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Time to go Steve Clarke


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1 minute ago, Binos said:

Good luck with if the fans boo every game as they did today,  Clarke will be sacked?

It depends on the results. If we are winning then they can boo as much as they like - but I doubt they will be.

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Just now, 2426255 said:

It depends on the results. If we are winning then they can boo as much as they like - but I doubt they will be.

Your point was he's in contract 

My point was that's irrelevant if the fans start going wild

You said good luck with that 

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This is a night for the Clarke out brigade, that's fine - pour youselves a glass of wine and soak it in. If we beat Armenia on Wednesday things will calm down a little. You've had so little to go off I don't begrudge you it. 🤭

Edited by 2426255
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1 minute ago, 2426255 said:

This is a night for the Clarke out brigade, that's fine - pour youselves a glass of wine and soak it in. If we beat Armenia on Wednesday things will calm down a little.

We already needed 6 points from Armenia,  as Ukraine will take 

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I’ve not really had any strong negative feelings towards Clarke until now. That result is more painful to take than the Ukraine one for me, at least Ukraine are a decent side - the Nations League was supposed to be an opportunity to pick things up again. Getting beat by Ireland is one thing, to get hammered is verging on unforgivable for me. If he does go I would want a foreign manager in and try something different. Sadly though, just like Scottish club football, the SFA will just pick some classic Scottish jobber from the managerial merry-go-round. The fact that there’s already folk suggesting Derek McInnes says it all. F**k me.

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19 minutes ago, 2426255 said:

I do wonder if he would resign if he feels he can't take the team any further. He doesn't strike me as a man who would just take a paycheque because he has a contract. I've never seen the players play so poorly - it just seemed to come out of nowhere.

 

Did you not watch the Ukraine game?

The problems with the system have been discussed, but regardless of the specific problems the wider issue is that we are so predictable in the way we will play. Obviously all teams have a preferred system but most are adaptable and have the capacity to change. Any side we face now knows exactly what they are facing, knows exactly how to stop us, and knows exactly where to expose us.

Ireland showed today the value of surprise by changing their system, and even the relative unknown of what to expect from Ukraine had an effect in us. On the other hand those teams knew exactly what they could expect from us and planned accordingly.

During Strachan's time in charge there were lots of positives, particularly at the start, but what ultimately did for him and us was the increasing stubbornness which he showed throughout his time. I worry that Clarke is starting to go that way too, the change (or lack of) at half-time today to his favourite of McTominay at centre back reeked of that. I really want him to be successful but I worry we're going to become a stale, predictable and ultimately ineffective team under him.

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10 minutes ago, Diamonds are Forever said:

 

Did you not watch the Ukraine game?

The problems with the system have been discussed, but regardless of the specific problems the wider issue is that we are so predictable in the way we will play. Obviously all teams have a preferred system but most are adaptable and have the capacity to change. Any side we face now knows exactly what they are facing, knows exactly how to stop us, and knows exactly where to expose us.

Ireland showed today the value of surprise by changing their system, and even the relative unknown of what to expect from Ukraine had an effect in us. On the other hand those teams knew exactly what they could expect from us and planned accordingly.

During Strachan's time in charge there were lots of positives, particularly at the start, but what ultimately did for him and us was the increasing stubbornness which he showed throughout his time. I worry that Clarke is starting to go that way too, the change (or lack of) at half-time today to his favourite of McTominay at centre back reeked of that. I really want him to be successful but I worry we're going to become a stale, predictable and ultimately ineffective team under him.

Is that in every game? or just the games we lose? It's always the system when we lose - shoulda done this, shoulda done that.

Edited by 2426255
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Just now, Estragon said:

I'm not sure how relevant your first point is here, you've written dozens of public posts demonstrating your point if view. Whether we've had a personal interaction is neither here nor there.

Secondly, if this is really true I suggest you find something else to fill your time - because not only has your celebration of some brilliant performances since Copenhagen been muted to say the least, you've spent the entirety of this time railing against what's been (intermittently) a great time to be a Scotland fan. 

How did I celebrate victorys for Scotland? What are you talking about.

The rest just utter nonsense, how have I spent the entire time railing against Scotland. Thats just absolute bollocks your making up.

I was delighted with clarkes appointment. I thought he would do well for us, then thru watching the games I could see he wasn't going to do well. And the terrible euros performance made my mind up.

He done well to get us back in the world Cup and then absolutely arsed the play offs. Another winnable big game bottled. With a negative formation and dinosaur tactics.

