Queen’s Park 21/22

[Passionate]

Putting rivalries aside,  a !title surprised to see Ellis and co depart,  alright things were rosy a few weeks ago, but hey his is a tough league full of teams with the scars of battle trying to get out the dammed thing, Cove, Montrose, ourselves , Falkirk are stuck in no man's land,  alright Falkirk are on a similar plane to yourselves, scratching your head wondering why throwing money at this league isn't working.....

 

Stability and patience seems to be the way forward in his league,  Hartley, Petrie, Murray all been at their clubs for a number of years and slowly are getting consistent improvement.....

 

Unfortunately stabi!ity and patience is not a trait of your big business hitters..

 

Hope Queens get sorted although there does seem a bit of a Gretna about the whole thing...

 

For the record my.money is on Jack Ross....

 

(do you have a female physio by any chance)....

[Dunning1874]

11 minutes ago, Zanetti said:

I loved Kettlewell when he played for us, and I'd probably still be fairly excited to see him get the job for that reason alone, but I don't know if we can really afford another experiment which ultimately he would be. His record (as sole manager) at County was poor.

Agree that Jack Ross is unrealistic but I'd be surprised if Dempster hasn't at least given him a call anyway, seeing as they worked together at Hibs. It's an attractive position and if the money's right we can definitely aim for someone with decent pedigree.

I suppose the question with Kettlewell is how long term are you thinking? His track record in the Premiership with Ross County leaves massive question marks on whether he'd be the right man to keep you in the Championship should you get there, but albeit as co-manager he did win the Championship a canter with them in the first place. While that was with a big budget relative to most of the division and failing to win promotion would have been a sackable failure, I don't think it's a big stretch to say getting Queen's Park out of League One is a similar task.

[Gall09]

1 hour ago, Passionate said:

Stability and patience seems to be the way forward in his league,  Hartley, Petrie, Murray all been at their clubs for a number of years and slowly are getting consistent improvement.....

 

Unfortunately stabi!ity and patience is not a trait of your big business hitters…

It’s like anything, if you’ve been watching us all season you would realise that the football, particularly the last 2 months, has been dreadful to watch. Pumping Falkirk then drawing away to Montrose are good results, but had you watched the Montrose game you would see they should’ve won. 

We do have a good squad, but Ellis definitely was not getting the best out of them. Week by week it felt as though he was sending them out with no instructions, just hoping that something would happen. 

[Bring Back Paddy Flannery]

The Queens Park job is a very attractive job for a shit load of managers out there but I’m not sure that applies to Jack Ross. His stock is still relatively high despite ultimately failing at Hibs and Sunderland but if he was to come to QP and make an arse of it his stock would plummet. I think he’d most likely be fine but you just never know. I reckon he could waltz into a bottom half Prem job at the very least and I’d imagine he’s holding out for something like that but as someone mentioned above, money does indeed talk. 

[Grangemouth Bairn]

31 minutes ago, Bring Back Paddy Flannery said:

The Queens Park job is a very attractive job for a shit load of managers out there but I’m not sure that applies to Jack Ross. His stock is still relatively high despite ultimately failing at Hibs and Sunderland but if he was to come to QP and make an arse of it his stock would plummet. I think he’d most likely be fine but you just never know. I reckon he could waltz into a bottom half Prem job at the very least and I’d imagine he’s holding out for something like that but as someone mentioned above, money does indeed talk. 

Surely Neil Lennon will be near the top of the list ?

[Hampden Diehard]

31 minutes ago, Grangemouth Bairn said:

Surely Neil Lennon will be near the top of the list ?

Surely you jest. Anyone could have been successful at Celtic with that financial advantage and no opposition. His record in Europe is how he should be judged.

What job would be more attractive to Ross? Eternally struggling at Killie or any number of Scottish clubs who'll, realistically, win nothing or joining us with a decent chance to build up a good reputation with good money and an excellent infrastructure behind you?

If he came in and didn't do a decent job, it could be he simply isn't a good manager. I'd take him in a moment though. Rather that than some of the oft-mentioned jobbers who do the rounds in Scottish  football and don't really achieve much.

