How many countries in the world have a footballer as their best ever male sportsman?

[Bully Wee Villa]

Messi the better player over all, Maradona achieved more for Argentina. Messi may be the greatest ever player but Maradona pretty much won the World Cup on his own. Nobody else will come close to that achievement.

[Miguel Sanchez]

Argentina's best footballer is Lionel Messi.

Non-football is interesting. In motor racing there's 5 time F1 world champion Juan Manuel Fangio - Wikipedia. In basketball we have Manu Ginóbili - Wikipedia who has an Olympic gold medal, an assortment of basketball world cup medals and won 4 NBA titles. Juan Martín del Potro - Wikipedia leads the way in tennis with a US Open win in 2009 and a Davis Cup win in 2016. There are also a bunch of world and Olympic champion boxers I've never heard of, which in my somewhat ignorant view means they're not on the same level as Messi (or Maradona). 

I'm going to be contrarian here and argue Fangio as Argentina's best non-footballer. It's hard to quantify what someone in any sport achieved that long ago compared to the modern day, but five world titles in a sport with a mechanical and human attrition rate that early motor racing had is remarkable. I'm mainly arguing for Fangio here because I know nobody is comparing to Messi or Maradona, so this is effectively a guaranteed win for football. 

Armenia's best footballer is Henrik Mkhitaryan. 

Armenia is also out first instance of a former Soviet state which would have made for an interesting historical comparison. Outside of football as an independent country their biggest successes seem to be in chess, wrestling and weightlifting. Artur Aleksanyan - Wikipedia won gold in Greco-Roman wrestling in the 2016 Olympics and has several world and European titles too. There's also Armen Nazaryan - Wikipedia who seems to have had more success but has represented Bulgaria too, so I'm less likely to lean towards him. 

Aruba are another one of these Caribbean diddy outfits. Their most capped player is Theric Ruiz - Wikipedia with 24. There's a few people in their current squad playing for Dutch teams, but none of them seem to be up to much. 

Outside of football they're similar to American Samoa with a few baseball players. The longest career seems to belong to Sidney Ponson - Wikipedia with over a decade-long MLB career. Lots of the Aruba.. Arubian? baseball players seem to represent the Netherlands, which is probably fair enough since it's not like Aruba is putting out big teams in multiple sports. I'm going to vote for the non-footballer here though, whichever MLB player you pick is higher up than any footballer you can pick. 

 

[oneteaminglasgow]

10 minutes ago, Bully Wee Villa said:

Messi the better player over all, Maradona achieved more for Argentina. Messi may be the greatest ever player but Maradona pretty much won the World Cup on his own. Nobody else will come close to that achievement.

I’d go along with this.

Messi has also, to my knowledge, never utterly destroyed a man’s psyche in the way Maradona did with Peter Shilton.

But Messi is, at the very least, in the top two best footballers to ever live, so aye, that’s no bad going. 

[Marten]

7 minutes ago, Miguel Sanchez said:

Aruba are another one of these Caribbean diddy outfits. Their most capped player is Theric Ruiz - Wikipedia with 24. There's a few people in their current squad playing for Dutch teams, but none of them seem to be up to much. 

Outside of football they're similar to American Samoa with a few baseball players. The longest career seems to belong to Sidney Ponson - Wikipedia with over a decade-long MLB career. Lots of the Aruba.. Arubian? baseball players seem to represent the Netherlands, which is probably fair enough since it's not like Aruba is putting out big teams in multiple sports. I'm going to vote for the non-footballer here though, whichever MLB player you pick is higher up than any footballer you can pick. 

It's worth noting here that Aruba is a constituent country in the Kingdom of The Netherlands and has a legal status very similar to Scotland in the UK in that they have their own government with devolved powers (although they go considerably further than Scotland's). The main difference with the UK is the distance between the largest constituent country and the other 3 (Aruba, Curaçao & St. Maarten) and the much smaller population of these (these 3 have a combined population that's less than 2% of the entire Kingdom), but the structure is very similar. That also counts for sports, in some sports/events they compete separately (football for example) while in others they compete as one.

