Are YOU Voting for the Alba Party?

[Ira Gaines]

As always, they have absolutely nothing but bluster and innuendo. 

[madwullie]

19 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

I notice Stinky Bone has his team listed as Scotland.  That explains it.

Q. ”So what’s the aim Steve Clarke?”

A. “To win the game.”

Q. “So how are you going to do it?”

A.  “Mmmm.  Errrr. Mumble.  Ollie McBurnie.”

 

Q. but really...HOW?

A. Aha typical COWARD. No wonder we lose all the time

[vikingTON]

I'm not sure that 'not having a credible plan to achieve independence' is quite the smackdown some people think. The SNP's approach of 'gie us both votes' and then gormlessly waiting for Westminster to cave is hardly their strong suit right now either.

[Ivo den Bieman]

...whereas voting for a party formed only because Alex Salmond didn't have his day girning inanely over Sturgeon's political corpse in the Scottish media will being us closer to independence...how, exactly?

[Trogdor]

15 minutes ago, virginton said:

I'm not sure that 'not having a credible plan to achieve independence' is quite the smackdown some people think. The SNP's approach of 'gie us both votes' and then gormlessly waiting for Westminster to cave is hardly their strong suit right now either.

Aye, that irony seems lost on some.

[invergowrie arab]

20 minutes ago, virginton said:

I'm not sure that 'not having a credible plan to achieve independence' is quite the smackdown some people think. The SNP's approach of 'gie us both votes' and then gormlessly waiting for Westminster to cave is hardly their strong suit right now either.

Seek a S.30 order and, in the event of refusal, publish a referendum bill in Holyrood and let the courts decide is still a fucking mile ahead of the ... checks notes... nothing, that has been put forward by Salmond.

Salmond's dimwit supporters might pinball about between "just get it done" and actual policies like UDI or bring the MPs home to set up a shadow govt (fucking batshit but at least they are policies) but at the moment nobody knows what Alba' s actual policy is.

[vikingTON]

27 minutes ago, Ivo den Bieman said:

...whereas voting for a party formed only because Alex Salmond didn't have his day girning inanely over Sturgeon's political corpse in the Scottish media will being us closer to independence...how, exactly?

Here was me thinking that the 'lack of a plan for independence' was what bothered you.

[BFTD]

4 hours ago, Stinky Bone said:

Yeah, still voting Alba on the regional list vote. Confirmed even more now that the SNP cannot make their mind up whether it will be early in the parliamentary term or later. Absolute shambles going on. 

f**k academics. 

I was born in this magnificent and beautiful country, if I want to be free I will exercise my right under the United Nations charter (which uk has signed up to in case you forgot) to choose the form of government best suited to my (Scotland) needs. 

Stop being cowards.  Assert your rights. 

Or keep blindly hoping. 

Are you quite sure you're not a Freeman on the Land?

I keep expecting you to mention the Declaration of Arbroath, but that might be too specific.

[Ivo den Bieman]

6 minutes ago, virginton said:

Here was me thinking that the 'lack of a plan for independence' was what bothered you.

What's the Alba Party's again, remind me?

[vikingTON]

56 minutes ago, invergowrie arab said:

Seek a S.30 order and, in the event of refusal, publish a referendum bill in Holyrood and let the courts decide is still a fucking mile ahead of the ... checks notes... nothing, that has been put forward by Salmond.

Salmond's dimwit supporters might pinball about between "just get it done" and actual policies like UDI or bring the MPs home to set up a shadow govt (fucking batshit but at least they are policies) but at the moment nobody knows what Alba' s actual policy is.

AFAIK the policy of the Alba party is to further tip the scales of the parliamentary balance, by converting hundreds of thousands of wasted list votes into actual pro-independence MSPs. Thereby reducing (in their best case scenario) the Yoons to a rump minority within Holyrood itself rather than forming the two largest opposition parties + the busted flushes. 

I won't be voting for Alba because they've foolishly put forward imbeciles like Chris McEleny as their top candidates, but I'm really not sure how their political strategy is a less legitimate path towards eventual independence than the 'both votes SNP forever and, err, our majority will definitely get us indyref!' mantra of the alternative.

We are not exactly dealing with a meeting of great strategic minds here.

Edited April 9, 2021 by vikingTON

[vikingTON]

33 minutes ago, Ivo den Bieman said:

What's the Alba Party's again, remind me?

Which party's Five Year Plan for independence will you be voting for then and on what verifiable grounds will it achieve that goal?

The dismissal of Alba on here and in the wider independence movement has got absolutely nothing to do with their 'lack of a plan to achieve independence'. It simply runs along previously emerged faultlines opened up yet further by the Salmond enquiry's outcome. To claim that there is some sort of political strategy rationale for choosing the SNP instead is utterly laughable. 

