentary_election

 The only reason Azov gained anything in Ukraine was they had the discipline to hold their ground in Mariupol and prevent it falling to the "little green men" when Luhansk and Donetsk fell. That right, the reason they are anything more than a blip on the radar is Russias actual interventions. 

This is all irrelevant. Its just the edgelords and tankies left trying to find a scrap to fight over. The 3 or 4 of them can and should be dismissed. The Russian state was set up to be a facade for a defacto coup by ex KGB people who planted bombs that blew up entire apartment buildings to justify their flattening of Grozny. There is an aspect to Putin that tends to pass a lot of people by, he is from the generation that grew up without fathers in a country that was a complete wreck. The streets of Leningrad were a mix of Lord of the Flies and The Wire for the young Russians boys. The gangs ran the place, some of these gang members ended up in the KGB getting trained up with the skills and fieldcraft of a world leading spy agency and secret police force. 

These guys found themselves out of jobs in the early 90s and often re-contacted their underworld connections setting up scams, sidelines and trying to make a buck in the chaos of Communism imploding. Among them some got into politics or business and mostly both. The smartest, nastiest and most brutal edged out the liberals, social democrats, dreamers and others in politics. They coalesced around Putin's rise inside the countries political machinery until the soft coup that ousted Yeltsin. 

The Yeltsin oligarchs are the ex managers and party officials who linked up with the underworld to assist their take over of state assets. These are what people think of when they think of Oligarch. The Siloviki are those who rose along with Putin, ultranationalists, the beaten middle managers of the Soviet security state and their gangster allies, who worked with army and police to "reform" Russia and grow it back into a strong state again. 

The poisoned politicians, chucked people asking the wrong questions out of windows, murdered journalists, started wars, interfered with elections and supported extremists around the world. All to sow as much chaos on the outside and build a managed "democracy" on the inside. Their plan was to use the managerial oligarchs to run the country, ignore their corruption, to get filthy rich themselves and at the same time return Russia to being a great power. 

They also have adopted a real end of the world version of Orthodox Christianity. At first I thought all the religion was just for show. But they seem to believe they are on some kind of crusade to keep Europe white and free of gays and feminists. There is a reason these people are kindred spirits with Donald fucking Trump. The corruption, the venality, the sense of crusading for a Tucker Carlson version of western values. Though with eastern characteristics and incense. (aint just Catholics and Anglicans who go for smells and  bells)

Look beyond the smoke too see who is throwing it and why. 

 

 

 

Edited May 21, 2022 by dorlomin

[welshbairn]

One thing we've learnt is that when proper invading fascists use "nazi" as a slur, it loses its meaning. 

[LongTimeLurker]

Not that it matters much but the DNR forces did inirially hold Mariupol in 2014 along with Kramatorsk and Sloviansk until the Ukrainian army successfully counterattacked. Think Azov's exploits in the Mariupol area came after the Russian army intervened to prevent the DNR and LNR's total collapse around Donetsk and Luhansk.

The fiction that only volunteers were involved was maintained at that point so that Germany, France and Vlad could strong arm Poroshenko into accepting the Minsk peace plan and Gazprom could continue on its merry way with Ukraine as a transit route to the EU.

[Detournement]

"I know him mostly as"

"A mix of Lord of the Flies and The Wire"

I love this shit.

Edited May 21, 2022 by Detournement

[vikingTON]

22 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

One thing we've learnt is that when proper invading fascists use "nazi" as a slur, it loses its meaning. 

Among morons who don't understand what 'fascism' means - and so use it as a slur themselves - sure.

[D Angelo Barksdale]

6 minutes ago, Detournement said:

"I know him mostly as"

"A mix of Lord of the Flies and The Wire"

I love this shit.

Think it was @Genuine Hibs Fan who described him as 'the Oz Katerji of P&B'

[welshbairn]

43 minutes ago, virginton said:

Among morons who don't understand what 'fascism' means - and so use it as a slur themselves - sure.

How would you describe Putin's political mindset then?

[Bairnardo]

As I understand it, the hot take here is that we all hate Nazis*, and so Ukraine having Nazis in their army justifies and invasion and indiscriminate killing of civilians....


*We hate them because of their invading and indiscriminate killing tho.... Dont we?

[Genuine Hibs Fan]

41 minutes ago, Detective Jimmy McNulty said:

Think it was @Genuine Hibs Fan who described him as 'the Oz Katerji of P&B'

I don't think that was one of mine but whoever said it is a good lad. Your team's just won a cup but it's imperative to defend the honour of the Azov battalion. It's some life 

[dirty dingus]

Eastern Europe is a hotbed of steroid munching right wingers, Ukraine accepting them as a heroic battle group doesn't look good and they have to accept that. In geopolitics the politicians seem to have very flexible views on who to accept fighting your battles as long as they themselves or their folk aren't directly engaging. 