In baseball, there is one national team covering all 4 constituent countries, so it's fair enough to count baseball players playing for the Dutch team for these 3 constituent countries. The Dutch baseball team is the strongest in Europe with only Italy coming close. That the team is so strong is mainly down to players from the Caribbean part of the Kingdom. Therefore the best sportsmen in all 3 are likely baseball players. For Aruba, I would say Xander Bogaerts (Boston Red Sox) is the best one out there.

[DiegoDiego]

Don't discount Armenia's excellent tank biathlon team.

If we are counting chess as a sport then Tigran Petrosian should be Armenia's nominee as a world champion in a sport with very few world champions.

[Miguel Sanchez]

On 19/07/2021 at 07:47, DiegoDiego said:

Don't discount Armenia's excellent tank biathlon team.

If we are counting chess as a sport then Tigran Petrosian should be Armenia's nominee as a world champion in a sport with very few world champions.

I'd be happy to include chess players where relevant but it's a difficult one counting someone from the Soviet Union era IMO. I'm going to completely undermine that when we get to Russia and include people like Vladislav Tretiak and Valeri Kharlamov, but we're probably months away from that.

[Miguel Sanchez]

Australia is in a strange position as a sporting nation, since football is behind quite a few sports in popularity. For footballers I'm inclined to say Mark Schwarzer with 109 caps and a career mostly spent in the English Premier League. If it's not him then it's probably Tim Cahill, with 108 caps and 50 goals, plus a career mostly spent in the English Premier League. There's also Harry Kewell and Mark Viduka, and I'm leaning towards Kewell because although their national team careers aren't as long as the first two, Kewell played the most at the highest level, with lots of Champions League experience with Leeds and Liverpool.

All of this is relevant because I'm going to guess there's a rugby, cricket or Australian Rules Football person who blows all of that out of the water. Or ironically someone who actually did blow competitors out of the water, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Thorpe with 5 Olympic golds for swimming and loads more swimming medals. Whether him or someone from rugby or cricket, I think it's fair to say the non-footballer wins this round. If you know a rugby or cricket person who should go here, fire away.

Austria are currently captained by David Alaba - Wikipedia, their best ever player. Wikipedia tells me there's competition from before the Nazis however with Matthias Sindelar - Wikipedia. I'm not even going to try and quantify this. Football in Alaba's time isn't comparable, but the amount of time he's spent at the absolute top level edges it for me.

Austria also has this very helpful wikpedia page: List of Austrian sportspeople - Wikipedia

Niki Lauda was Formula 1 world champion three times. Austria is also famed for alpine skiing with sustained success throughout that sport's history. Toni Sailer - Wikipedia won three gold medals at the 1956 winter Olympics and 4 gold medals at that year's world championships. He was also names Austrian sports personality of the century in 1999. There are a few other skiers with Olympic and world championship wins but Sailer seems to be the most prominent. This is a difficult choice to me because I feel as if skiing is more prominent in Austrian culture than football, and that if you asked the average Austrian they'd be inclined to pick a skier rather than a football. But then, Alaba is an extremely talented individual who's had sustained success with one of the best teams in modern football. I'm also pretty biased and would want to pick Lauda anyway. 

This is a tough one and I'm definitely opening this one up. 

Azerbaijan don't have much in the way of footballers. Rashad Sadygov - Wikipedia has won Azerbaijan Footballer of the Year six times in his career and is their most capped player with 111, so I'm voting him. He spent almost all his career in Azerbaijan, with a few games in Turkey thrown in. 

Most of Azerbaijan's Olympic success has come in wrestling. Namig Abdullayev - Wikipedia seems to have had the most and longest success with Olympic and European golds in freestyle wrestling, which a bunch of silvers thrown in too. Farid Mansurov - Wikipedia was Olympic champion once and  world champion twice in Greco-Roman wrestling. Chess is also a big one from here, with Garry Kasparov being born in Baku in Soviet times. Since independence Shakhriyar Mamedyarov - Wikipedia seems to be their best bet for individual success, though I'm not going to attempt to list all of the tournaments he's been in. 

