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Why cant we produce top class forwards?


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Genuine question, how many Scottish top league clubs give debuts to strikers now? How many Scottish strikers play at a Premiership club that came through their system?
The pressure on managers to get results now is going to stop them all trying to bring through youth unless they hit the ground running. On boards and fans accept sacking managers after a few bad results isn’t the way to go, we might have a chance.
Andy Winter played quite a bit for us last season, although he's more of a forward than a striker. Good player with potential (unlikely to be Scotland potential though) but was bombed out for a loanee just as he was playing his best football which kind of sums up your point.

Is Appere at DU not a striker? If not then I'm struggling.
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On 26/06/2021 at 18:31, BFTD said:

You get this a lot with fans of...certain clubs. Kick out the diddies, give us all the best young players. Most of them can't even explain the logic behind their thoughts; it comes down to, "we're the best, so we'll do everything better."

They seem to be gaining some support on here with mysterious new accounts that only post on these subjects, but even their arguments boil down to the old logical fallacy of "change needs to happen, and this is change, so therefore it must happen". But the top clubs in Scotland have no vested interest in the development of young Scots, as evidenced by their remarkably poor track records. Their prime concern is to make sure that other clubs don't have them.

Is there something in this - could there be additional financial incentives for playing young national team qualified players? Set aside x% of the total prize pot and split it based on minutes played? Or change the way development money is currently distributed to make it based on success/outcomes rather than simply participation? My understanding at present is clubs are given money for having a particular standard of academy, as opposed to actually producing anything out of that academy.

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Just now, albagubrath said:

Is there something in this - could there be additional financial incentives for playing young national team qualified players? Set aside x% of the total prize pot and split it based on minutes played? Or change the way development money is currently distributed to make it based on success/outcomes rather than simply participation? My understanding at present is clubs are given money for having a particular standard of academy, as opposed to actually producing anything out of that academy.

I doubt the extra prize money would ever be of enough value for Celtgers, or even clubs like Aberdeen, to bother with.

My first thought about reward for the outcome of player development is the transfer fee - if a club manages to train a talented player well enough that a bigger clubs wants them, their reward is the money they receive from the transfer. Big clubs everywhere don't want to pay that money out anymore, though, which is why there's been such a move to consolidate as many kids as possible with the biggest clubs across Europe, then make money from loaning/transferring them back out to smaller clubs. It could be stopped by putting a cap on squad sizes, or drastically limiting the number of youngsters that a club can loan out as well as in, but that's not going to happen as player development isn't the main concern here.

If we're really going to try to get more young Scots into I'd much rather we just had a blanket rule that every club has to include a certain number of youngsters who'd qualify to play for Scotland in their matchday squads. However, I'm not sure if that would be legally enforceable, and an awful lot of youngsters who'd no intentions of ever playing for Scotland would likely qualify anyway. Plus, you'd likely just see three youngsters warming the bench for the season - it might be tricky to ensure that they actually get game time.

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On 27/06/2021 at 20:11, accies1874 said:

Andy Winter played quite a bit for us last season, although he's more of a forward than a striker. Good player with potential (unlikely to be Scotland potential though) but was bombed out for a loanee just as he was playing his best football which kind of sums up your point.

Is Appere at DU not a striker? If not then I'm struggling.

Stevie May, Chris Kane, Callum Hendry.

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On 28/06/2021 at 21:10, Bonksy+HisChristianParade said:

Stevie May, Chris Kane, Callum Hendry.

None of them close to being international class strikers; yet each of them significantly better than Lyndon Dykes.

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  • 1 month later...

Best strikers produced in Scotland this century:
Miller, Boyd, Griffiths… Naismith?
Not an international class player among them.

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1 hour ago, Insert Amusing Pseudonym said:

We appear to be the slowest nation on earth as well which definitely doesn't help in forward areas.  

And mostly wee apart from a few brutes like McKenna, Dykes and Gallagher.

We looked malnourished compared to the Danes last night.

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We appear to be the slowest nation on earth as well which definitely doesn't help in forward areas.  
Not sure where you're getting this from. Fraser, Adams, Forrest, Christie, Hanley and Burke are all pretty rapid.
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2 hours ago, Gordopolis said:
9 hours ago, Insert Amusing Pseudonym said:
We appear to be the slowest nation on earth as well which definitely doesn't help in forward areas.  

Not sure where you're getting this from. Fraser, Adams, Forrest, Christie, Hanley and Burke are all pretty rapid.

Other than Burke, none of them are lightning quick.   And Burke can't play football.  

 

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1 hour ago, Gordopolis said:
2 hours ago, Insert Amusing Pseudonym said:
Other than Burke, none of them are lightning quick.   And Burke can't play football.  
 

None of them are remotely slow either, which is why saying "we're the slowest nation on earth" makes no sense

Every team we play seems to have quicker players though, which was my point.  I'm not literelly saying no-one in Scotland is ever quick

I watched Sweden tonight - the counter speed was electric and the centre forward was a flying machine.  

 

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14 hours ago, Lex said:

Best strikers produced in Scotland this century:
Miller, Boyd, Griffiths… Naismith?
Not an international class player among them.

McFadden and Steven Fletcher both in double figures of international goals.

Your point still stands though I reckon.

 

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It has to be our footballing system. Look at the Olympic medal table and if Scotland was it's own country with 3 golds and 10 silvers we would have ranked 21st with a population of a country ranked around 115th in the world. We finished above countries like Spain, Sweden and Denmark and way above Portugal. We can produce athletes there's no doubt about that.

 

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Theres a laddie from Montrose that Alex McLeish said would never get a game for Scotland that plays up front and has scored 4 goals in 8 caps for Australia.

And has 17 goals already in 2021…..

Also has experience of playing RWB.

Shame, that.

Edited by Les Cabbage
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