EoS Structure for 2021/22

[Dev]

On 24/06/2021 at 13:15, LongTimeLurker said:

Did the WoS not run into issues on that? A region can't be split into smaller regions got mentioned on the WoS subforum as being the SFA's posture on having geographical conferences in a WoS context as some clubs wanted for this season.

Think what's more interesting is that we have been assured by several well-connected posters that the east region (aka Midlands League) and EoS have been in close contact about defining boundaries so presumably the EoS are OK with Letham being in an HL feeder? I seriously doubt that east region pyramid entry would have been jeopardised over the status of a Perth amateur club.

Maybe somebody could revisit some of their old line of latitude graphics that were supposed to be oh so pivotal to show us how Letham aren't just south of Luncarty but also Jeanfield Swifts and Kinnoull as well? 

Nope as that referred to Tier 6 only.

[Dev]

3 hours ago, Burnieman said:

Their application was not rejected on geographical grounds, purely down to their home ground being a bit away from meeting EoS requirements.

How they have ended up in the Midland League who knows, they are clearly south of the dividing line. There's either a line or there isn't, and they are not an exception like Luncarty or Harthill. Strange one.

Seems as though the standards for entry into Tier 6 vary in the Lowland League area as in the Highland area. However, Letham isn't a "border-line" situation geographically. Stand-by for more clubs in the EoS patch looking at getting into the Midlands League if it is happy to lower its; requirements. Having said that a Dundee side, Menzieshill, with an already accepted ground (groundshare with Downfield) were rejected by the Midlands League clubs. Maybe they should make a late application to join the North Juniors/Grampian League or even the EoS? 

[Dev]

1 hour ago, Burnieman said:

That's simply not true.

Can you back that up? (Genuine question not having a go.)

I sincerely hope that you are correct. 

[FairWeatherFan]

57 minutes ago, Dev said:

It has often been stated here on P&B by regulars who should know that the West Lothian Juniors had it spelled out that they would not be coming in at Tier7 in 2021/22. In other words interested clubs knew the score from the start.

When it was made public Letham were applying it was just days after the WoSFL/EoSFL agree to their boundary. A number of West Lothian Juniors still had lingering hopes of getting in to the WoSFL. Tayside clubs were applying to the EoSFL. The season still had the potential to be played or cancelled.

When the deadline passed the Midlands League was announced but still with the hope of trying to get into the Lowland League. Some Tayside teams were initially still attracted to the certainty of the EoSFL, and possible avoidance of the Highland League. The season could still be played on or cancelled.

Then it was a week that passed it was known there were 13 applicants. Enough for a division of its own. Except null and void was looking the most likely instead of playing out the season to a finish or PPG.

Null and void wins out. Successful applicants become new members. The decision on 2021-22 comes down to two options in a membership vote. Same 1st Division Conferences with new applicants in a division below or equal Conferences.

They might have known what the options were going to be, but there were always options.

The Letham were rejected because the EoSFL Board didn't want them conspiracy falls down on several points. Such as If the LL Board are so keen on minimising travel, why have they never put regionalisation down as an option?

 

[FairWeatherFan]

Looking around and found this about Letham's hopes for their ground from back in early March 2021 before they went public on applying to the EoSFL.

https://www.thecourier.co.uk/fp/news/local/perth-kinross/2017642/sports-club-have-three-year-plan-for-new-community-pavilion-in-perth/?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=social

Quote

A Perth sports group has revealed plans to build a new purpose built community pavilion in Letham.

Letham Community Sports Club want to build the permanent structure at Seven Acres football pitches as the number of clubs using the facility continues to grow.

The organisation has been based at Seven Acres for a number of years and currently rents one changing room building, along with some surrounding land, from Perth and Kinross Council.

On the land the club has portable units and containers to provide additional changing rooms and storage for their activities.

The group has now applied for a further three-year extension to their temporary planning permission for the portable buildings and believe that will give them enough time to build the pavilion.

Jon Kidd, club secretary, thinks the new facilities are needed due to the growing number of clubs that use their ground, including the rise in women’s football teams.

