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Celtic and Rangers B Teams in League Two?


falski

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All in favour of parachuting the 'B' teams straight into the Premiership, so long as they can never be relegated.

They'll probably produce so many quality Scottish players that they'll need third teams to accommodate them!

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Having the B teams for one season can be argued to be acceptable as you get the financial boost of two extra games with OF crowds the highest of the season, the £50k (apparently!), bit more publicity, and it didn't affect the pyramid as there were no tier 6 league champions to promote. A wee bit of crowd, press, atmosphere, and a breath of fresh air if you listen to Chris Aitken... (🙄)

However going forward the downsides start to outweigh the positives. The novelty wears off, you have weakened B teams on international weekends, postponed games on Dumbarton's shite pitch, and it affects the pyramid when they don't bother to increase/promotion relegation due to already having 18 clubs. You can also have your crowd, atmosphere and breath of fresh air when the tier 6 clubs come up...

Edited by Ginaro
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3 hours ago, FairWeatherFan said:

Broadcast deal ❌

Sponsorship 🤏 Just got a sponsor as the season was coming to end. Hardly clear if the OF B teams played a part in that.

Attendances 🤏The conservative estimate of 500 x2 x £5 hasn't exactly come to pass. Although cumulatively and factoring a higher average price they might meet that.

image.png.5db0823b654709ecce87c769e198c443.png

Player Development from u18s to 1st team 🤏 Both clubs have been creating their own blockade with teenage signings from outside Scotland: Juan Alegria, Joey Dawson, Bosun Lawal, Charlie McCann, Johnly Yfeko, Kevin Ciubotaru, Johnny Kenny. They have at least kept it to a majority of Scottish players most of the time, if only a simple majority of +1.

Sporting integrity 🤏 Things look like they'll work out this season overall. However, take the OF results out the table it would look different. There's also been complaints over the weakened teams during International weekends.

 

 

 

Are those the away support figures for those games? 
 

Anyway, the LL even bothering to entertain this just shows them to be diddy league which is too scared to open up to the real competition. Bankies, Pollok, Talbot, Buffs and Darvel all coming for you, can delay it with your desperate moves all you want but the change is coming. 

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11 minutes ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

Are those the away support figures for those games? 
 

They're just the headcounts or announced attendances.

While there was plenty to be laughed at in the proposal, nobody was foolish enough to say that the 500 would be in addition to the usual support.

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3 minutes ago, FairWeatherFan said:

They're just the headcounts or announced attendances.

While there was plenty to be laughed at in the proposal, nobody was foolish enough to say that the 500 would be in addition to the usual support.

Quite embarrassing crowds tbh. Even with the bigot brothers bounce they are crap by comparison to the league below. 

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22 hours ago, Burnieman said:

The SJFA have offered to run a national cup competition for tier 6 and below, with the same rules/flaws as have always been.

At a recent EoSFL meeting, that was about as popular as a dose of Covid in your squad.

I believe the HFL are not interested in any form of national non-league cup.

I think a National all in cup for tier 3 (or any starting point below) and below would be great. The highland clubs just don’t seem interested though, so the south challenge cup is a great alternative. I dare say the organizers might be open to including any teams north of the boundary that want to play in the south cup like maybe Brechin or lochee.

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The previous lowland league board trashed their reputation on old firm

entry. I just can’t see the current board wanting to do the same.

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50 minutes ago, BS7 said:

I think a National all in cup for tier 3 (or any starting point below) and below would be great. The highland clubs just don’t seem interested though, so the south challenge cup is a great alternative. I dare say the organizers might be open to including any teams north of the boundary that want to play in the south cup like maybe Brechin or lochee.

A national non-league cup should happen, just not under the auspices of the SJFA, who are not offering anything different to what went before. They talk about £80k sponsorship, but all of that will go only to those clubs who progress to the quarters or beyond.

Regardless of other issues, everyone looked forward to an away day somewhere new, and the beauty of the Junior Cup was that it was an all-in, non-regionalised draw from Round 1.

The flip side of that is that often, a draw somewhere new meant both clubs lost money due to the gate not covering the guarantee, and the guarantee not covering bus/travel costs of the away team. Loss of money all round, and no help from the SJFA (in fact, they took 15% of gate money). It lead to some north clubs just not entering.

However, regionalising the first 2 or 3 rounds takes away the point of a national cup for many clubs who might rarely make the "all-in" stages.

It's a bit of a conundrum and unless there's money available to offset these costs for every club, I'm not sure what the answer is other than regionalising it, and then really for me, what's the point particularly if the Highland League are not interested.

 

Edited by Burnieman
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It's the clubs that will vote on this and the trashed reputation was arguably mainly about blundering into a position where they were forced to make the Club 42 playoff rule change. That angle is done and dusted now.

It was depressing how little money per club it took to get the Old Firm colts in last time around so don't think a majority vote against based on principle is a safe assumption if the Old Firm sweeten the pot a bit more.

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7 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said:

It's the clubs that will vote on this and the trashed reputation was arguably mainly about blundering into a position where they were forced to make the Club 42 playoff rule change. That angle is done and dusted now.

It was depressing how little money per club it took to get the Old Firm colts in last time around so don't think a majority vote against based on principle is a safe assumption if the Old Firm sweeten the pot a bit more.

Bear in mind that every club board will have a couple of members who'd vote for whatever their big club wants anyway, regardless of money.

