VAR in Scottish Football

[VincentGuerin]

3 minutes ago, paranoid android said:

You could have just left it there.

The first few weeks of VAR in Scotland have thrown up a few issues - the main one being that very few people understand the laws around handball and how those laws need to be enforced.

It seems that folk were expecting VAR to definitively solve all problems - that's never going to be the case.

My initial thoughts are that I don't like VAR.

However, as a few folk have pointed out, it's overturned some decisions that would have otherwise been called incorrectly.  

I still dinnae like it. 

Back to my nain point, though - Ange is a p***k. 

An interesting feature of Sportsound on Saturday was Michael Stewart being ridiculed/talked over while trying to read the handball law from the IFAB website.

People (often myself included) get the rules wrong all the time, but then the national broadcaster makes fun of the idea of actually knowing them and applying them to the conversation.

When Stewart read out the handball law (in relation to the Dundee Utd penalty) it was basically met with 'his hand was up' patter.

[Thenorthernlight]

2 hours ago, AJF said:

[paranoid android]

24 minutes ago, VincentGuerin said:

An interesting feature of Sportsound on Saturday was Michael Stewart being ridiculed/talked over while trying to read the handball law from the IFAB website.

People (often myself included) get the rules wrong all the time, but then the national broadcaster makes fun of the idea of actually knowing them and applying them to the conversation.

When Stewart read out the handball law (in relation to the Dundee Utd penalty) it was basically met with 'his hand was up' patter.

This is it in a nutshell - whenever pundits discuss a decision, the presenter needs to read the rule, and compare the rule with how the ref has enforced it.

What actually happens is that pundits just go 'Not a pen for me!' 

The world's worst was Scott McDonald - 'there was contact = it's a penalty' - thick as f**k!

Edited November 8, 2022 by paranoid android

[CoF]

1 hour ago, paranoid android said:

This is it in a nutshell - whenever pundits discuss a decision, the presenter needs to read the rule, and compare the rule with how the ref has enforced it.

What actually happens is that pundits just go 'Not a pen for me!' 

The world's worst was Scott McDonald - 'there was contact = it's a penalty' - thick as f**k!

Aye. There’s definitely merit in discussing the law itself, whether it’s fair, sporting, whatever, and then the second part is the application of the law. We just don’t have the quality of pundit to have worthwhile discussions on these things. 

[Drew Brees]

1 hour ago, paranoid android said:

 

However, as a few folk have pointed out, it's overturned some decisions that would have otherwise been called incorrectly.  

It’s also called incidents incorrectly, like the Celtic pen v livi and the Utd pen v Celtic 

[paranoid android]

26 minutes ago, Drew Brees said:

It’s also called incidents incorrectly, like the Celtic pen v livi and the Utd pen v Celtic 

Do you watch any games not involving celtic?

I suppose what I'm really asking is 'Are you Pat Bonnar?'

Edited November 8, 2022 by paranoid android

[ArabFC]

2 hours ago, paranoid android said:

However, as a few folk have pointed out, it's overturned some decisions that would have otherwise been called incorrectly.  

If a referee gets a decision wrong, I can live with it - it happens.

If the referee makes the correct call, but then VAR intervenes and pressures him into making the wrong decision, it makes me insanely angry.

That may not be rational, but it is what it is.

tl;dr I fcuking despise VAR and all who sail in her!

[Steve McQueen]

3 hours ago, ArabFC said:

If a referee gets a decision wrong, I can live with it - it happens.

If the referee makes the correct call, but then VAR intervenes and pressures him into making the wrong decision, it makes me insanely angry.

That may not be rational, but it is what it is.

tl;dr I fcuking despise VAR and all who sail in her!

If James Browns red card against Killie hadn't been overturned he wouldn't have been able to score against Rangers.

We can all agree that would have been a travesty!

[paranoid android]

1 hour ago, Steve McQueen said:

James Browns red card

Get off - get on off!

[HibeeJibee]

On 06/11/2022 at 23:59, Les Cabbage said:

I’m pretty scunnered with this in all honesty. Since VAR came in Hibs have had 3 games, 1 win and 2 defeats, 5 goals scored, 6 conceded, the results are what they are and they’re not the problem, it’s the removal of the uninterrupted celebrations and anticipation when my team attack.

For the first time ever I’m now debating in my head whether I want to continue to watch my team every week and it’s nothing to do with the football standard because we’ve been a lot worse than this.
...
Everything that you look at and think about relating to football all comes down to watching your team and the excitement of scoring goals to win games. If you don’t have that excitement anymore then what actually is the point in giving it the time of day?

I’ll obviously see how things go between now and the end of the season but I genuinely feel upset because I’m not sure if I can continue my love for football like I’ve had for all my life, it’s all I’ve ever known and f**k knows how else I’ll spend my time but this just has taken all enjoyment away from me. I don’t know if I’m the only one feeling this way but it’s utterly shite.

Take yourself along to some lower league or pyramid matches: especially during next 6 weeks when there aren't Premiership games anyway. Plenty of choice in the Lothians whether SPFL1/2, Lowland or East of Scotland... won't cost you more than a tenner (often less)... plus not a video review in sight. Might recharge your fitba batteries.

