Suspect Device Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 14 minutes ago, Scott Steiner said: Interesting post mate. I don't really see abortion fundamentally as a left or right issue, but sadly over the years it's become that way, however I'm absolutely on the side of the children with that one. That is part of the argument is it not? When is it a child? 6 weeks, 12 weeks, 28 weeks? Best not to get bogged down on one point in this but it's a strange dichotomy when right wing supposed libertarians become very authoritarian when it is a question of a woman's rights, I'm a little right wing on some things but mostly libertarian slight left on most. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Steiner Posted January 3, 2022 Author Share Posted January 3, 2022 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Suspect Device said: That is part of the argument is it not? When is it a child? 6 weeks, 12 weeks, 28 weeks? Best not to get bogged down on one point in this but it's a strange dichotomy when right wing supposed libertarians become very authoritarian when it is a question of a woman's rights, I'm a little right wing on some things but mostly libertarian slight left on most. For me it's an individual, living human being at the moment of conception, which is when it has it's own DNA. I'm not judging anyone who has an abortion and know women who've had several (they weren't rape victims, but just didn't want the pregnancy), but just can't see any moral justification for it other than when the mother's life is at risk. Saving the lives of these unborn women and men does more for women's rights than anything IMO. When I look at the arguments against abortion I don't see authoritarianism or sexism, but compassion and an urge to save lives. Edited January 3, 2022 by Scott Steiner 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suspect Device Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 1 minute ago, Scott Steiner said: For me it's an individual, living human being at the moment of conception, which is when it has it's own DNA. I'm not judging anyone who has an abortion and know women who've had several (they weren't rape victims, but just didn't want the pregnancy), but just can't see any moral justification for it other than when the mother's life is at risk. When I look at the arguments against abortion I don't see authoritarianism or sexism, but compassion and an urge to save lives. Although I'd say that abortion as an extreme form of birth control is wrong, I still believe in the fundamental principle of a woman's right to choose. In my ideal world, people would never need to because the contraception would be widely used because the education and openness about sex and it's consequences would be far better than it is just now. Just re-took that political compass test to see if anything was different since the last time. I'm slightly more libertarian but still left wing. I know it's skewed but I don't know any other test. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Steiner Posted January 3, 2022 Author Share Posted January 3, 2022 6 minutes ago, Suspect Device said: Although I'd say that abortion as an extreme form of birth control is wrong, I still believe in the fundamental principle of a woman's right to choose. In my ideal world, people would never need to because the contraception would be widely used because the education and openness about sex and it's consequences would be far better than it is just now. Just re-took that political compass test to see if anything was different since the last time. I'm slightly more libertarian but still left wing. I know it's skewed but I don't know any other test. Fair play mate. In my ideal world abortion would be banned and people wouldn't have sex until they are married I'm going to do that political compass test. Got a link? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Angelo Barksdale Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 Abortion is a settled issue in this country anyhow, with the majority correctly recognising a woman's right to choose. It'll never become a hot button topic topic like in the US thankfully, despite the best efforts of culture war weirdos. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suspect Device Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 1 minute ago, Scott Steiner said: Fair play mate. In my ideal world abortion would be banned and people wouldn't have sex until they are married I'm going to do that political compass test. Got a link? The Political Compass Like I say, it seems skewed to make everyone seem more left wing than they are but if you come out as on the left of the axis, then I'll be shocked. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat(The most tip top) Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 Although I'd say that abortion as an extreme form of birth control is wrong, I still believe in the fundamental principle of a woman's right to choose. In my ideal world, people would never need to because the contraception would be widely used because the education and openness about sex and it's consequences would be far better than it is just now. Just re-took that political compass test to see if anything was different since the last time. I'm slightly more libertarian but still left wing. I know it's skewed but I don't know any other test. It’s possible to think something is bad without wanting to make it illegal.That can be a challenge sometimes Furthermore it should be possible to disapprove of things while accepting that you don’t have legitimate jurisdiction over that decision That’s even harder 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suspect Device Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Kima Greggs said: Abortion is a settled issue in this country anyhow, with the majority correctly recognising a woman's right to choose. It'll never become a hot button topic