I think both of these candidates are better than the footballer. Wrestling seems to be more important in Azerbaijan than football, and chess (which I'm perfectly happy to count here) has a long-standing cultural importance too. While a mind sport like chess can easily have a longer career than wrestling, I think the longevity of Mamedyarov wins out here, and puts him ahead of Sadygov for football. 

The Bahamas sees us enter the Bs and it's another diddy Caribbean outfit. Lesly St. Fleur - Wikipedia has the most caps (22) and goals (10). Their highest ever FIFA ranking was 138, in 2006.

They have a few Olympic champions, so it's an easy win for the non-footballer here. Chris Brown (sprinter) - Wikipedia is the best of their sprinters with an assortment of silver medals in various competitions, as well as national records at several distances. Deandre Ayton - Wikipedia is a 1st overall draft pick (2018) in the NBA and seems like he could have a big career, but I'm giving this one to Brown for the time being.

[Skyline Drifter]

49 minutes ago, Miguel Sanchez said:

Australia is in a strange position as a sporting nation, since football is behind quite a few sports in popularity. For footballers I'm inclined to say Mark Schwarzer with 109 caps and a career mostly spent in the English Premier League. If it's not him then it's probably Tim Cahill, with 108 caps and 50 goals, plus a career mostly spent in the English Premier League. There's also Harry Kewell and Mark Viduka, and I'm leaning towards Kewell because although their national team careers aren't as long as the first two, Kewell played the most at the highest level, with lots of Champions League experience with Leeds and Liverpool.

All of this is relevant because I'm going to guess there's a rugby, cricket or Australian Rules Football person who blows all of that out of the water. Or ironically someone who actually did blow competitors out of the water, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Thorpe with 5 Olympic golds for swimming and loads more swimming medals. Whether him or someone from rugby or cricket, I think it's fair to say the non-footballer wins this round. If you know a rugby or cricket person who should go here, fire away.

Sir Don Bradman, or in a slightly more modern context Allan Border I would think would be nationally more recognised their top sportsman than Ian Thorpe.

[Skyline Drifter]

On 17/07/2021 at 00:21, ajwffc said:

New Zealand's best sportsman  is probably Richie McCaw with Kane Williamson in second as it stands. I don't think there will be any footballers high on the list   

Sir Richard Hadlee

[oneteaminglasgow]

There were shout earlier on for a cricketer called Don Bradman to be Australia’s best ever sportsman. I don’t understand what the numbers mean, but his batting average is 99.94 (per Wikipedia) while the next highest are around 60 odd, so I’ll assume that’s really, really good.

Austria, as you say, is a tough one. The boy Sailer seems to have retired from skiing at 24 for some reason, but absolutely dominated it before then. I’d possibly side with you and go with Lauda just for longevity compared to Sailer, although if Sailer had kept going and kept dominating at the rate he was, it wouldn’t be close. 

[Bully Wee Villa]

Bradman is Australia's best sportsman by an absolute mile, I'd say. His average is so good compared to everyone else it's like as if Usain Bolt had ran the 100 metres three seconds fasted than the silver medalist. He also did it on generally uncovered pitches which were much more difficult to bat on than those of today. He ranks as the greatest cricketer ever and that's their biggest sport, so makes sense.

I'd lean towards Cahill as the best footballer. Schwarzer was a perfectly reasonable but unspectacular goalkeeper. Cahill was a brilliant player for a while, and talismanic for Australia, too. I always hated playing against him (not me, literally, I mean my team) which is usually a sign that he's annoyingly good.

Still, non-football landslide for Australia.

