Celtic v Hibernian. League Cup final, 19th December

[kingjoey]

2 minutes ago, Leith Green said:

100%

At least a couple of “really’s?” in there.

Is he seriously saying that if there had been a huge disparity in the number of Celtic and Rangers tickets sold for the semis, then that would have been reflected in their final allocations? Aye right.

And since when has the SPFL actually said that the number of tickets a side gets for a Final is dependent on how many they sell for the semi? Absolute bollocks and utter shite. I’m as annoyed about this as I would be if Aberdeen had been the club involved. 

[Guest Bob Mahelp]

30 minutes ago, Leith Green said:

His latest reply !

 

Thanks for your further comments ya Hibby p***k

While we would always ask competing clubs what numbers of tickets they would expect to sell, we would exercise our own independent judgement, based on many years of organising cup ties at neutral venues.  It is the job of SPFL staff to determine the fairest outcome in terms of stadium splits and ticket allocations, taking into account all the circumstances.

It is not the case that the SPFL could have started off with a 50/50 split and then, if Hibernian demand were insufficient, then moved to a different split.  The first decision on splits is always whether to split the North Stand 50/50 or 100/0 (no other splits are possible in the North Stand).  There is not scope, due to the configuration of the stadium to reverse this initial decision.

You are not correct in relation to numbers of tickets sold by each of Celtic and Rangers for last weekend’s ties.  The actual numbers were circa 37,000 and 34,000 respectively, which would have justified a 50/50 split of the stadium if both those teams had reached the final.

Regardless of how many tickets are sold by Celtic and Hibernian, each club will benefit equally in financial terms from the gate money.

Finally, I note your comments regarding the location of Hampden.  However, Hampden Park is the national stadium and where the Scottish FA and the SPFL are both based.

I did laugh outloud at the 'Hibby p***k' bit...

 

[Guest Bob Mahelp]

3 minutes ago, kingjoey said:

At least a couple of “really’s?” in there.

Is he seriously saying that if there had been a huge disparity in the number of Celtic and Rangers tickets sold for the semis, then that would have been reflected in their final allocations? Aye right.

And since when has the SPFL actually said that the number of tickets a side gets for a Final is dependent on how many they sell for the semi? Absolute bollocks and utter shite. I’m as annoyed about this as I would be if Aberdeen had been the club involved. 

So we should be, because what happens to Hibs can be repeated with Aberdeen and Hearts (obviously the only 3 clubs outside the OF that have the potential to sell a 50% allocation). 

This is obviously an SPFL tournament, but this precedent could well be applied to Scottish cup finals if the SFA decide to go down that road. 

Not that I'm thinking that Aberdeen will get to one soon, but I was convinced this matter was settled when we kicked up hell in 2000. 

Obviously we've regressed. Cheers Doncaster, you fucking muppet. 

 

[gannonball]

Thoughts go out to the Hibs fans I hear are setting off tomorrow for the perilous journey along the M8 to make the final, god speed. 

[Chonky]

45 minutes ago, Leith Green said:

 

It is not the case that the SPFL could have started off with a 50/50 split and then, if Hibernian demand were insufficient, then moved to a different split.  The first decision on splits is always whether to split the North Stand 50/50 or 100/0 (no other splits are possible in the North Stand).  There is not scope, due to the configuration of the stadium to reverse this initial decision.

I call bull****.

Other splits are possible, but require further stewarding, police and inconvenience for fans. They are taking the easy way out. 

 

[Dunfermline Don]

What was the issue with fans in the top tier. I take it some of the Ugly Sisters had the top tier at the weekend. If that was the case it does stink of double standards as I remember Aberdeen being denied further tickets for the 2014 league cup final for security reasons as ICT had the lower tier at the east end of Parkhead. It resulted in that part of the ground being empty when more people could have been at the game.

[Lyle Lanley]

https://www.hiberniandirect.co.uk/cup-final-products/do-we-look-happy-t-shirt-snr

 

[Insert Amusing Pseudonym]

Genuinely got the rage at that Doncaster reply.  

It is the job of SPFL staff to determine the fairest outcome in terms of stadium splits and ticket allocations, taking into account all the circumstances.

and then completely disregard the fairness aspect and give Celtic or Rangers the biggest share we can get away with.

Twat

[Aim Here]

20 minutes ago, Dunfermline Don said:

What was the issue with fans in the top tier. I take it some of the Ugly Sisters had the top tier at the weekend. If that was the case it does stink of double standards as I remember Aberdeen being denied further tickets for the 2014 league cup final for security reasons as ICT had the lower tier at the east end of Parkhead. It resulted in that part of the ground being empty when more people could have been at the game.

Rangers fans were on the upper tier overlooking the East stand Hibees. There were at least two projectiles rained down on the Hibs fans from above; one an empty Buckie bottle that I saw on twitter, and one something wet that gave a smack (probably a plastic water bottle or similar) that landed a couple of rows in front of me.

Edited November 23, 2021 by Aim Here

[Leith Green]

31 minutes ago, Bob Mahelp said:

So we should be, because what happens to Hibs can be repeated with Aberdeen and Hearts (obviously the only 3 clubs outside the OF that have the potential to sell a 50% allocation). 

To be fair, that is exactly what most Hibbies are saying.

While I have some level of sympathy with a club who cant get all their ST holders in to a national final, it is hardly the fault of Hearts, Aberdeen and Hibs, Dundee Utd, St Johnstone etc that we have not hoovered up a huge chunk of gullible village idiots on the premise of hating prods/cafflics.

