Jump to content

Time to go Steve Clarke


Recommended Posts

44 minutes ago, Ewan8472 said:

Tierney or Robertson ?

There is no reason why you can’t play both in a 4-3-3 btw.

 

- Tierney could play LCB in a back four or would IMO be a fantastic holding midfielder, Phillip Lahm style.

 

- Robertson on the left wing, Bale style.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Lex said:

We learned this international break that we are certainly better than Armenia, which is fine. Probably already knew that right enough. Armenia have never and will never qualify for a major tournament though, so being better than them is not much use to us.

The two mid ranking European sides who we did play both gubbed us. That's a big worry, these weren't elite teams or anything. Just countries that sometimes qualify and sometimes don't. The exact type of teams we need to be beating, or at the very least not being humped by.

Big three games in September then the draw for Euro 2024 qualifying is in October. As far as i can see we don't have a competitive game for six months between September and the start of those qualifiers in March. Clarke will be in charge for the start of that campaign, but he could do with going into that big gap with at least a bit of momentum.

 

This is the real concern. If you look at our defeats under Clarke to any decent side (and even not so decent like Ireland) they are 2 or 3 goal defeats, we aren't even close. The exception was our best result on paper, Austria away (they were in dreadful form but we did what was needed). Our other 2 wins against competitive (ones that regularly qualify) nations were beating a Czech side when they had some weird Czech league select side playing, so we can't really count that. And we beat a Denmark side with 4 or 5 players missing who had qualified. I know 'you can only beat what's in front of you' etc but you have to consider that.

If you look at the defeats to Ukraine, Czechs in the Euros, Croatia, Ireland, Denmark away, they are all at least 2 goal margins where we were never really in the game. You could go further back and include 4 goal defeats to Russia and Belgium defeats too. I certainly wouldn't expect us to beat most of them but I'd at least expect us to be competitive, against any good side we are extremely easy to beat.

What we have shown under Clarke is that we can relatively comfortably beat the diddy sides (something not to be sniffed at given our history). The games against the middle ranking nations like Slovakia and Israel are generally the flip of a coin. And in games against sides who regularly qualify we (under normally circumstances) are generally miles off it and lose badly.

Even with our considerable limitations I always thought Clarke would get us solid and organised so that even if we weren't scoring many goals or beating these sides we'd at least be horrible to play against and be able battle to draws or at worst narrow defeats. That's not really how it's worked out.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The prevailing feeling from the Ukraine and Ireland games were that we looked poorly prepared and easy to prepare against - we folded like a deck chair when opposition put any sort of pressure on our full backs. 

The attitude in the latter game especially  to have come so soon after the Ukraine result - was a disgrace with players pulling out of tackles all over the place and coming nowhere close to matching Ireland's work-rate out of possession. I'm not sure Clarke can survive another couple of those performances in September. 

I have some sympathy for him though in that this is still a difficult squad to balance.

I imagine Clarke sees the 3/5 at the back as a necessity not just as a way of fitting Tierney and McTominay into the team, but also because there's an absence of credible wingers in the squad pool (having fallen out with Fraser) to give proper balance to a 4-at-the-back formation. You're looking at Barrie Mackay as the next best available to us and it's hard to imagine us being much more effective at either end of the pitch.

The problem with any 3-5-2 though is that if any kind of good pass is played between the outside centre back and the wing back then it's hard not to concede. That's how Ireland got their second goal and Ukraine, Denmark, Austria, Czech Republic all put similar goals past us. To mitigate that as best as possible you need a settled, consistent defence and we've never had that under Clarke - partly through injury, partly through tinkering with different players. 

The best thing he can do now is pick his best central defence and stick to it as far as possible - for me that's Souttar-Cooper-Tierney who started the Denmark game, and ideally Patterson can sort out some regular game time for himself as he is by some distance the best option at RWB and improves us immeasurably going forward, taking some pressure off Robertson aswell.

Oh and if a good goalie could appear out of nowhere too then that'd be great.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 minutes ago, AMMjag said:

The prevailing feeling from the Ukraine and Ireland games were that we looked poorly prepared and easy to prepare against - we folded like a deck chair when opposition put any sort of pressure on our full backs. 

The attitude in the latter game especially  to have come so soon after the Ukraine result - was a disgrace with players pulling out of tackles all over the place and coming nowhere close to matching Ireland's work-rate out of possession. I'm not sure Clarke can survive another couple of those performances in September. 