“It has long been recognised by the club and our partners within Perth and Kinross Council that the current accommodations at Seven Acres are not ideal for what is needed and leave much scope for improvement in terms of our ability to meet the needs of our members and the wider community,” said Jon.

“After the mammoth effort that went into funding and developing the 3G pitch (in 2014) it was always our intention to develop a new community pavilion.

“It is our intention that as well as providing much needed new facilities for the 22 football teams that we have, it will also provide multi-function space for the local community such as schools, colleges and the very many active community groups in Letham and North Perth.”

While the temporary measures are in place, Jon hopes the club can hold consultations with the community to see what they want from the pavilion.

The timeframe will also allow them to work with the local authority to develop a plan for the site

Jon said: “This planning application is for three years temporary permission for the buildings onsite which we hope will be sufficient time to allow us to engage with the community about their aspirations, prepare plans and seek the necessary consents from the various departments in Perth and Kinross Council.

“Securing these permissions then allows us to progress with fundraising for the project to take it through to completion.

“The club has 22 teams at present including an ever growing girls and women’s section and the club hopes with the new facilities to be able to provide a greater range of facilities to all the members of the club and community.”

Sounds like quite a bit of work to be done.

 

[LongTimeLurker]

15 hours ago, Dev said:

Nope as that referred to Tier 6 only.

Don't think so. Ardrossan Winton Rovers pushed a proposal to regionalise the tier 7 conferences:

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/ayrshire/west-scotland-league-ayrshire-club-23946506

...Ardrossan's examples of how new conferences could look

Conference A: Ardrossan WR, Irvine Victoria, Lugar, Annbank, Craigmark, Maybole, Ardeer, Saltcoats, Girvan, Dalry, Whitletts, Arthurlie, Neilston, Johnstone Burgh, Kello Rovers, Muirkirk Juniors.

Conference B: Yoker, Drumchapel United, Glasgow Perthshire, St Anthony's, Vale of Clyde, Shettleston, Vale of Leven, Renfrew, Glasgow University, St Roch's, Maryhill, Ashfield, Petershill, Cambuslang Rangers, Port Glasgow, Greenock.

Conference Kilsyth Rangers, Lanark United, Larkhall Thistle, Wishaw, Carluke Rovers, Gartcairn, Newmains Utd, Royal Albert, Thorniewood United, Bellshill Athletic, Forth Wanderers, Lesmahagow, Shotts Bon Accord, East Kilbride Thistle, St Cadoc's...

but one of the WoS officeholders later clarified that this approach had been rejected by the SFA CEO:

That seems to imply that regional north and south conferences would also not be possible in an EoS context? If so, a reluctance to extend the league any further north than they can get away with would be understandable if even the lowest tier has to extend across the league's entire catchment area.

[LongTimeLurker]

18 hours ago, Dev said:

...However, Letham isn't a "border-line" situation geographically...

[Dev]

7 hours ago, LongTimeLurker said:

Don't think so. Ardrossan Winton Rovers pushed a proposal to regionalise the tier 7 conferences:

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/ayrshire/west-scotland-league-ayrshire-club-23946506

...Ardrossan's examples of how new conferences could look

Conference A: Ardrossan WR, Irvine Victoria, Lugar, Annbank, Craigmark, Maybole, Ardeer, Saltcoats, Girvan, Dalry, Whitletts, Arthurlie, Neilston, Johnstone Burgh, Kello Rovers, Muirkirk Juniors.

Conference B: Yoker, Drumchapel United, Glasgow Perthshire, St Anthony's, Vale of Clyde, Shettleston, Vale of Leven, Renfrew, Glasgow University, St Roch's, Maryhill, Ashfield, Petershill, Cambuslang Rangers, Port Glasgow, Greenock.

