European Super League.

[Jim McLean's Ghost]

1 minute ago, sparky88 said:

Probably, but they will still need to pay them more than they are currently. Otherwise, what would the incentive be? 

Why would they need to pay them more? Once the big clubs decide on a salary cap they only have to pay more than the clubs they have left behind.

There is a misconception that player salaries always have to go up. But that isn't true if the club owners have control of the whole market. In baseball the total salaries are trending downward. Players are being paid less because where else are the players going to go?

[Dons_1988]

9 minutes ago, craigkillie said:

Part of the motivation behind the ESL is to create salary caps and avoid having to pay the players so much - the owners want to keep it for themselves, not pay the folk who actually make them the money.

But surely they still need to pay them more than what they get currently to maintain an advantage over the peasants that aren't in the ESL?

So they massively increase revenues so that they can pay more than non-ESL clubs but still commit to a strict % of revenues.

[Jambomo]

Just now, Dons_1988 said:

But surely they still need to pay them more than what they get currently to maintain an advantage over the peasants that aren't in the ESL?

So they massively increase revenues so that they can pay more than non-ESL clubs but still commit to a strict % of revenues.

If moving to the ESL blacklists players such that they can't go back, they can offer a bit more than non_ESL clubs but it doesn't always need to increase much beyond that if they keep wages structured across all of the ESL clubs.

[ahemps]

Surely they will pay them more to get the top players to come to the league. Once they are there and the other league wages drop considerably they may just hold them at a level that is acceptable to the clubs. I think a 55% wage to turnover ratio is to be some kind of rule or target. 55% of what they hope is a massive money maker is way more than any other league could pay them.

Maybe PSG could afford to match them but that would mean the gap in wages in France would increase even more than it currently is.

[Caledonian1]

1 hour ago, sparky88 said:

I can just imagine Joel Glazer saying 'We are going to have to call the whole thing off, Premier League captains think the ESL is a bad idea'. 

If there appeared to be universal condemnation for the plans from players and management of the big teams then yes, they will absolutely have the backing of the public and the media and I think it could have an impact.

[coprolite]

I was wondering what the competition law position might be for fifa restricting International eligibility. 

Sounds like it might not be feasible for them to do this (in the EU and UK anyway). 

It sounds like that the reasons Real Madrid's chairperson /ceo/ presidente has been giving for setting the shitshow up in the first might also stop them restricting access to other clubs though. 

From a lawyer's website, dated middle of last year:

"The publication of the final version of the ISU decision 
allows further insight into the assessment that the 
European Commission will conduct when reviewing 
the compatibility of eligibility rules with the competition 
rules. In particular, it is clear that, in setting their 
eligibility rules, sporting bodies and event organisers 
must ensure that their eligibility rules are based only 
on legitimate objectives (explicitly excluding their own 
economic interests) and that the eligibility rules are 
inherent and proportionate to achieve those objectives."

The basic idea is that all sports organisations would be breaking competition law by organising collision if there wasn't a special exemption. But that only applies where there are sporting reasons to collude. 

This will be a lucrative time for sports lawyers. 

[Jim McLean's Ghost]

Just now, Caledonian1 said:

If there appeared to be universal condemnation for the plans from players and management of the big teams then yes, they will absolutely have the backing of the public and the media and I think it could have an impact.

The media not being on board is the main disaster.

The whole thing is meant to be about TV rights but if all the major broadcasters have decided they get better value in the long term and won't pay for the Super League then it is dead in the water.

Amazon's statement today was I think a major hammer blow. If Sky, BT, Amazon are all out then is the ESL going to be on Premier Sports? Or is it DAZN or Disney+ or some other niche streaming service.

[sparky88]

1 minute ago, Jim McLean's Ghost said:

The media not being on board is the main disaster.

The whole thing is meant to be about TV rights but if all the major broadcasters have decided they get better value in the long term and won't pay for the Super League then it is dead in the water.

Amazon's statement today was I think a major hammer blow. If Sky, BT, Amazon are all out then is the ESL going to be on Premier Sports? Or is it DAZN or Disney+ or some other niche streaming service.

Or their own ESL TV

[ahemps]

1 minute ago, Jim McLean's Ghost said:

The media not being on board is the main disaster.

The whole thing is meant to be about TV rights but if all the major broadcasters have decided they get better value in the long term and won't pay for the Super League then it is dead in the water.

Amazon's statement today was I think a major hammer blow. If Sky, BT, Amazon are all out then is the ESL going to be on Premier Sports? Or is it DAZN or Disney+ or some other niche streaming service.

Surely they have a media company lined up???? Would seem a massive oversight form them to not have one sorted.

[Jambomo]

I think what's interesting here is how much of a fright this has given everyone and I don't just mean UEFA, EPL or SKY. The fans of all of the clubs but especially these 6 all seem to be pretty united in hating their owners right now and I suspect this has given enough of a reality shock that its a good time to force through some better changes (i.e. a salary cap, financial regulation etc. aspects of it aren't a bad idea). I think its taken this to show exactly how badly they need regulation and how in thrall they are to the biggest clubs, that they will never be satisfied in how much money they can make, that they probably need to make leagues like the EPL more financially viable so they aren't constantly being blackmailed for more concessions. 