I have some sympathy for him though in that this is still a difficult squad to balance.

I imagine Clarke sees the 3/5 at the back as a necessity not just as a way of fitting Tierney and McTominay into the team, but also because there's an absence of credible wingers in the squad pool (having fallen out with Fraser) to give proper balance to a 4-at-the-back formation. You're looking at Barrie Mackay as the next best available to us and it's hard to imagine us being much more effective at either end of the pitch.

The problem with any 3-5-2 though is that if any kind of good pass is played between the outside centre back and the wing back then it's hard not to concede. That's how Ireland got their second goal and Ukraine, Denmark, Austria, Czech Republic all put similar goals past us. To mitigate that as best as possible you need a settled, consistent defence and we've never had that under Clarke - partly through injury, partly through tinkering with different players. 

The best thing he can do now is pick his best central defence and stick to it as far as possible - for me that's Souttar-Cooper-Tierney who started the Denmark game, and ideally Patterson can sort out some regular game time for himself as he is by some distance the best option at RWB and improves us immeasurably going forward, taking some pressure off Robertson aswell.

Oh and if a good goalie could appear out of nowhere too then that'd be great.

 

 

Naw wouldn't be looking at Barry McKay as next avalible winger at all avaliable to us

I would be sitting down with Sirki Dembele a guy brought up in Govan that will be playing in EPL for Bournemouth next year

And I would be begging him to play for Scotland over the Ivory Coast like his treacherous wee brother has decided to play for

Also would be looking at Scotty Wright to bring into the team if he is starting becoming a regular at Rangers 

And don't forget James Forrest is probably gonna be back anyway fit and able

Clarke and Fraser sat down together there isn't a problem he just never picked him

Out them all he is probably our best winger but would be nice to see Dembele involved especially if he is playing in EPL

Edited by General dissaray
Link to comment
Share on other sites

50 minutes ago, General dissaray said:

Naw wouldn't be looking at Barry McKay as next avalible winger at all avaliable to us

I would be sitting down with Sirki Dembele a guy brought up in Govan that will be playing in EPL for Bournemouth next year

And I would be begging him to play for Scotland over the Ivory Coast like his treacherous wee brother has decided to play for

Also would be looking at Scotty Wright to bring into the team if he is starting becoming a regular at Rangers 

And don't forget James Forrest is probably gonna be back anyway fit and able

Clarke and Fraser sat down together there isn't a problem he just never picked him

Out them all he is probably our best winger but would be nice to see Dembele involved especially if he is playing in EPL

I for one am outraged that a boy born in the quaint Scottish hamlet of Lambeth, with two parents from the Ivory Coast might fancy playing for a country other than Scotland. 

Edited by Fratelli
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, Fratelli said:

I for one am outraged that a boy born in the quaint Scottish hamlet of Lambeth, with two parents from the Ivory Coast might fancy playing for a country other than Scotland. 

Been through schooling in Scotland he is eligible and as far as I'm aware has already choosen Scotland at a young age,so if this is so get him in next squad and freshen it up a bit plenty off pace Adams Brown Dembele all flying machines 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Not impressed with Clarke's "realistic fans" comment.  He's getting close to Strachan territory.

Do "realistic fans" expect us to repeatedly not turn up in first half, throughout his tenure?

Do they expect us to capitulate so badly versus Ukraine and Ireland within a short period of time?

Looking at the group we are in not too bad a situation, but realistically Clarke has to get it sorted for September, or realistically he will lose support 

Edited by Father Ted
Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 minutes ago, Satoshi said:

8 wins from last 10 competitive matches which is the best record in UEFA.

Think Clarke is right to have a pop at unrealistic fans.

These wins have been against absolute nobodies. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, General dissaray said:

Naw wouldn't be looking at Barry McKay as next avalible winger at all avaliable to us

I would be sitting down with Sirki Dembele a guy brought up in Govan that will be playing in EPL for Bournemouth next year

And I would be begging him to play for Scotland over the Ivory Coast like his treacherous wee brother has decided to play for

Also would be looking at Scotty Wright to bring into the team if he is starting becoming a regular at Rangers 

And don't forget James Forrest is probably gonna be back anyway fit and able

Clarke and Fraser sat down together there isn't a problem he just never picked him

Out them all he is probably our best winger but would be nice to see Dembele involved especially if he is playing in EPL

Scott Wright is relatively young and becoming more important at Rangers, but he's doing nothing to suggest he's in any way good enough to be an international class winger.  He's achieved nothing like Fraser or Forrest, and neither of them have been world beaters internationally.