Edited December 31, 2021 by Hampden Diehard

[Grangemouth Bairn]

10 minutes ago, Hampden Diehard said:

Surely you jest. Anyone could have been successful at Celtic with that financial advantage and no opposition. His record in Europe is how he should be judged.

What job would be more attractive to Ross? Eternally struggling at Killie or any number of Scottish clubs who'll, realistically, win nothing or joining us with a decent chance to build up a good reputation with decent money and an excellent infrastructure behind you?

If he came in and didn't do a decent job, it could be he simply isn't a good manager. I'd take him in a moment though. Rather that than some of the oft-mentioned jobbers who do the rounds and don't really achieve much.

I know that Dempster has admitted she has a huge respect for him and he also has a good relationship with Haughey.

[spiders4ever]

Billy Stark

[I Zingari]

In the midst of all the speculation around potential new managers, it should be remembered that two men have been thrown out of work on the last day of the year and now face an uncertain future.

[bridgeofweirdo]

12 minutes ago, spiders4ever said:

Billy Stark

If there is a God.

[Zanetti]

16 minutes ago, I Zingari said:

In the midst of all the speculation around potential new managers, it should be remembered that two men have been thrown out of work on the last day of the year and now face an uncertain future.

With all due to respect to Ellis and Murray, if job security was their priority then they were in the wrong line of work. Football is a fickle business, and no position is ever less safe that that of a manager.

[Bring Back Paddy Flannery]

8 hours ago, Hampden Diehard said:

What job would be more attractive to Ross? Eternally struggling at Killie or any number of Scottish clubs who'll, realistically, win nothing or joining us with a decent chance to build up a good reputation with good money and an excellent infrastructure behind you?

If he came in and didn't do a decent job, it could be he simply isn't a good manager. I'd take him in a moment though. Rather that than some of the oft-mentioned jobbers who do the rounds in Scottish  football and don't really achieve much.

He already has a pretty good reputation and unless he takes QP straight up to the top league fairly quickly I fail to see how his reputation will be enhanced. Given the budget he will have at his disposal then getting you to the top half of the Championship in the next 2 seasons wont really be seen as a huge achievement IMO, any competent manager should be achieving that.

I actually don’t think it’s a ridiculous shout that he’ll be the next manager but I do think it’s a risky move for him. He’ll be expected to succeed quickly given the resources and failure at this sort of level would probably finish him.

[williebraveheart]

20 hours ago, SLClyde said:

What’s happened to Willie Muir? Noticed he’s not been playing recently. 
 

Wouldn’t be surprised to see Kettlewell get the job. 

The problem is we have two, sorry three, very good goalkeepers. Ferrie came in and has done little or nothing wrong so he has the spot for now. Things may change in the current situation. I am not sure about Kettlewell as No 1 but as assistant to the right man he would be great.

[Bring Your Own Socks]

13 hours ago, Zanetti said:

With all due to respect to Ellis and Murray, if job security was their priority then they were in the wrong line of work. Football is a fickle business, and no position is ever less safe that that of a manager.

I flagged up the Mark Roberts comparison a few weeks ago and the timing is exactly the same. The reason I was given at the time, in a private conversation, was they simply couldn’t trust him with a January budget. So in came McKinnon. Seems probable this would be a big part of this decision.

Where the comparison splits is the fact that for the first time ever, the QP Committee chose to invite Ellis into the closed chamber of the club’s AGM, just eleven days before sacking him. His role was to speak on behalf of his “department” which included reference to the January window. If Ellis hadn’t been there no-one would have thought anything of it but he was, and the point was made that it was the first time the coach had attended. Why do that if the guy was one game away from the sack? What else that was said that evening that was deceptive?

All this talk of “professionalism” and “results driven” doesn’t seem to be applying to other “departments” in the club. If Ellis has been such a poor performer I sincerely hope that whoever offered him the job just six months ago isn’t anywhere near the meeting with the next guy, who will still have the same underachieving superstars that McKinnon signed. There’s nothing professional about how any of this has been handled.

 

 

[an86]

14 hours ago, I Zingari said:

In the midst of all the speculation around potential new managers, it should be remembered that two men have been thrown out of work on the last day of the year and now face an uncertain future.