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53 minutes ago, Burnieman said:

A national non-league cup should happen, just not under the auspices of the SJFA, who are not offering anything different to what went before. They talk about £80k sponsorship, but all of that will go only to those clubs who progress to the quarters or beyond.

Regardless of other issues, everyone looked forward to an away day somewhere new, and the beauty of the Junior Cup was that it was an all-in, non-regionalised draw from Round 1.

The flip side of that is that often, a draw somewhere new meant both clubs lost money due to the gate not covering the guarantee, and the guarantee not covering bus/travel costs of the away team. Loss of money all round, and no help from the SJFA (in fact, they took 15% of gate money). It lead to some north clubs just not entering.

However, regionalising the first 2 or 3 rounds takes away the point of a national cup for many clubs who might rarely make the "all-in" stages.

It's a bit of a conundrum and unless there's money available to offset these costs for every club, I'm not sure what the answer is other than regionalising it, and then really for me, what's the point particularly if the Highland League are not interested.

 

Yup. For the Highland League clubs, the Scottish Cup has always been the prestigious national cup competition to aim for, even back in the days of the regional Qualifying Cups (where the South and, now-defunct, North Challenge Cups originated). Now they all get automatic entry to the Scottish Cup, the attraction of a loss-making non-league cup is less. I've chatted to several folk up here, terraces and boardrooms (portakabins), and most think it's a nice idea, but the practicalities (funding, fixture congestion) make it a non-starter currently.

Funding will be the limiting factor I think - it will be expensive and I can't imagine the competition would attract enough sponsorship to make it break even. I doubt the SFA would dip into their coffers to subsidise it.

No idea what the NCL and NRJFA clubs think.

 

Edited by Cyclizine
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20 minutes ago, Pyramid Watcher said:

It’s not the boards decision though.

It's not. Hopefully though this isn't presented as a joint effort.

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The last time this was partially sold on it being a one year vision as there were going to be further reconstruction. The 12-12-12-12 idea with Colts in the pyramid is dead.

This also isn't a case of joined up vision for Scottish pro-youth development. As instead of spending a year trying to come up with something, the OF are simply looking to pay their way into the pyramid again.

Edited by FairWeatherFan
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15 minutes ago, Pyramid Watcher said:

It’s not the boards decision though.

It is indeed not . So hopefully all those in favour last time have grown a pair and reject the OF Colts applications and encourage a proper pyramid system with clubs from level 6 able to gain promotion.

The baddies from the last vote Broomhill, Cumbernauld Colts, Caley Braves, EK, Spartans, Stirling Uni, Gala, Vale of Leithan, Gretna, East Stirling, Berwick . I hope you are making the correct decision this time.

 C’mon The Rose 🌹🌹🌹

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On 12/03/2022 at 09:26, Pyramid Watcher said:

It’s on the agenda, got a copy this morning when I questioned someone about the Colts -

 

Dates of next meetings
A General Meeting will take place at the ………….. on Monday 21 March 2022 with a 19:30 start and the following agenda:
1. Apologies for absence
2. Minute of previous General Meeting
3. Fanbase presentation
4. Increased promotion/relegation between Tiers 5 and 6
5. National cup competition for non-SPFL clubs
6. Guest club participation
7. Any Other Business
 

What's Item 3. about - Fanbase?

Item 4.  Increased promotion/relegation between Tiers 5 and 6

At least it's on the Agenda and it's ahead of matters such as a possible National Cup and Guest Cup participation.

With a limit on the max number of fixtures that can be fitted into a season it looks as though all possibilities will be discussed so decisions can be made about the last item - Guest club participation.

Given the increasing pressures being put onto the League by the SFA to alter the promotion/relegation situation any movement there e.g. to increase numbers to 18 (non SPFL) clubs would have knock-on effects on items 5 and 6.

Guessing and hoping that the LL priority will be to deal satisfactorily with increased promotions/relegations between Tiers 5 and 6. Thinking that a move to 18 clubs would be the most workable solution and hoping that it will be done in time for next season.

If that happens the National cup and guest teams will fall by the wayside.

Smiles all round! (Well, maybe not ALL round)

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What's Item 3. about - Fanbase?
Item 4.  Increased promotion/relegation between Tiers 5 and 6
At least it's on the Agenda and it's ahead of matters such as a possible National Cup and Guest Cup participation.
With a limit on the max number of fixtures that can be fitted into a season it looks as though all possibilities will be discussed so decisions can be made about the last item - Guest club participation.
Given the increasing pressures being put onto the League by the SFA to alter the promotion/relegation situation any movement there e.g. to increase numbers to 18 (non SPFL) clubs would have knock-on effects on items 5 and 6.
Guessing and hoping that the LL priority will be to deal satisfactorily with increased promotions/relegations between Tiers 5 and 6. Thinking that a move to 18 clubs would be the most workable solution and hoping that it will be done in time for next season.
If that happens the National cup and guest teams will fall by the wayside.
Smiles all round! (Well, maybe not ALL round)


Fanbase is a platform that facilitates smaller clubs selling digital tickets & offers other digital services.
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57 minutes ago, GNU_Linux said:

 


Fanbase is a platform that facilitates smaller clubs selling digital tickets & offers other digital services.

 

Thanks. Wondering what it's doing on the Agenda. 

Edited by Dev
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17 minutes ago, Dev said:

Thanks. Wondering what it's doing on the Agenda. 

At a guess I would think with some clubs already using it others may have been asking about it.  Fanbase may also want to talk to the clubs already using it about expanding it's usage. 

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