Edited July 20, 2021 by Bully Wee Villa

[Miguel Sanchez]

2 hours ago, oneteaminglasgow said:

Austria, as you say, is a tough one. The boy Sailer seems to have retired from skiing at 24 for some reason, but absolutely dominated it before then. I’d possibly side with you and go with Lauda just for longevity compared to Sailer, although if Sailer had kept going and kept dominating at the rate he was, it wouldn’t be close. 

This doesn't help figure out if he's better than David Alaba 

[Skyline Drifter]

 

4 hours ago, Miguel Sanchez said:

Austria are currently captained by David Alaba - Wikipedia, their best ever player. Wikipedia tells me there's competition from before the Nazis however with Matthias Sindelar - Wikipedia. I'm not even going to try and quantify this. Football in Alaba's time isn't comparable, but the amount of time he's spent at the absolute top level edges it for me.

Austria also has this very helpful wikpedia page: List of Austrian sportspeople - Wikipedia

Niki Lauda was Formula 1 world champion three times. Austria is also famed for alpine skiing with sustained success throughout that sport's history. Toni Sailer - Wikipedia won three gold medals at the 1956 winter Olympics and 4 gold medals at that year's world championships. He was also names Austrian sports personality of the century in 1999. There are a few other skiers with Olympic and world championship wins but Sailer seems to be the most prominent. This is a difficult choice to me because I feel as if skiing is more prominent in Austrian culture than football, and that if you asked the average Austrian they'd be inclined to pick a skier rather than a football. But then, Alaba is an extremely talented individual who's had sustained success with one of the best teams in modern football. I'm also pretty biased and would want to pick Lauda anyway. 

This is a tough one and I'm definitely opening this one up.

Not convinced Alaba is indisputably their best ever player. Back when Austria were actually good Hans Krankl was their best player and one of Europe's best strikers.

But Austria is very much an Alpine sports nation and I don't think typically they'd go for a footballer anyway.

3 hours ago, oneteaminglasgow said:

Austria, as you say, is a tough one. The boy Sailer seems to have retired from skiing at 24 for some reason, but absolutely dominated it before then. I’d possibly side with you and go with Lauda just for longevity compared to Sailer, although if Sailer had kept going and kept dominating at the rate he was, it wouldn’t be close. 

Franz Klammer, no?

Niki Lauda would be better known globally for sure, F1 is a global sport whilst skiing is a much more niche sport but I'd hazard a guess most Austrians may favour their top skiers.

Edited July 20, 2021 by Skyline Drifter

[oneteaminglasgow]

1 hour ago, Miguel Sanchez said:

This doesn't help figure out if he's better than David Alaba 

f**k it, aye he’s better than Alaba.

1 hour ago, Skyline Drifter said:

Franz Klammer, no?

Niki Lauda would be better known globally for sure, F1 is a global sport whilst skiing is a much more niche sport but I'd hazard a guess most Austrians may favour their top skiers.

I’ve never heard of him.

I’d never heard of Lauda or Sailer either, as I don’t like F1 or skiing, so was just going off their Wikipedia pages.

[Skyline Drifter]

Just now, oneteaminglasgow said:

I’ve never heard of him.

I’d never heard of Lauda or Sailer either, as I don’t like F1 or skiing, so was just going off their Wikipedia pages.

When I was growing up Franz Klammer was the biggest name in Skiing. Back when we had three tv channels and Ski Sunday with David Vine was Sunday teatime entertainment!

To be fair I'm going to assume if you've never heard of Niki Lauda then, whether you like F1 or not, you're under 45 anyway.

[Senator Frimpton]

Australia's greatest ever footballer is clearly Christian Vieri.