[Les Cabbage]

1 hour ago, HibeeJibee said:

Take yourself along to some lower league or pyramid matches: especially during next 6 weeks when there aren't Premiership games anyway. Plenty of choice in the Lothians whether SPFL1/2, Lowland or East of Scotland... won't cost you more than a tenner (often less)... plus not a video review in sight. Might recharge your fitba batteries.

I do that a lot of the time anyway to be fair, currently at 34/42 and aiming to go to Albion Rovers and possibly Kelty during the World Cup.

Issue is if my emotional investment in Hibs is dropping, it’ll never really be replaced by anyone else, I go and watch Edinburgh City/FC Edinburgh/Edinburgh/whatever they’re called now a fair bit and it’s just not the same.

[LIVIFOREVER]

Can't say VAR has stopped me celebrating our goals with the same enthusiasm as before, but then you have to wait on the ref getting a VAR check as the opposition were ready to restart the game from the centre circle, and signaling the goal stands. The hand ball pens are getting unreal though, the stats for post VAR hand balls will be going through the roof, can't think of seeing 3 hand ball pens given at a Livi match before.

Edited November 9, 2022 by LIVIFOREVER

[Arch Stanton]

Andrew Dallas involved in a match with three penalties and none of them to his beloved Rangers.

[kingjoey]

After being at the Livi/Aberdeen match last night, and as the VAR system is here to stay, fans in the ground have to be better updated in grounds with no screen. I, and everyone around me, had no idea which team were being looked as being guilty of a penalty because play had been going on and the ball had been in both boxes in the previous 30 seconds or so. 

[buddie06smfc]

7 hours ago, Arch Stanton said:

Andrew Dallas involved in a match with three penalties and none of them to his beloved Rangers.

He’ll get his fix on Saturday. 

[Busta Nut]

My issue with the handball rule is how inconsistent it is. That and they expect everyone to have their arms by their sides at all times.

[Cptn Hooch]

My issue with the handball rule is how inconsistent it is. That and they expect everyone to have their arms by their sides at all times.

100%. I've said the first 2 last night were probably right given the players move their hands towards the ball...only 1 player got booked for it though [emoji2369]. If the 3rd one is a penalty then the Smith one v Celtic is a penalty. A player with his arm out for balance and the ball is headed onto his arm from less than a foot away isn't a penalty. "Ball to hand" seems to have disappeared from the game altogether

[Meathead]

4 hours ago, kingjoey said:

After being at the Livi/Aberdeen match last night, and as the VAR system is here to stay, fans in the ground have to be better updated in grounds with no screen. I, and everyone around me, had no idea which team were being looked as being guilty of a penalty because play had been going on and the ball had been in both boxes in the previous 30 seconds or so. 

This sentiment is expressed often but VAR is only here to stay if fans (specifically season ticket holders) allow it to stay, whether through choice or inaction. Fans largely weren't consulted on its introduction because the clubs assume that most of us will return season after season regardless. They rely on fans as a collective being too myopic, too petty and too disorganised to come together and unite under a common banner. This isn't specific to VAR and also applies to lots of other things we all moan about: ticket prices, games being moved for TV, etc.

We saw what's possible back in 2012 with the vote on admitting Rangers - fans en masse withheld their season ticket money, and eventually the clubs had no choice but to change course and do what we wanted. I don't think the strength of feeling is there at the moment for such a campaign to materialise for the removal of VAR, and maybe it never will be, but the clubs will vote to remove it if a critical mass of their customers withhold their money until that happens.

Edited November 9, 2022 by Meathead

[Bobby_F]

On 06/11/2022 at 09:50, Savage Henry said:

Yesterday, I noticed Sportscene spent a good couple of minutes on a potential St Mirren penalty.  It looked for all the world like one on the TV angles, but I was right in line with it and the County defender played the ball. VAR would have, presumably, a camera at that angle that wasn’t shown on the telly, and so the referee wasn’t consulted. 

Two County players went in to the tackle.  One got the ball; the other wiped the Saints player out.

Absolute stonewaller.

I've genuinely no idea why Collum didn't alert the ref.

It's not like he doesn't like getting involved.

Why I remember when, in the pre-VAR days, as a 4th official in a match involving the same two teams the ref didn't even give a foul for a challenge, but Collum - without the benefit of multiple replays - radioed the ref and instructed him to give the Saints player a red card.

[LIVIFOREVER]

4 hours ago, kingjoey said:

After being at the Livi/Aberdeen match last night, and as the VAR system is here to stay, fans in the ground have to be better updated in grounds with no screen. I, and everyone around me, had no idea which team were being looked as being guilty of a penalty because play had been going on and the ball had been in both boxes in the previous 30 seconds or so. 

Aye the first hand ball came after we took a corner and Aberdeen broke up the pitch and got a foul just outside our box from Devlin's rugby tackle on your player, then a VAR check, think the hand ball was even before we took the corner too, from the incident that led to our corner, but the ref didn't signal till about 3 mins later. 2nd one we had just had the ball in your box, and i wasn't sure if the VAR hand ball had happened then, but it was for Aberdeen when the ball had been deflected off Holt and almost into our net from the shot, which was a hand ball from Holt protecting his face being hit, same as the one we got before. Got to the stage whenever the ball was coming into the box i was shitting myself waiting on a VAR hand ball check. Basically the game was being decided by VAR hand balls.