Whats sticking in your craw is i was right the whole time. I dont care that your upset about that. And I'm not bragging that I was, id rather I would have had been wrong and we were going to the world Cup, but there you go.

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I posted after the Ukraine game that it was the first time that a team had just completely sussed us out. They knew what we were going to do, how we were going to line up, how we'd try to play and what gameplan-specific variations we were likely to make. I also said that Clarke now needed to go and show something different, otherwise we were going to get progressively worse under his stewardship.

Sadly, today wasn't any different. Ireland knew us inside-out and knew how to play us. We, on the other hand, didn't seem to know the basics of what Ireland would try to do, including that they'd try to fire corner kicks at Shane Duffy's head.

Clarke still hasn't really tried anything different so far. And yes, he's missing Tierney. Maybe he really is our Jenga piece - take him out and the whole thing falls apart. But a good manager needs to be able to adapt to that, especially since Tierney has consistent injury issues. 

We'll probably struggle over the line against Armenia next week. But if we go into that September triple header without Tierney, and Clarke tries to play the same system again, he's going to get sacked because we'll get absolutely pumped.

I like Clarke and I'm not Clarke out yet. But this has all the classic signs of a good manager going stale because he's been with one team for too long.

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I posted this in the match thread but sort of replicating here as more appropriate.

The lack of tactical flexibility is astonishing . No matter what players are fit, no matter what team we are playing, the same formation trudged out whether it suits us or not. Utter incompetency from a manager at that level. 
 

Clarke’s big achievement is reaching the 24 team euros. In the last 6 years, Wales have qualified for that twice (got to the semi final once and got a World Cup place), Ireland and Northern Ireland both got out their euro groups when they made it there. So Clarke’s big achievement is achieving less than every other home nations team has achieved in recent years and lucking there on coin toss penalty shoot outs. 
Losing like that to this dreadful Ireland team is borderline Mcleish in Kazakhstan stuff, staggeringly bad.

Will be remembered fondly for his contribution in getting us to the Euros (although as mentioned above not really the amazing achievement some would have you believe) but it’s time to go for me, tactically being made to look clueless too often which I didn’t expect when he was appointed but here we are. 

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3 minutes ago, 2426255 said:

Here's the thing with football systems, there aren't really that many variations in terms of systems that a manager with over 20 years of experience won't have seen before. They aren't the be all and end all. The 11 players are the important thing.

That's Scottish football in a nutshell 

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56 minutes ago, justinjest said:

late to the party and didn't read all the previous comments, so apologies if I'm repeating what's already been said.

a) anyone who has watched a Steve Clarke team will know exactly what you are getting. Defensive, cautious, hard to beat teams, with little flair / attacking performances - these Scotland performances are not a surprise.

b) I'm a season ticket holder at Celtic Park and cannot think of any forward, that I've seen, who should be in the Scotland team. We have a real problem with attacking Scottish players.

c) which manager, who would take the job, could do better?

We are where we are for a reason - we don't have any great players and we don't have enough decent players, especially forwards.

 

Nothing about our performance today or in the Ukraine game was “hard to beat”.

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32 minutes ago, Diamonds are Forever said:

Did you not watch the Ukraine game?

The problems with the system have been discussed, but regardless of the specific problems the wider issue is that we are so predictable in the way we will play. Obviously all teams have a preferred system but most are adaptable and have the capacity to change. Any side we face now knows exactly what they are facing, knows exactly how to stop us, and knows exactly where to expose us.

Ireland showed today the value of surprise by changing their system, and even the relative unknown of what to expect from Ukraine had an effect in us. On the other hand those teams knew exactly what they could expect from us and planned accordingly.

During Strachan's time in charge there were lots of positives, particularly at the start, but what ultimately did for him and us was the increasing stubbornness which he showed throughout his time. I worry that Clarke is starting to go that way too, the change (or lack of) at half-time today to his favourite of McTominay at centre back reeked of that. I really want him to be successful but I worry we're going to become a stale, predictable and ultimately ineffective team under him.

Here's the thing with football systems, there aren't really that many variations in terms of systems that a manager with over 20 years of experience won't have seen before. They aren't the be all and end all. The 11 players that are performing the system and their roles that are the important thing.

Edited by 2426255
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5 minutes ago, 2426255 said:

Here's the thing with football systems, there aren't really that many variations in terms of systems that a manager with over 20 years of experience won't have seen before. They aren't the be all and end all. The 11 players that are performing the system and their roles that are the important thing.

So the manager is irrelevant? 

Or can he choose the wrong players in his chosen 11?

It seems you are putting up any argument you can to absolve a manager of any responsibility

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