Conference Kilsyth Rangers, Lanark United, Larkhall Thistle, Wishaw, Carluke Rovers, Gartcairn, Newmains Utd, Royal Albert, Thorniewood United, Bellshill Athletic, Forth Wanderers, Lesmahagow, Shotts Bon Accord, East Kilbride Thistle, St Cadoc's...

but one of the WoS officeholders later clarified that this approach had been rejected by the SFA CEO:

That seems to imply that regional north and south conferences would also not be possible in an EoS context? If so, a reluctance to extend the league any further north than they can get away with would be understandable if even the lowest tier has to extend across the league's entire catchment area.

I remember this coming up a while ago and I believe that the incorrect impression was allowed to be fed upon here on P&B etc  i.e. a misunderstanding which is still rolling along. I certainly hope so.

If you can have conferences at the same Tier there can be no issue over which teams are placed in each conference so why not split them geographically.

If the Lowland League Under 20's are split geographically there's no reason why this cannot be done for adult football. The Lowland League is a senior league after all and the Under 20's are part of that.

There are no amateur leagues below senior level which remotely cover the areas which would  be created e.g. if the EoS decided to split its lowest division geographically. The same applies in the West.

The new Highland Leagues i.e. Midlands and North Juns/Grampian are discussing a shared Top division - which makes anything below that a geographical split.

 

[LongTimeLurker]

We'll see what happens on that last bit. Haven't seen that scenario being mentioned for a while by Dundee based posters. What we have seen so far is that both the WoS and the EoS plan to move over to similar linear divisions formats for 2022-23 meaning Hawick vs Luncarty could very much happen in the years ahead as a lower tier fixture:

[yessiricanboogie]

45 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said:

We'll see what happens on that last bit. Haven't seen that scenario being mentioned for a while by Dundee based posters. What we have seen so far is that both the WoS and the EoS plan to move over to similar linear divisions formats for 2022-23 meaning Hawick vs Luncarty could very much happen in the years ahead as a lower tier fixture:

It's still closer than campbelltown vs harthill

[Burnieman]

On 25/06/2021 at 20:47, Dev said:

Can you back that up? (Genuine question not having a go.)

I sincerely hope that you are correct. 

What exactly are you looking for? it's a fact that Letham's facilities didn't meet EoS requirements, but they were encouraged to work on it and come back in the future.  They've decided to go down the Midland League route, and despite there being a boundary understanding between EoS and Midland League, they've been accepted.  Where do any future Perth club applicants go, who knows.

[the tin man]

We'll see what happens on that last bit. Haven't seen that scenario being mentioned for a while by Dundee based posters. What we have seen so far is that both the WoS and the EoS plan to move over to similar linear divisions formats for 2022-23 meaning Hawick vs Luncarty could very much happen in the years ahead as a lower tier fixture:

Luncarty will win the league for me

[GordonS]

17 hours ago, the tin man said:

On 27/06/2021 at 07:34, LongTimeLurker said:

We'll see what happens on that last bit. Haven't seen that scenario being mentioned for a while by Dundee based posters. What we have seen so far is that both the WoS and the EoS plan to move over to similar linear divisions formats for 2022-23 meaning Hawick vs Luncarty could very much happen in the years ahead as a lower tier fixture:

Luncarty will win the league for me

I've now got an image of Luncarty players in the dressing room saying "Right boys, let's win this for the tin man!"

[Ginaro]

In the absence of a fixtures thread this seems as good a place as any to post the fixtures PDF:

https://www.eosfl.com/downloads/eosfl/The-East-of-Scotland-Football-League-Season-2021-22-Fixture-List.pdf

Interesting line in the Alex Jack Cup - for those not playing in the Scottish Cup "or any other tournament whose winners qualify for the Scottish Cup". What else is there, the SJFA Cup?

Also, strange to see Inverkeithing v Crossgates from matchday 6 being played on a November midweek - confirms the move to Dalgety Bay I suppose, but the Highland Games are cancelled so I wonder why that is...

Edited June 29, 2021 by Ginaro

[FairWeatherFan]

1 minute ago, Ginaro said:

In the absence of a fixtures thread this seems as good a place as any to post the fixtures PDF:

https://www.eosfl.com/downloads/eosfl/The-East-of-Scotland-Football-League-Season-2021-22-Fixture-List.pdf

 

Could have been a bit more inventive than the East, South & West Cup Winners Shield. 

