Celtic and Hearts B Teams in Lowland League?

[Gordon EF]

1 minute ago, oneteaminglasgow said:

I think he’s chatting about promotion/relegation between the LL and the leagues below.

I really hope so anyway, because the idea of 4 relegation spots in a 10 team league is fucking mental.

Aye. Read it back. You're right. Although I suspect when George Fraser talks about "ventilation", he doesn't mean between tier 6 and tier 5.

[Ross.]

49 minutes ago, Che Dail said:

Without question, this debacle has been handled poorly and badly communicated - not just the timing, but particularly since there was apparently no dialogue with the EoS / WoS / SoS.  

However, clumsy PR is not a good enough reason to abandon the project - nor is it right to burn bridges and have everyone falling out over a longer period - this benefits no one.  

Before the dust settles on the current diplomatic explosion, and on the subject of sporting integrity, I would hope that the League associations can now get round the table with the LL and  agree a suitable pathway for licensed clubs to make their way through the pyramid - eg get it to 3 or 4 promotion / relegation places asap:  'Ventilation'.

Clumsy PR is the least of the issues surrounding this. It simply highlights how ill conceived and thought out the whole thing is.

If this is truly considered a long term solution, then we shouldn't be trying to jump a few pages. There is an attempt at implementing a working pyramid in the Scottish game and this should be getting tagged into the bottom of the pyramid with a view to the 2nd teams finding their level in time. That doesn't just mean the "Old Firm colts", that means everyone in the game having the opportunity to add a second, third and even fourth side at the lowest level if they have the players and infrastructure available to do so.

In terms of long term development, the best way to increase the number of good players coming through is to have as many people playing as much football as possible with the best coaching available at the highest level they can get to. The Scottish game should be working towards enabling absolutely everyone playing organised football having the choice of being involved in the pyramid, no matter how many levels that means. This is being put forward as a means of further enabling the two clubs who already have every advantage going. It ignores every other club in the game and is being done in such a way that the only thing that matters is their ability to pay for it in the short term.

Short termism, funnily enough, is not a long term answer.

Edited May 14, 2021 by Ross.

[Mon_The_Fife]

But Croatia... I love the idea that all of a sudden Scotland are going to qualify for major tournaments because Rangers and Celtic have players playing against Gala Fairydean so I don’t understand why anyone is against it.

If the kids in the Rangers or Celtic ‘B’ team were anywhere near good enough they certainly wouldn’t be playing in the 4th tier of Scottish football. I’m assuming these players will be around 18/19 years old, so certainly old enough to be in first team squads. Rangers and Celtic have binned so many young players who have gone on to have good careers, Andy Robertson probably the most notable and don’t want to miss out on the odd chance that 1 of their ‘B’ team players can play elite football so will stockpile the best young talent out there - ultimately holding them back.

Rangers and Celtic couldn’t give a toss about the Scottish National team and no matter how much spin the gutless Lowland League clubs put on it, it won’t change that. As has been mentioned before when Rangers died, they had an ideal opportunity to blood some Scottish talent in League 2, however they were too busy spunking money on the likes of Kevin bloody Kyle. They have no interest in developing their own talent or seeing the National team improve.

I’m a qualified youth coach here in New Zealand, and granted the league set up here is semi-pro and a lower standard than Scotland, they have now implemented a rule this season that all teams must start with 2 under 20’s from their own Academy. Something the SPFL should be looking at if they really want to improve the National team.

[RiG]

45 minutes ago, Che Dail said:

Europe

Right, so you can't provide anything to back up your argument. Gotcha.

[FairWeatherFan]

11 minutes ago, Mon_The_Fife said:

Rangers and Celtic have binned so many young players who have gone on to have good careers, Andy Robertson probably the most notable and don’t want to miss out on the odd chance that 1 of their ‘B’ team players can play elite football so will stockpile the best young talent out there - ultimately holding them back.

I still don't get why Andy Robertson gets used in some circles as the poster child for 'B' teams in Scotland. I'm not saying you are by the way, i'm talking about the other people that make the lazy arguments in favour 'B' teams.

He got let go at the ripe old age of 15. With Celtic having u17, u19, and Development League sides. Changing that structure to u17, u19, 'B' teams will never get him in a Celtic jersey.