Of course, but it’s the nature of the beast and every manager knows it. Wish Laurie Ellis well and I’m sure he’ll get back in somewhere, either as an understudy or manager. Writing looked to be on the wall when we took two points from nine against Peterhead, Clyde and East Fife.

Promotion isn’t a must, but being in the discussion for it in May certainly is. The trajectory was downward and looking likely to drop out of the top four. Most of the players have regressed as well. It’s the right call. Let’s hope we get the next one right. 

[Dave]

1 hour ago, Bring Your Own Socks said:

All this talk of “professionalism” and “results driven” doesn’t seem to be applying to other “departments” in the club. If Ellis has been such a poor performer I sincerely hope that whoever offered him the job just six months ago isn’t anywhere near the meeting with the next guy, who will still have the same underachieving superstars that McKinnon signed. There’s nothing professional about how any of this has been handled.

 

 

Have to disagree with this point, didn't we spend most of the summer complaining about the communication from the club to the point where members actually tried to force an EGM? I've not been following QP as long as some here but in the last 15 years its the first time I remember seeing that happening. The club has been held to a higher standard off the park than before so it goes that the same has to happen on the park. 

[Bring Your Own Socks]

1 hour ago, Dave said:

Have to disagree with this point, didn't we spend most of the summer complaining about the communication from the club to the point where members actually tried to force an EGM? I've not been following QP as long as some here but in the last 15 years its the first time I remember seeing that happening. The club has been held to a higher standard off the park than before so it goes that the same has to happen on the park. 

It was said at the pre-vote meetings and endorsed again at the summer meeting. The objective was to have a professional set-up and retain the ethos of the club. The former gets a lot of focus, the latter not so much. Dempster’s disdain toward the club’s constitution demonstrated in the summer meeting shows that this is just another step in her career path and it’s no surprise that the senior players are only interested in what’s left of their careers. None of that is really in the best interests of QPFC, which is what I am interested in. The present behaviours are very different from the future dream that’s been painted. 

If I wanted to follow a results-driven money machine there’s plenty of other clubs like that already. We’re supposed to be something different, something better than that.
 

[Hampden Diehard]

BYOS - you're getting worse. Cheer up for fecks sake. Get someone to give you a slap.

I see a lot of the players giving it their all; your view on them isn't entirely fair at all. We have lost our way over the past couple of months, no doubt about it, and the manager has paid the price. We wouldn't have done that before so quickly, but we are a different beast.

We've reacted to the situation we find ourselves in and I think we had to. All but a couple of Scottish clubs would be pretty happy to be where we are (or are going). Have a beer and cheer up.

We have, though, underperformed, and I'm unhappy too. Hopefully we can turn this around.

 

Edited January 1, 2022 by Hampden Diehard

[craigkillie]

On 31/12/2021 at 21:49, Hampden Diehard said:

What job would be more attractive to Ross? Eternally struggling at Killie or any number of Scottish clubs who'll, realistically, win nothing or joining us with a decent chance to build up a good reputation with good money and an excellent infrastructure behind you?

Why would he be "eternally struggling" at Killie, given that we'll be in exactly the same position as you but a division higher? A club massively underachieving in the division relative to its budget and where any good manager should be able to come in and win the league next season if not this one. The difference being, of course, that Killie have potential that Queen's Park simply don't, namely to be a top six Premiership club and win trophies.

If Ross joins Queen's Park it will be entirely because of his relationship with Dempster and for the money.

[Hampden Diehard]

1 hour ago, craigkillie said:

Why would he be "eternally struggling" at Killie, .....Killie have potential that Queen's Park simply don't, namely to be a top six Premiership club and win trophies.

Believe me, I'm not having a go at Killie, but they've won two trophies since 1965 and it's much the same for most provincial clubs. The Scottish game is so heavily slanted towards the Old Firm, it takes something special (Ferguson, McLean and a dismal OF) for smaller clubs to be successful.  Even Hibs have one solitary Cup win in how many years? 

My point is that there's a chance for our new manager to be part of something, should it come off, which is building from what is basically scratch and that might be more attractive.