VAR in Scottish Football

[Dons_1988]

17 minutes ago, Illgresi said:

I watched the Dons game live yesterday, and have just watched Sportscene highlights of the Old Firm and Rangers* games. The one thing you can say from that evidence pool, is that VAR contributed in all 3 of those games to getting the correct scoreline at full time.

There are other criticisms of course, but getting the correct score at the end of the match is absolutely the main priority of VAR for me. Especially important, that when administered correctly and fairly, it will show clearly how much of an advantage the Old Firm and Rangers* have always had.

This is only true if you believe refereeing decisions are the primary factor in determining a score line. 

[Illgresi]

7 minutes ago, Dons_1988 said:

This is only true if you believe refereeing decisions are the primary factor in determining a score line. 

If you read my comment again, you'll note that I said VAR "contributed".

[ropy]

Is there any sort of VAR report generated at the end of the match i.e. these are the incidents we looked at and the decisions/recommendations made?  Will the referee or the managers find out if the penalty incident at the end of the Aberdeen game was considered?

[Bogbrush1903]

5 minutes ago, ropy said:

Is there any sort of VAR report generated at the end of the match i.e. these are the incidents we looked at and the decisions/recommendations made?  Will the referee or the managers find out if the penalty incident at the end of the Aberdeen game was considered?

I thought VAR called it correctly, neither incident was clear and obvious from the replays available.

[Dons_1988]

19 minutes ago, Illgresi said:

If you read my comment again, you'll note that I said VAR "contributed".

I get that but who is judging what the correct score line is? Motherwell fans will likely disagree on our game anyway. 

This is a multi million pound investment we’re talking about and one weekend has shown there’s loads of grey areas it can’t fix and it shites in the match going experience. 

And before all that, I simply don’t believe that refereeing decisions have materially impacted trophies won and league positions over an extended period of time. I can’t prove that of course, it’s purely speculative but I certainly don’t think aberdeens fortunes have been determined by referees. 

[ropy]

3 minutes ago, Bogbrush1903 said:

I thought VAR called it correctly, neither incident was clear and obvious from the replays available.

My issue at the game was that I didn’t know if it was being considered, I didn’t know if the game was ‘over’, the managers asked the same question.  Did VAR consider it?

Last week there would have been no confusion, the ref missed it, ignored it or felt there was nothing in it.  I would have sworn at the ref and gone home.  This week it was unclear.

[Bogbrush1903]

15 minutes ago, Dons_1988 said:

I get that but who is judging what the correct score line is? Motherwell fans will likely disagree on our game anyway. 

This is a multi million pound investment we’re talking about and one weekend has shown there’s loads of grey areas it can’t fix and it shites in the match going experience. 

And before all that, I simply don’t believe that refereeing decisions have materially impacted trophies won and league positions over an extended period of time. I can’t prove that of course, it’s purely speculative but I certainly don’t think aberdeens fortunes have been determined by referees. 

No what really makes a shite match day experience is when you get a perfectly good early goal ruled offside and you end up losing the match or you concede a fairytale penalty to the gruesomes. If I have to wait a puckle of minutes longer to get a decision based nearer on fact then so be it...

That Hearts vs Celtic game was classic yesterday because VAR was able to 'assist' the referee and linesmen make the correct decisions that didn't necessarily always benefit the big team.

And, of course, refereeing decisions have influenced tournaments. What about Maradona's helping hand in the quarter-finals that helped Argentina gain control in 1986? What about Harald Schumachar nearly decapitating Battison in the semi-finals and remaining on the pitch to help his side progress to the final in 1982? What about Ireland failing to qualify for 2002 because of the Henry handball?

Edited October 23, 2022 by Bogbrush1903

[ropy]

Watching the Hearts game highlights.  Hearts first penalty was not called by the ref, then a VAR decision was made once the ball was out of play. Hearts second penalty saw the ball rebound out the park and the ref made the decision. Would the game have continued if the ball was still in play? 

[ropy]

Also in the Hearts game, the Ralston goal was ruled out because of an earlier infringement.  What was the VAR involvement that held the game up for a further minute?

[ropy]

Final one on the Hearts game, the penalty was retaken because of the Hearts player’s encroachment, not the Celtic players.  If Hearts hadn’t encroached the rebounded goal would have been awarded (it wasn’t offside).  Is that correct?

[Bogbrush1903]

1 minute ago, ropy said:

Watching the Hearts game highlights.  Hearts first penalty was not called by the ref, then a VAR decision was made once the ball was out of play. Hearts second penalty saw the ball rebound out the park and the ref made the decision. Would the game have continued if the ball was still in play? 