[DiegoDiego]

Premier Sports? Or is it DAZN or Disney+ or some other niche streaming service.

DAZN is more than just a niche streaming service. They're a traditional broadcaster too and a great excuse to post a photo of Diletta Leotta.

[Jambomo]

3 minutes ago, ahemps said:

Surely they have a media company lined up???? Would seem a massive oversight form them to not have one sorted.

No, apparently not. 

[Detournement]

8 minutes ago, coprolite said:

I was wondering what the competition law position might be for fifa restricting International eligibility. 

Every international player is registered with a club which is a member of a national association under the UEFA/FIFA umbrella. 

If the ESL clubs are outside of UEFA their players won't be registered association footballers therefore not eligible. 

[Guest TheJTS98]

13 minutes ago, Caledonian1 said:

If there appeared to be universal condemnation for the plans from players and management of the big teams then yes, they will absolutely have the backing of the public and the media and I think it could have an impact.

It's pretty hard for even the best marketing minds in the world to sell a sporting product that the participants have spoken out against. Players and coaches could kill this.

7 minutes ago, Jim McLean's Ghost said:

The media not being on board is the main disaster.

The whole thing is meant to be about TV rights but if all the major broadcasters have decided they get better value in the long term and won't pay for the Super League then it is dead in the water.

Amazon's statement today was I think a major hammer blow. If Sky, BT, Amazon are all out then is the ESL going to be on Premier Sports? Or is it DAZN or Disney+ or some other niche streaming service.

The media reaction has been fascinating. How do the media now do an about face and report on this as a part of the football calendar? From a PR point of view it's already starting to look fucked. It seems to have no credible supporters at all. Nothing that relies on selling itself can succeed in that case.

5 minutes ago, ahemps said:

Surely they have a media company lined up???? Would seem a massive oversight form them to not have one sorted.

I mentioned this earlier. Unbelievably amateurish. It seems to me that they've done no market research (or they'd be crowing about it) and haven't secured the funding to help them pay off the immense debt they're going to start with. It's starting to look like a complete shambles.

One of the execs involved said at the weekend that 'Things that usually take years were done in hours'. Aye, looks like it, too.

[ahemps]

2 minutes ago, Jambomo said:

I think what's interesting here is how much of a fright this has given everyone and I don't just mean UEFA, EPL or SKY. The fans of all of the clubs but especially these 6 all seem to be pretty united in hating their owners right now and I suspect this has given enough of a reality shock that its a good time to force through some better changes (i.e. a salary cap, financial regulation etc. aspects of it aren't a bad idea). I think its taken this to show exactly how badly they need regulation and how in thrall they are to the biggest clubs, that they will never be satisfied in how much money they can make, that they probably need to make leagues like the EPL more financially viable so they aren't constantly being blackmailed for more concessions. 

This would be an amazing outcome if they reviewed the current structure and how UEFA and SKY have created the gulf in finances that has allowed such a thing to happen. The fact these big clubs may have to come back with their tail between their legs may give us hope.

[coprolite]

2 minutes ago, Detournement said:

Every international player is registered with a club which is a member of a national association under the UEFA/FIFA umbrella. 

If the ESL clubs are outside of UEFA their players won't be registered association footballers therefore not eligible. 

But won't they still be registered with member associations for domestic competitions? 

[G51]

So it turns out that it’s actually UEFA and FIFA breaking antitrust law by threatening all manner of consequences for the breakaway clubs. Who knew?

[coprolite]

Just now, G51 said:

So it turns out that it’s actually UEFA and FIFA breaking antitrust law by threatening all manner of consequences for the breakaway clubs. Who knew?

We don't have antitrust law. 

Too much American telly. That's the problem here. 

[accies1874]

Which club is gonna be the subject of a "leak" soon that says they're in pole position to sign Haaland this summer?

[ahemps]

1 minute ago, TheJTS98 said:

It's pretty hard for even the best marketing minds in the world to sell a sporting product that the participants have spoken out against. Players and coaches could kill this.

The media reaction has been fascinating. How do the media now do an about face and report on this as a part of the football calendar? From a PR point of view it's already starting to look fucked. It seems to have no credible supporters at all. Nothing that relies on selling itself can succeed in that case.

I mentioned this earlier. Unbelievably amateurish. It seems to me that they've done no market research (or they'd be crowing about it) and haven't secured the funding to help them pay off the immense debt they're going to start with. It's starting to look like a complete shambles.

One of the execs involved said at the weekend that 'Things that usually take years were done in hours'. Aye, looks like it, too.

The fact these big clubs aren't even fighting their corner is bizarre. While I still wouldn't agree with them but if these owners came out and stated their vision and why it should happen then some people might get on board, in some ways as a competition it could be sold if they attempted to do that. The fact they are hiding and not even trying to sell it to their own fans never mind the footballing public is showing them up even more.