[Jacksgranda]

9 hours ago, Genuine Hibs Fan said:

I don't think that was one of mine but whoever said it is a good lad. Your team's just won a cup but it's imperative to defend the honour of the Azov battalion. It's some life 

When did this happen?

[ICTChris]

Russian troops are attacking Severodonetsk in significant numbers, they have also destroyed the main bridge out of the city, it was previously destroyed in 2014 and rebuilt.

Seems like this is the main battle now.

[Moomintroll]

9 hours ago, dirty dingus said:

Eastern Europe is a hotbed of steroid munching right wingers, Ukraine accepting them as a heroic battle group doesn't look good and they have to accept that. In geopolitics the politicians seem to have very flexible views on who to accept fighting your battles as long as they themselves or their folk aren't directly engaging. 

Nailed it, there are good people & arseholes in every Country. Eastern Europe have a lot of 'Roid rage Skinhead Rasict Fascists, There are a lot of Homophobic, Intolerant Muslims in North Africa & the Middle and Near East & everywhere on the Planet, don't even start me on Team GB and the 'Muricans with our robust Christianity & Imposition of our Colonial ways 

[LongTimeLurker]

1 hour ago, ICTChris said:

Russian troops are attacking Severodonetsk in significant numbers, they have also destroyed the main bridge out of the city, it was previously destroyed in 2014 and rebuilt.

Seems like this is the main battle now.

The Russians managed to breakthrough the Ukrainian 2014 ceasefire line fortifications at Popasna, so if the failed pontoon bridge where they recently lost about 80 armoured vehicles and 500 men on the Northern Donets river at Bilohorivka had worked, the Ukrainians would have been facing another Mariupol scenario. It will take longer for the Russians to encircle Severodonetsk and Lysychansk from only the Popasna direction but the Russian army could have one last major victory there.

2 hours ago, Jacksgranda said:

When did this happen?

Think the target was dorlomin as a Rangers fan shortly after the Scottish Cup victory because he was pointing out to the resident far left types (correctly IMO) that Putin is not leading a leftist crusade against global capitalism and neo-Nazi influence in Ukraine but a right wing populist kleptocracy that has its own skeletons in the cupboard where far right politics is concerned.

Edited May 22, 2022 by LongTimeLurker

[Albus Bulbasaur]

13 hours ago, Bairnardo said:

As I understand it, the hot take here is that we all hate Nazis*, and so Ukraine having Nazis in their army justifies and invasion and indiscriminate killing of civilians....


*We hate them because of their invading and indiscriminate killing tho.... Dont we?

It's all about saving face on a football forum after showing yourself to be a moron with ridiculously dim takes earlier in the thread and disappearing for a month. 

Important stuff. 

[LongTimeLurker]

translation: we are ready to help you retake Transnistria, you've got our number why don't you use it...

[ICTChris]

Michel Goya blogpost about the progress of the war. He used to do these as Twitter threads but this one seems to be a blogpost.

https://lavoiedelepee.blogspot.com/2022/05/point-de-situation-des-operations-en_21.html
 

 

[Detournement]

The Poles have lost the plot. 

 

[Abdul_Latif]

1 hour ago, Detournement said:

The Poles have lost the plot. 

 

NS will be along any minute to virtue signal that an independent Scotland would do it.

[Guest]

11 hours ago, LongTimeLurker said:

he was pointing out to the resident far left types (correctly IMO) that Putin is not leading a leftist crusade against global capitalism and neo-Nazi influence in Ukraine but a right wing populist kleptocracy that has its own skeletons in the cupboard where far right politics is concerned.

The only outright Putin/Russia support I’ve seen from far left public figures has come not from any intellectuals but rather from a handful of journalists. An example would be Max Blumenthal. Their reasoning is a crude, reductionist understanding of anti-imperialism where they support any force they perceive as being opposed to US interests, on that basis alone. So they do actually know the Russian government is a far right shitshow but they support it anyway due to its perceived opposition to US interests. These folk call themselves “multipolarists” as they believe having multiple regional powers balancing each other out in the world would be better than the current US-led hegemony. It seems that for Blumenthal and friends, Aleksandr Dugin was the likely source of their conversion to that way of thinking. Blumenthal doesn’t disclose who he receives his funding from likely because its Russia.

(I know you were referring to folk commenting on this thread but I haven't been reading it often enough to give opinion on that. So thought I'd chip in with the "public figure" state of play instead).