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Euro 2020 Final - England vs Italy


smpar

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Just thinking about how close Southgate came to being a legend as opposed to not !

Even though his team was on the defensive side he very , very nearly did the job. Wouls any other ( realistic ) choice of manager been as successful ?

( with a more creative team )

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, ewan14 said:

Just thinking about how close Southgate came to being a legend as opposed to not !

Even though his team was on the defensive side he very , very nearly did the job. Would any other ( realistic ) choice of manager been as successful ?

( with a more creative team )

 

 

 

 

 

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All those trying to work out how the Saka/train gag can be offensive without referring to his race:
Just Google Robert Enke.
Enke (sadly) committed suicide. The joke in the gif is Chiellini saving him from being hit by train when a lot of English supporters were complaining Chiellini had all but assaulted Saka.

It's in no way a joke about suicide. To get worked up about it is just ridiculous. It could be applied to him stopping Saka from jumping off a cliff, it's still not taking the piss out of suicide.

I think folk need to stop looking into things like this too deeply tbh or we'll not be allowed to laugh at anything for fear of folk being offended.

I'm not suggesting you're offended FWIW, I know you just highlighted Enke's case.
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20 minutes ago, 19QOS19 said:

Enke (sadly) committed suicide. The joke in the gif is Chiellini saving him from being hit by train when a lot of English supporters were complaining Chiellini had all but assaulted Saka.

It's in no way a joke about suicide. To get worked up about it is just ridiculous. It could be applied to him stopping Saka from jumping off a cliff, it's still not taking the piss out of suicide.

I think folk need to stop looking into things like this too deeply tbh or we'll not be allowed to laugh at anything for fear of folk being offended.

I'm not suggesting you're offended FWIW, I know you just highlighted Enke's case.

agree with this yeah. Its kinda a similar energy to try to get worked up about it as that old Extras bit where Sir Ian McKellen goes "when Peter Jackson called me up I had to explain to him - you know Peter, I'm not actually a wizard. And he said yes I understand that Sir Ian but I want you to use your acting skills to portray the wizard Gandalf for the duration of the movie."

It's an animated .gif in the same spirit as some cartoony nonsense like Tom and Jerry (look at the age of the second fucking train ffs :lol:)

Edit: oh I mind all of the old Zidane headbutt .gifs (so very long ago now, christ). I don't think they were condoning assault tbh.

Edited by Thistle_do_nicely
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18 minutes ago, 19QOS19 said:

Enke (sadly) committed suicide. The joke in the gif is Chiellini saving him from being hit by train when a lot of English supporters were complaining Chiellini had all but assaulted Saka.

It's in no way a joke about suicide. To get worked up about it is just ridiculous. It could be applied to him stopping Saka from jumping off a cliff, it's still not taking the piss out of suicide.

I think folk need to stop looking into things like this too deeply tbh or we'll not be allowed to laugh at anything for fear of folk being offended.

I'm not suggesting you're offended FWIW, I know you just highlighted Enke's case.

To get worked up about it is simply standard for the modern day 

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2 hours ago, WhiteRoseKillie said:

All those trying to work out how the Saka/train gag can be offensive without referring to his race:

Just Google Robert Enke.

Lots of things can be offensive without referring to race, obviously.

Presumably you're not imagining that the person who made the train meme was thinking of Robert Enke when they made it? So you're saying it's basically insensitive to make any reference to a footballer running in front a train because that's how Enke committed suicide?

Would it need to have been a footballer, or just anyone? Do you think it's possible to make a reference to anything without some tragic incident being in some way associated with what you're referencing?

Are memes with dogs in them offensive because some dogs have killed people?

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1 hour ago, Binos said:

To get worked up about it is simply standard for the modern day 

And again, nobody is getting "worked up", even a wee bit.

Instead, Savage Henry said he was a little uncomfortable with those ones and I said that yes, I felt a bit the same way.

 

Once more, that really is all.  Nobody is being insulted or derided for seeing it differently.  It doesn't make those fine with it wicked, or those expressing reservations, Helen Lovejoys either.  We can just differ a bit.  That's actually ok.

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54 minutes ago, Gordon EF said:

Lots of things can be offensive without referring to race, obviously.

Presumably you're not imagining that the person who made the train meme was thinking of Robert Enke when they made it? So you're saying it's basically insensitive to make any reference to a footballer running in front a train because that's how Enke committed suicide?

Would it need to have been a footballer, or just anyone? Do you think it's possible to make a reference to anything without some tragic incident being in some way associated with what you're referencing?

Are memes with dogs in them offensive because some dogs have killed people?

Of course not. I'd be surprised if there's many meme-makers (memewrights? memesmiths?) old enough to really have taken notice of Enke's suicide at the time. I made the connection, but wouldn't say I was offended. Just noticing that everyone is jumping to the race angle, when the only racist bit I've seen over this foul wasn't in any of the many memes and gifs doing the rounds - rather, it was in the (apparently serious) attempt by some loon trying to get a petition up to replay the final. 

So, I found the portrayal of the train gif/meme to be in bad taste, but I understand why others wouldn't know.

I find the immediate jump by many to frame this in terms of race lazy and, yes, offensive.

And I foulnd the petition for the replay sad, offensive, and pretty damn funny (if serious, still a better gag (without the slave comment)if its fake.

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2 minutes ago, WhiteRoseKillie said:

Of course not. I'd be surprised if there's many meme-makers (memewrights? memesmiths?) old enough to really have taken notice of Enke's suicide at the time. I made the connection, but wouldn't say I was offended... So, I found the portrayal of the train gif/meme to be in bad taste, but I understand why others wouldn't know.

Exactly this.

My thoughts turned to Chris Mitchell, but that doesn't mean everyone needs to think that way.

No outrage here - just a comment.

 

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6 minutes ago, WhiteRoseKillie said:

So, I found the portrayal of the train gif/meme to be in bad taste, but I understand why others wouldn't know.

But you can know about Robert Enke, and also know that hundreds, possibly thousands of people have lost their lives in similar circumstances and understand that it's not offensive because it's clearly not making reference to any of those incidents.

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1 minute ago, Gordon EF said:

But you can know about Robert Enke, and also know that hundreds, possibly thousands of people have lost their lives in similar circumstances and understand that it's not offensive because it's clearly not making reference to any of those incidents.

'Offensive' is a red herring.  We can not like things, without being deeply hurt or offended by them.

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