Edited April 9, 2021 by vikingTON

[sparky88]

26 minutes ago, invergowrie arab said:

Seek a S.30 order and, in the event of refusal, publish a referendum bill in Holyrood and let the courts decide is still a fucking mile ahead of the ... checks notes... nothing, that has been put forward by Salmond.

 

The SNP have had 5 years to do this, and haven't. 

[Ivo den Bieman]

6 minutes ago, virginton said:

Which party's Five Year Plan for independence will you be voting for then and on what verifiable grounds will it achieve that goal?

The dismissal of Alba on here and in the wider independence movement has got absolutely nothing to do with their 'lack of a plan' to achieve independence'. It simply runs along previously emerged faultlines opened up yet further by the Salmond enquiry's outcome. To claim that there is some sort of political strategy rationale for choosing the SNP instead is utterly laughable. 

Well, it does, really.

If the Johnson government will reject the SNP's plan- achieving a majority and then asking for a section 30 order- in what way will a fringe groupuscule concieved entirely to get Alex Salmond back into the parliament- add anything further to that plan? 66 SNP MSPs (for the sake of argument) being ignored...how does one extra from Alba (only Salmond will be elected if they have a very, very good night...unlikely)

The party was founded five weeks ago. It has no plan, no programme, no platform.

To be treated with the same contempt as Galloway and the fringe Randists /anti-Vaxxers / Brexit monomaniacs / loons on the AMS ballot paper.

[wirez]

The SNP need a kick up the arse.

Fed up hearing Blackford and others at Westminster giving it the -

"Scotland will not stand for this", "We will have our say", "We have a mandate"

Then we had the vote for us to stop Brexit! As laughably stupid as the folk that cannot look at a set of figures from the 2016 election and realise what will happen again with the 'Both Votes SNP' bollocks.

Edited April 9, 2021 by wirez

[ayrmad]

22 minutes ago, sparky88 said:

The SNP have had 5 years to do this, and haven't. 

Because they don't want to, you'll not convince the indoctrinated. 

[vikingTON]

19 minutes ago, Ivo den Bieman said:

Well, it does, really.If the Johnson government will reject the SNP's plan- achieving a majority and then asking for a section 30 order-

So *that's* the plan that we're supposed to be grading the Alba Party against? Racking up an SNP majority - even though a pro-independence majority has already existed at Holyrood for a decade - and demanding that Johnson's government caves in as a result of this political non-event to anyone south of the border? 

The UDI brigade almost sound sane by comparison. 

Quote

in what way will a fringe groupuscule concieved entirely to get Alex Salmond back into the parliament- add anything further to that plan?

If a 'fringe groupuscule' dominated by individual weirdos had no right to contest elections then the SNP would have folded forty years before winning a parliamentary seat. Instead of setting your own limits for their impact, try to take their plan at face value please. 

A mass shift of the (largely wasted) SNP second vote to another pro-independence party has the potential of punting the Tories and Labour into utter irrelevance. A pro-independence governing party versus a pro-independence opposition would - at least temporarily - shift the optics of the debate within Scotland itself. Rather than independence being an 'SNP' cause and tagged with its overall performance in government (which is a serious problem for any second referendum), it gets reframed as a 'national' cause by marginalising unionism within Scottish politics.

Perhaps the Green Party have a better claim to that role but that's the job of the electorate to decide over the long term. As a strategy for independence it is of no less value than the SNP's quite frankly gormless effort at the moment. 

Edited April 9, 2021 by vikingTON

[vikingTON]

NB: Anyone who has had even a cursory reading of nationalism studies would note that the transition of politics from nationalist v non-nationalist parties to multiple nationalist parties competing with each other for popular support is historically speaking the clincher for long-term independence. 

Perhaps Scotland is not quite ready for that transition, and Alba may well be the wrong vehicle for now, but the idea that independence will be brought about by the base of a single political party alone does not actually stack up with how it was achieved elsewhere in Europe. 

Edited April 9, 2021 by vikingTON

[wirez]

Speeches from SNP MPs to a, more often than not, empty House of Commons and then sharing them on social media has been their gravy for the last few years.

End result? Bugger all changes. They need at least a nudge to try a different tactic.

[BFTD]

Still waiting to hear what these alternative tactics are.

The more time goes on and nobody wants to give specifics, the more it smells like cordite.

[Baxter Parp]

1 hour ago, sparky88 said:

The SNP have had 5 years to do this, and haven't. 

Ok, at what date should the referendum have been?