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Scotland v Ukraine


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Just now, HuttonDressedAsLahm said:

Are we really doing this? The English language allows for emphasis where the literal value is clearly not true, but the underlying point is observably correct.

For your benefit, I’ll re-phrase: Wales have a valuable habit of winning games with the odds stacked against them. On occasion, any team can do that, but they seem to be able to ride their luck when needed.

That better?

Yes, that does clarify things.

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If we could change the rules to give England no right to win games, I'd be all ears.

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At what point do Wales actually become the favourites?  I'd say they were the other day against Ukraine.  At home with Gareth Bale playing, a player miles better than anything Ukraine have, and a squad who play like they're on speed when they play at the Cardiff City stadium.

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2 minutes ago, TheScarf said:

At what point do Wales actually become the favourites?  I'd say they were the other day against Ukraine.  At home with Gareth Bale playing, a player miles better than anything Ukraine have, and a squad who play like they're on speed when they play at the Cardiff City stadium.

Agreed. And it'll piss off some folk, but they'd have been the favourites against us in the final too. It's pretty undeniable that they've been more successful than us in recent times. Maybe for as long as ten to fifteen years.

The worrying part is that they've done it by seemingly appointing former players at random, some with little managerial experience. Christ, England are currently having their most successful spell in almost sixty years with a failed Middlesborough manager.

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10 minutes ago, BFTD said:

Agreed. And it'll piss off some folk, but they'd have been the favourites against us in the final too. It's pretty undeniable that they've been more successful than us in recent times. Maybe for as long as ten to fifteen years.

The worrying part is that they've done it by seemingly appointing former players at random, some with little managerial experience. Christ, England are currently having their most successful spell in almost sixty years with a failed Middlesborough manager.

Correct.  It's mildly infuriating that they can seemingly seamlessly switch between relatively inexperienced managers, with no ill effects.  None of their managers in recent times have exactly struck anyone as exceptional, but something clearly works.  Makes a mockery of some of the obsessions that we have north of the border, but then our mediocre managers return mediocre results...

They have actually been remarkably consistent since 2013-2014.  That coincides pretty closely to when Bale and Ramsey started banging them in.

It is incredibly petty, but I do look forward to the inevitable collapse when those two start winding up.  I have convinced myself that it's coming.  If they're able to keep qualifying with the likes of Dan James and Kieffer Moore leading the line, then we seriously need to test the water down there.

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On 06/06/2022 at 03:57, F_T_Y said:

Brennan Johnson came off the bench yesterday would walk into the Scotland team, they have better players and a better manager than us so no surprise they won.

They also benefited massively from our game being delayed, having a 3 month wait for one game while Ukraine had to play competitive matches twice in 5 days after a long lay off.

Despite that long lay off they waltzed past us. By all accounts they were better against Wales than against us.

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7 minutes ago, HuttonDressedAsLahm said:

Correct.  It's mildly infuriating that they can seemingly seamlessly switch between relatively inexperienced managers, with no ill effects.  None of their managers in recent times have exactly struck anyone as exceptional, but something clearly works.  Makes a mockery of some of the obsessions that we have north of the border, but then our mediocre managers return mediocre results...

They have actually been remarkably consistent since 2013-2014.  That coincides pretty closely to when Bale and Ramsey started banging them in.

It is incredibly petty, but I do look forward to the inevitable collapse when those two start winding up.  I have convinced myself that it's coming.  If they're able to keep qualifying with the likes of Dan James and Kieffer Moore leading the line, then we seriously need to test the water down there.

Yeah, it's inevitable they'll slide back down to the lower seedings, but it must be great being Welsh right now.

One of the things I find odd is that they do seem to produce one or two top-class goalscorers with each generation. It was Ian Rush and Mark Hughes when I was young, and they almost made it to a couple of tournaments. Weird that it's something we never seem to have.

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37 minutes ago, TheScarf said:

At what point do Wales actually become the favourites?  I'd say they were the other day against Ukraine.  At home with Gareth Bale playing, a player miles better than anything Ukraine have, and a squad who play like they're on speed when they play at the Cardiff City stadium.

They didn't play like that though - they were fairly poor and got lucky.

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1 minute ago, ArabFC said:

They didn't play like that though - they were fairly poor and got lucky.

They definitely got 2 huge bits of luck with the deflection and the non-penalty for Ukraine, but they clearly play with a high tempo against everyone at home and still created a lot of chances on Saturday.  It was the polar opposite of the Scotland side last week.

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57 minutes ago, TheScarf said:

They definitely got 2 huge bits of luck with the deflection and the non-penalty for Ukraine, but they clearly play with a high tempo against everyone at home and still created a lot of chances on Saturday.  It was the polar opposite of the Scotland side last week.

They were poor in the first half but after their goal the confidence soared and they were the better team. Ukraine were then playing like Scotland did to try and get back in the game. Wales more than deserved the win.

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3 minutes ago, BingMcCrosby said:

Charlie Nicholas in the paper saying it was a mistake to play Hickey at right wing back as he's not very experienced there.

Then goes on to suggest we should have played Armstrong or Christie there instead 🤔

I thought he was being sarcastic when he said that tbh.

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Nice extra bit from John McGinn about the chance he missed against Ukraine.

Quote

I promised I wouldn’t watch it again but I woke up the next morning and then had to watch it back. In that split second you don’t see the other side, you make a decision at the time and it was the wrong one. Looking back and analysing it, analysing it in detail, it’s easy to say I should have gone to the other side.

The disappointing thing for me in my Scotland career is that it’s always the easier ones I seem to miss. I score the more challenging ones, so I have to practice those moments and don’t be so keen to score. I remember looking up at the ball and seeing their goalkeeper and a defender moving the other way. I tried to be too precise with it and paid the price for it. After it, the boys were saying ‘why is it all the difficult ones you score?’ and I was like, cheers lads. It’s not as if I’ve not been thinking about it every day.

You can sit and dwell on it but you can also take it the other way. Steven Naismith was brilliant with me. He was quick to remind me we might not have been in the play-off if it wasn’t for some of my contributions. When I put it into perspective, I wasn’t too bad and it’s about getting back onto the horse and trying to help the team again. Reflect is probably the wrong word because I was hurting – and hurting badly. That’s part of learning and being a player, you make a decision in a split second. On this occasion it was the wrong one and it will probably live with me for a long, long time, but you can either dwell on it, keep looking at it and keep thinking what you could have changed. Or you can go out and try to score nineteen times like I did against Armenia on Wednesday, trying to avenge it.

It didn’t work on Wednesday but I will do the exact same thing on Saturday. My goal return for Scotland has been pretty good so I am keen to add to it, I’m sure a chance will come and I need to take it. Don’t think about what’s happening next and focus on the moment. It still hurts me the same way it hurts everyone else in the country. It was a really disappointing night for me and for everyone but it’s one we are really keen to avenge. Even if it does take two years or four years, it’s one we will definitely do.

John McGinn

https://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/international/aston-villas-john-mcginn-opens-up-on-why-he-broke-scotland-promise-he-made-to-himself-3727724

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