Dembele, we'll see this season as to what his true level is.  Simply playing in the EPL, particularly for a promoted team is of no measure at all (will McKenna be a better player in August than he was in May?)

I'd like us to have some threat in the wings, as we really lack pace and ingenuity.  Right now, Fraser is the only player of a sufficient calibre and fitness.  That's not only lop-sided but has no depth should be be injured/unavailable.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 minutes ago, edinabear said:

These wins have been against absolute nobodies. 

We've played nobodies consecutively plenty of times in the past and not won anything like the same number.

Besides, when England/Italy/Belgium/Spain go on a run, do you think first seeds play anyone decent?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 minutes ago, HuttonDressedAsLahm said:

Scott Wright is relatively young and becoming more important at Rangers, but he's doing nothing to suggest he's in any way good enough to be an international class winger.  He's achieved nothing like Fraser or Forrest, and neither of them have been world beaters internationally.

Dembele, we'll see this season as to what his true level is.  Simply playing in the EPL, particularly for a promoted team is of no measure at all (will McKenna be a better player in August than he was in May?)

I'd like us to have some threat in the wings, as we really lack pace and ingenuity.  Right now, Fraser is the only player of a sufficient calibre and fitness.  That's not only lop-sided but has no depth should be be injured/unavailable.

Scott Wright is 24 he is exactly at the age were he should be playing consistently for his club and pushing to be part off the squad 

Especially if he contuines to collect top level European appearance with Rangers expecially if they make it into champions league group

Wright over McKay all day long if McKay was any good Rangers would took him back and bumped up the quota off Scots for the European squad

Edited by General dissaray
Link to comment
Share on other sites

27 minutes ago, edinabear said:

These wins have been against absolute nobodies. 

A lot of people mewling about the Ireland defeat but they lost to Armenia. And are in far worse shape than us in every way. They would swap with us in a heartbeat.

Wouldn't call Denmark nobodies either.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Donathan said:

Tierney could play LCB in a back four or would IMO be a fantastic holding midfielder, Phillip Lahm style.

 

I'd agree this is a position he could probably play very well. But it would be a big risk unless he's playing there for his club even once in a while and shows that he can do it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, Satoshi said:

A lot of people mewling about the Ireland defeat but they lost to Armenia. And are in far worse shape than us in every way. They would swap with us in a heartbeat.

Wouldn't call Denmark nobodies either.

I dont think that changes the fact the Ireland result and performance was terrible.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, Diamonds are Forever said:

 

This is the real concern. If you look at our defeats under Clarke to any decent side (and even not so decent like Ireland) they are 2 or 3 goal defeats, we aren't even close. The exception was our best result on paper, Austria away (they were in dreadful form but we did what was needed). Our other 2 wins against competitive (ones that regularly qualify) nations were beating a Czech side when they had some weird Czech league select side playing, so we can't really count that. And we beat a Denmark side with 4 or 5 players missing who had qualified. I know 'you can only beat what's in front of you' etc but you have to consider that.

If you look at the defeats to Ukraine, Czechs in the Euros, Croatia, Ireland, Denmark away, they are all at least 2 goal margins where we were never really in the game. You could go further back and include 4 goal defeats to Russia and Belgium defeats too. I certainly wouldn't expect us to beat most of them but I'd at least expect us to be competitive, against any good side we are extremely easy to beat.

What we have shown under Clarke is that we can relatively comfortably beat the diddy sides (something not to be sniffed at given our history). The games against the middle ranking nations like Slovakia and Israel are generally the flip of a coin. And in games against sides who regularly qualify we (under normally circumstances) are generally miles off it and lose badly.

Even with our considerable limitations I always thought Clarke would get us solid and organised so that even if we weren't scoring many goals or beating these sides we'd at least be horrible to play against and be able battle to draws or at worst narrow defeats. That's not really how it's worked out.

Correct , the defence is still a problem after all the time he has been in charge , although injuries have not helped recently

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, BingMcCrosby said:

Don't let's some stats where we beat some terrible teams and some under strength teams fool you.

You seriously hate Clarke don't you?

Nothing is ever good enough is it we could turn over Italy one week and Brazil the next but still you wouldn't be happy 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...