topic like in the US thankfully, despite the best efforts of culture war weirdos. It's still not a completely settled issue because there are still some (usually religious weirdo) folk who are against it but we're nowhere near the US in that respect. Does Northern Ireland not have slightly different laws still? (Even with the recent changes) Edit: I wonder how much more left wing libertarian I would be if I didn't believe in the death penalty in some cases. There are a couple of questions on that test which I know would put me in the right wing/authoritarian category so I must be more left wing when it comes to economics. Edited January 3, 2022 by Suspect Device 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Angelo Barksdale Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 3 minutes ago, Suspect Device said: It's still not a completely settled issue because there are still some (usually religious weirdo) folk who are against it but we're nowhere near the US in that respect. Does Northern Ireland not have slightly different laws still? (Even with the recent changes) It's settled insofar as there's no political will or any meaningful movement to change it outside of culture war weirdos, reactionary ghouls and old men shouting at clouds. I'm not sure about N.Ireland, but Failed Statelet gonna Failed Statelet I guess ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Steiner Posted January 3, 2022 Author Share Posted January 3, 2022 (edited) The only reason abortion is settled over here is the amount of pro-choice propaganda we're force fed as well as well-meaning politicians/media figures being scared to speak up due to the fear of being labelled. Scan technology as well as scientific advances in the identification of DNA, realisation of when the child feels pain and develops organs/senses/a brain/a heartbeat as well as the harmful effects of abortion on the mother mean that attitudes could easily swing back some day. In the USA we've had promising signs of hope from recent decisions regarding Texas and Mississippi. I doubt 'Roe v Wade' will be overturned completely, but may eventually be largely rendered obsolete. Interesting to note that 'Roe' is now a pro-life activist, as are many who witness the horrors of what abortion actually is such as ex-planned parenthood boss Abby Johnson. All is not lost. Edited January 3, 2022 by Scott Steiner 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suspect Device Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 Like I said, let's not get stuck on one issue. This is about politics in general. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 Think I've moved further to the bottom left corner as I've got older and wiser. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoda Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 15 hours ago, Scott Steiner said: I agree about small government 18 hours ago, Scott Steiner said: The banks should absolutely be nationalised IMO. 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Steiner Posted January 3, 2022 Author Share Posted January 3, 2022 Not far from what I expected, and confirms my deeply held belief that the paradigm has shifted to the left over the years to the extent that people are branded far-right for having opinions which are, in reality, actually quite moderate. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 1 minute ago, Scott Steiner said: Not far from what I expected, and confirms my deeply held belief that the paradigm has shifted to the left over the years to the extent that people are branded far-right for having opinions which are, in reality, actually quite moderate. Not surprising given you rail against neoliberal economics and want to nationalise the banks. You're fundamentally on the national socialist end of the spectrum. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Steiner Posted January 3, 2022 Author Share Posted January 3, 2022 7 minutes ago, yoda said: Your decision to leave out the words that followed the first quotation is an interesting one 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Steiner Posted January 3, 2022 Author Share Posted January 3, 2022 Just now, welshbairn said: Not surprising given you rail against neoliberal economics and want to nationalise the banks. You're fundamentally on the national socialist end of the spectrum. Instead of S Steiner, my username should really be C Kyle. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fullerene Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 I remember when Robin Day did Question Time and sometimes Enoch Powell would be on the panel. Although he was a good debater, he was definitely seen as being hard right and nobody would want to be seen to agree with him. Nowadays his opinions are fairly common place - especially regarding Brexit. I would describe that as a shift to the right. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 4 minutes ago, Fullerene said: I remember when Robin Day did Question Time and sometimes Enoch Powell would be on the panel. Although he was a good debater, he was definitely seen as being hard right and nobody would want to be seen to agree with him. Nowadays his opinions are fairly common place - especially regarding Brexit. I would describe that as a shift to the right. I think that compass is skewed to middle ground America which has moved massively to the right in the last 50 years. The Democrats are now to the right of the Christian Democrats in Germany. They've got a piece on it. https://www.politicalcompass.org/counterpoint-20211001-german-election 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotThePars Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 12 hours ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said: Centre right, well i mean do we actually have any centre right parties? Maybe Tories under May? Not sure? Tony Blair's Labour 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.