I think both the issues you raise at Fir Park and Tynecastle are reasonable and justified concerns. It would be good if someone addressed any issues picked up in the opening matches of VAR to the media so there can be clarified (an improved on in the forthcoming weeks).

[VincentGuerin]

1 hour ago, Illgresi said:

I watched the Dons game live yesterday, and have just watched Sportscene highlights of the Old Firm and Rangers* games. The one thing you can say from that evidence pool, is that VAR contributed in all 3 of those games to getting the correct scoreline at full time.

There are other criticisms of course, but getting the correct score at the end of the match is absolutely the main priority of VAR for me. Especially important, that when administered correctly and fairly, it will show clearly how much of an advantage the Old Firm and Rangers* have always had.

What on earth is the 'correct' scoreline in a football match and how do you determine it?

[Illgresi]

3 minutes ago, VincentGuerin said:

What on earth is the 'correct' scoreline in a football match and how do you determine it?

Goals that should have been goals were goals, and goals that weren't goals weren't goals.

[Ric]

I've been a proponent for VAR, so long as there isn't an imbalance in relation to financial outlay as you go down the league. There will be teething problems and in turn not every decision will be right, it's certainly not a silver bullet, but for me the experiment has worked.

Fouls were recognised when they weren't given, and more importantly this was a decision involving the OF, how many times have we seen a ref wave away claims at the time only for Sportscene to show in slow motion the offence was genuine and it was either the ref being poor, or feeling pressurised, not to give it. Same with the encroachment of the penalty. This was called by VAR and again this went against one of the OF. I honestly do not believe either offence would have resulted in the decisions they should have been if VAR was not involved.

We also saw two players who are regularly called out for cheating, Boyle and Porteous, being caught out on VAR doing exactly that; cheating.

I get annoyed with the offside flags being raised so late, but that's not a VAR issue, and VAR while being precise to a level people probably don't want (ie: his hand was just over, how can that be offside) but again that's down to the existing offside rules not VAR itself.

The only incident where I think it "failed" was the Ayunga goal we had chopped off but again that wasn't the fault of VAR but the fault of the officials. I don't think anyone, even the United fans, would consider that not a goal because 1 minute earlier and 60 yards away one of their players massively overplayed some incidental contact.

I completely understand why people get annoyed with the waiting, I'm sure the process will speed up the more it's used.

All in all, though, VAR is simply a system that allows officials to not only watch replays of incidents from multiple angles, but provides them with an opportunity to correct any decision made (or not). If that is the criteria VAR is based on, and not some panacea to improve football overall, then surely VAR has been a success. It achieved what it needed to. Now we just need to work on the referees, and that job will be made 100% easier by having VAR, too.

[Leith Green]

5 minutes ago, Ric said:

We also saw two players who are regularly called out for cheating, Boyle and Porteous, being caught out on VAR doing exactly that; cheating.

Dear god, did a Hibs fan f**k your bird or something?

Fucking oddball

 

 

 

 

[Ric]

3 minutes ago, Leith Green said:

... wah wah wah ..

If anyone is crying it's you. Both of your players were shown trying to cheat on VAR, yet your response is to personally insult others who saw the footage with their own eyes.

[VincentGuerin]

23 minutes ago, Illgresi said:

Goals that should have been goals were goals, and goals that weren't goals weren't goals.

That's completely meaningless.

You must be keen to watch a very boring sport indeed.

[Leith Green]

On 22/10/2022 at 12:54, Ric said:

Are you so myopic you can't see past one of your own players? I'm guessing not. He was found to be cheating last night, you are clearly annoyed about that. In regard to "history of posting increasing levels of shite", care to point to anything in my post that is incorrect? Did he go to SA? Yes. Does that country execute people for disagreeing with religious doctrine? Yes. Did he take his family? No. It's all very transparent. Stop defending these actions, it only reflects badly upon you.

As for @craigkillie trite post, it makes no sense, it's typical low value whataboutery and irrelevant in regard to the topic, but then they know that it's just usual shit posting.

I'm not annoyed about anything except your continued membership of this forum.

You are pathetic, and it's no surprise that most of the decent St M fans ignore your pish as well.

[Ric]

Just now, Leith Green said:

I'm not annoyed about anything except your continued membership of this forum.

You are pathetic, and it's no surprise that most of the decent St M fans ignore your pish as well.

#headsgone

 

[Leith Green]

2 minutes ago, Ric said:

#headsgone

 

Like I said before, you should know, having had at least one wee "break" from P&B.