In truth, there are many clubs outside Rangers and Celtic who have commendably loyal supports - I mean, all joking aside Hibs conversion rate in finals is fucking shocking, the fact we get anyone along to Hampden is a miracle.

I know for a fact that Hibs board are spitting feathers about all of this, and while I dont expect the SPFL to back down this year, I would hope that future finals (with non Rangers / Celtic) are not allocated as farcically.

[AJF]

I vaguely remember this issue being raised before and there was an explanation given that if a 50/50 allocation was given then it meant there was a risk of empty seats if one of the clubs couldn't sell their tickets because if they each sold tickets for the North Stand then they wouldn't be able to pull back the segregation line either way to accommodate more/less fans for either side.

Putting aside the fact that Hibs would sell out their allocation, if this was the reasoning, then would it not be possible for each team to hold back tickets in the North Stand to be sold last, and do it section by section, thus giving them both the opportunity to sell their full allocation while also allowing for the option of unsold tickets to be returned without impacting segregation and leading to empty seats?

[AJF]

40 minutes ago, Lyle Lanley said:

https://www.hiberniandirect.co.uk/cup-final-products/do-we-look-happy-t-shirt-snr

 

Tinpot thread surely 

[Leith Green]

2 minutes ago, AJF said:

would it not be possible for each team to hold back tickets in the North Stand to be sold last, and do it section by section

Not according to Neil D - he said (to someone else) in an email reply that the North has to be split 50/50 or not at all - obviously your section by section suggestion seems eminently sensible but apparently cant be accommodated.

[AJF]

11 minutes ago, Leith Green said:

Not according to Neil D - he said (to someone else) in an email reply that the North has to be split 50/50 or not at all - obviously your section by section suggestion seems eminently sensible but apparently cant be accommodated.

Seems like a "just because" kind of argument without actually explaining why. Ridiculous.

[pansjambo]

35 minutes ago, Leith Green said:

Not according to Neil D - he said (to someone else) in an email reply that the North has to be split 50/50 or not at all - obviously your section by section suggestion seems eminently sensible but apparently cant be accommodated.

As Doncaster states that he is merely a mouthpiece for all SPFL clubs I take it he has canvassed opinion before reaching another ludicrous decision...Nah probably not

[Snifter Pee Rot]

Nice to know Hampden (the so called national stadium) is no longer a neutral venue for cup finals if either of Doncaster's favourite member clubs are involved. Must be a unique situation for domestic cups across the UEFA jurisdiction but is no shock coming from this corrupt to the core individual. The split for a final should always be even unless one club cannot sell their full allocation which wouldn't happen here. Akin to letting Celtic field extra players and saying well their squad is bigger so it's only fair they get to play them. Doncaster's logic and poor shoddy governance. 

[saint in exile]

Hopefully it will galvanise both the fans and players of Hibs and make it all the sweeter.Time to stop bottling finals boys.There will certainly be more than 50% of viewers at home supporting you anyway.

[Buckets]

8 hours ago, Leith Green said:

It is important also to note that these numbers are initial allocations only and there will likely be the opportunity for further allocations to both clubs depending on sales.

Wonder how many extra tickets there could be. If Hibs sell out their 17,500 within a week as someone said, hopefully there will be another couple of thousand made available to them. 

 

Edited November 23, 2021 by Buckets

[10menwent2mow]

11 hours ago, Leith Green said:

Not according to Neil D - he said (to someone else) in an email reply that the North has to be split 50/50 or not at all - obviously your section by section suggestion seems eminently sensible but apparently cant be accommodated.

As I said elsewhere, that's easily sorted by doing away with Rangers and Celtic ends and splitting the stadium along a side by side basis and not end by end. Apparently the North Stand only holds just over 9,000. Surely any club would be able to sell the whole of that and then it can be done section by section in the East and West stands until such time as they can't sell anymore. Sounds like it's going to be the case that Hibs will have the Rangers end plus a few thousand seats in the South while Celtic get half the south and the whole of the North plus their end. So the majority of Hibs fans who get a ticket, will be stuck behind a goal with shite seats. It's a fucking disgrace.  

[Leith Green]

7 hours ago, Buckets said:

Wonder how many extra tickets there could be. If Hibs sell out their 17,500 within a week as someone said, hopefully there will be another couple of thousand made available to them. 

I dont think so.

Based on what ND has said, and the initial allocations already published on the SPFL site, it looks like the additional allocations for Hibs might come from areas in the South which would be a few hundred, not a couple of thousand.

Doncasters emailed answer was like hearing from a politician - soundbites which appear to be reasonable but on closer inspection are horseshit.

1 hour ago, 10menwent2mow said:

As I said elsewhere, that's easily sorted by doing away with Rangers and Celtic ends and splitting the stadium along a side by side basis and not end by end. Apparently the North Stand only holds just over 9,000. Surely any club would be able to sell the whole of that and then it can be done section by section in the East and West stands until such time as they can't sell anymore. Sounds like it's going to be the case that Hibs will have the Rangers end plus a few thousand seats in the South while Celtic get half the south and the whole of the North plus their end. So the majority of Hibs fans who get a ticket, will be stuck behind a goal with shite seats. It's a fucking disgrace.  

You are right - apparently STV news last night was running with the "Celtic bigger club" line, so you can see where this goes on the PR front.................

Thing is, nobody is disagreeing that Celtic are a larger club with more fans, but as you know, thats not actually the point.

As we saw a year or so ago, when the SPFL make a decision on something, they dont want to back down.

I dont hold out any hope of a change this time, but do hope that sense prevails in future cup finals - because if it doesnt, then everyone else can look forward to ever reducing allocations, until we are all presented with 10k at best.