It's still Bradman though obviously

 

Edited July 21, 2021 by Senator Frimpton
punctuation

[Miguel Sanchez]

After deliberation, I'm going for Sailer over Alaba. As much as Alaba is good in his own right, there's no escaping the fact that a lot of his success is down to being on a good team. Sailer's dominance in an individual sport, especially one as prominent as skiing is in Austria, nudges him ahead for me. That gives us a running total which suggests the diddy countries are going to win this thing for the non-footballers:

	Best footballer	Best non-footballer	Football better?
Afghanistan	Zohib Islam Amiri	Rohullah Nikpai (taekwondo)	No
Albania	Lorik Cana	Izmir Smajlaj (long jump)	Yes
Algeria	Rabah Madjer	Noureddine Morceli (running)	No
American Samoa	Nicky Salapu	Sean Manaea (baseball)	No
Andorra	Ildefons Lima	Hocine Haciane (swimming)	Yes
Angola	Manucho	Carlos Morais (basketball)	Yes
Anguilla	Ryan Liddie	Omari Banks (cricket)	No
Antigua and Barbuda	Peter Byers	Viv Richards (cricket)	No
Argentina	Lionel Messi	Juan Manuel Fangio (motor racing)	Yes
Armenia	Henrikh Mkhitaryan	Artur Aleksanyan (wrestling)	Yes
Aruba	Theric Ruiz	Xander Bogaerts (baseball)	No
Australia	Harry Kewell	Don Bradman (cricket)	No
Austria	David Alaba	Toni Sailer (skiing)	No
Azerbaijan	Rashad Sadygov	Shakhriyar Mamedyarov (chess)	No
The Bahamas	Lesly St. Fleur	Chris Brown (sprinting)	No

[Miguel Sanchez]

Bahrain seem to be half-decent by the usual standards of a Middle Eastern country. Top spot seems to be a battle between most capped Salman Isa - Wikipedia and highest scorer Ismail Abdullatif - Wikipedia. I'm giving it to Abdullatif because he's not far behind in caps. Both have spent their entire careers at an assortment of Arab clubs. 

For non-footballers it gets a bit difficult here because of Bahrain's recent push to have a lot of Kenyan-born athletes running middle and long distances for them. Their three Olympic medals were all won by Kenyan women. Yusuf Saad Kamel - Wikipedia won the 1500m at the 2009 World Championships. Information for other sports seems pretty spotty, so it's hard to judge: Sport in Bahrain - Wikipedia

If we're happy with Kamel winning this despite being born in Kenya, it's an easy win for the non-footballer. 

Bangladesh have remarkably slim pickings for a country with as many people as they do. I'm tempted to go with current national team captain Jamal Bhuyan - Wikipedia because he's Danish-born and spent some time in Copenhagen's youth system, which is better than anything anyone else in their squad has managed. 

Cricket is much more popular and even if I can't decide on a name it's an easy job here to give the win to the non-footballer. I like the numbers next to Mashrafe Mortaza - Wikipedia's name, why not. 

Barbados look even worse than the rest of the Caribbean. Llewellyn Riley - Wikipedia played in the League of Ireland and that's what counts as pedigree here. 

Obadele Thompson - Wikipedia won bronze in the 100 metres in the 2000 Olympics. They have an assortment of cricketers who've played for the West Indies and Garfield Sobers - Wikipedia looks like the best of those, so he wins this round.

Belarus looks like an easy win for Alexander Hleb - Wikipedia

Wikipedia tells me that hockey is the most popular sport in Belarus and... er, it's not great. It's probably a toss-up between one of the Kostitsyns, Grabovski and Salei and... I'm just thinking aloud here, don't mind me. I'm picking Ruslan Salei - Wikipedia as best hockey player since he had the longest NHL career, and would have surely had a decent KHL career too if this hadn't happened: Lokomotiv Yaroslavl plane crash - Wikipedia

There's also Max Mirnyi - Wikipedia who has some Grand Slam wins in doubles in tennis as well as Olympic gold in 2012 with Victoria Azarenka (who'd win this by miles if we were including women). I'm picking him here but I'm not sure if he beats Hleb or not. Any thoughts?

[Turkmenbashi]

I am voting for the tennis player. Worlds best at doubles is still the best at something.

[oneteaminglasgow]

Aye, the tennis player was in the top 50 singles players for the best part of a decade as well, and a genuinely outstanding doubles player. As good as Hleb was, I’d go for Mirnyi.