[Yalay]

On 26/06/2021 at 23:34, LongTimeLurker said:

We'll see what happens on that last bit. Haven't seen that scenario being mentioned for a while by Dundee based posters. What we have seen so far is that both the WoS and the EoS plan to move over to similar linear divisions formats for 2022-23 meaning Hawick vs Luncarty could very much happen in the years ahead as a lower tier fixture:

It's not noted on the diagram, but presumably in the event of a net gain of one club from the LL one of the 7th place clubs in the First Division will have to be placed in the following season's Second Division, and as a knock on, Conference X would have to be reduced to one promotion spot. I also wonder why the EoSFL did not consider the possibility of a net gain of two clubs from the LL.

Edited June 30, 2021 by Yalay

[Ginaro]

12 hours ago, Ginaro said:

Also, strange to see Inverkeithing v Crossgates from matchday 6 being played on a November midweek - confirms the move to Dalgety Bay I suppose, but the Highland Games are cancelled so I wonder why that is...

To answer my own question, it seems to be because of the Alex Jack Cup first round being scheduled for that date, all the teams playing on 7th August are licensed clubs so don't take part in the AJC. 

Apart from the Conference X teams though, some of whom are scheduled to play on each AJC date - so I wonder if they are still competing in the Junior Cup... 

[FairWeatherFan]

41 minutes ago, Ginaro said:

To answer my own question, it seems to be because of the Alex Jack Cup first round being scheduled for that date, all the teams playing on 7th August are licensed clubs so don't take part in the AJC. 

Apart from the Conference X teams though, some of whom are scheduled to play on each AJC date - so I wonder if they are still competing in the Junior Cup... 

HJ did actually have a response to this earlier this morning, but seems to have been deleted. The post was about your query & the +1 relegation issue. So not sure exactly what may have been wrong to have led to the deletion.

The bit about Inverkeithing & Crossgates was roughly about running out of free dates being Premier Division teams and AJC being played on Saturdays. No mention of the Junior Cup.

EDIT: I was just looking at the 7th August on the Fixture list. It seems like all the potential AJC teams have been left free. Sauchie, Dunbar, St Andrews, and Musselburgh are down for games which might suggest SFA Membership being gained.

Conference X having games though is weird. All those teams seem to have a game scheduled for either of the first couple of rounds of the Junior Cup though.

Edited June 30, 2021 by FairWeatherFan

[Ginaro]

6 hours ago, FairWeatherFan said:

EDIT: I was just looking at the 7th August on the Fixture list. It seems like all the potential AJC teams have been left free. Sauchie, Dunbar, St Andrews, and Musselburgh are down for games which might suggest SFA Membership being gained.

Conference X having games though is weird. All those teams seem to have a game scheduled for either of the first couple of rounds of the Junior Cup though.

Dalkeith is the fifth club listed on the 7th without a licence. Would be helpful if the SFA got their finger out and announced licences and thus the Scottish Cup entrants (interesting to note that the fixture list assume replays are coming back).

Even stranger that it's only 6 Conference X teams in action instead of the usual 10... (a case for Mulder and Scully indeed)

Also going by the KO times the EOS are assuming that Burntisland will have their floodlights ready for action in mid August.

Edited June 30, 2021 by Ginaro

[FairWeatherFan]

2 minutes ago, Ginaro said:

Dalkeith is the fifth club listed on the 7th without a licence. Would be helpful if the SFA got their finger out and announced licences and thus the Scottish Cup entrants (interesting to note that the fixture list assume replays are coming back).

Even stranger that it's only 6 Conference X teams in action instead of the usual 10... (a case for Mulder and Scully indeed)

I forgot about Dalkeith.

With some of the cups already drawn and having random ties being played when the majority are on league duty. It might be just how things have worked out to try and prioritise the use of Saturdays and not leave teams idle.

I'm sure HJ will be back around to explain.