[Mon_The_Fife]

I still don't get why Andy Robertson gets used in some circles as the poster child for 'B' teams in Scotland. I'm not saying you are by the way, i'm talking about the other people that make the lazy arguments in favour 'B' teams.
He got let go at the ripe old age of 15. With Celtic having u17, u19, and Development League sides. Changing that structure to u17, u19, 'B' teams will never get him in a Celtic jersey.

Both Rangers and Celtic have released so many young players because they were not deemed good enough, however by having a B team they can hold on to more players ‘just in case’ 1 of them makes the break.

Guys like Robertson and O’Donnell will eventually find their level because they are good players whereas they would be held back by staying at Rangers and Celtic who have no interest in developing their own talent. I wonder how many Scottish players have came through their own youth set ups over the last 10 years and have gone on to make 20-30 appearances to benefit the National team of course...

[PastyMan]

For those of us enjoying the banter between Che and Marten

Dutchsplaining

/ˈdchspleɪnɪŋ/

 

noun

informal

noun: dutchsplaining

1. the explanation of something by a self appointed expert in Dutch football, typically to a person from the Netherlands, in a manner regarded as condescending or patronizing.

   eg "your response about Cruyff is classic Dutchsplaining"

[Marten]

1 minute ago, PastyMan said:

For those of us enjoying the banter between Che and Marten

Dutchsplaining

/ˈdchspleɪnɪŋ/

 

noun

informal

noun: dutchsplaining

1. the explanation of something by a self appointed expert in Dutch football, typically to a person from the Netherlands, in a manner regarded as condescending or patronizing.

   eg "your response about Cruyff is classic Dutchsplaining"

[Ross.]

15 minutes ago, Mon_The_Fife said:

 

Both Rangers and Celtic have released so many young players because they were not deemed good enough, however by having a B team they can hold on to more players ‘just in case’ 1 of them makes the break.

Guys like Robertson and O’Donnell will eventually find their level because they are good players whereas they would be held back by staying at Rangers and Celtic who have no interest in developing their own talent. I wonder how many Scottish players have came through their own youth set ups over the last 10 years and have gone on to make 20-30 appearances to benefit the National team of course...

At Celtic I can think of Tierney, McGregor and Forrest. 3 in 10 years at that standard isn't great, though also not terrible. I'd say that one that good every two years is probably about as much as most clubs would hope to achieve.

[Gordon EF]

If we really want to improve the national team, we should be encouraging Scottish couples to move to countries that have a good record of producing footballers to have babies, rather than England.

[PB1994]

12 minutes ago, Gordon EF said:

If we really want to improve the national team, we should be encouraging Scottish couples to move to countries that have a good record of producing footballers to have babies, rather than England.

This or the OF should loan there youth players to the Croatian B teams, they seem to know what they are doing.

[TheScarf]

1 hour ago, Mon_The_Fife said:

But Croatia... I love the idea that all of a sudden Scotland are going to qualify for major tournaments because Rangers and Celtic have players playing against Gala Fairydean so I don’t understand why anyone is against it.

If the kids in the Rangers or Celtic ‘B’ team were anywhere near good enough they certainly wouldn’t be playing in the 4th tier of Scottish football. I’m assuming these players will be around 18/19 years old, so certainly old enough to be in first team squads. Rangers and Celtic have binned so many young players who have gone on to have good careers, Andy Robertson probably the most notable and don’t want to miss out on the odd chance that 1 of their ‘B’ team players can play elite football so will stockpile the best young talent out there - ultimately holding them back.

Rangers and Celtic couldn’t give a toss about the Scottish National team and no matter how much spin the gutless Lowland League clubs put on it, it won’t change that. As has been mentioned before when Rangers died, they had an ideal opportunity to blood some Scottish talent in League 2, however they were too busy spunking money on the likes of Kevin bloody Kyle. They have no interest in developing their own talent or seeing the National team improve.

I’m a qualified youth coach here in New Zealand, and granted the league set up here is semi-pro and a lower standard than Scotland, they have now implemented a rule this season that all teams must start with 2 under 20’s from their own Academy. Something the SPFL should be looking at if they really want to improve the National team.

Celtic and Rangers would never vote for that.  Can you imagine Rangers having to play two Scottish youths at the same time in a match?

[Marten]

9 minutes ago, PB1994 said:

This or the OF should loan there youth players to the Croatian B teams, they seem to know what they are doing.

Let Celtic & Rangers Colts join the Croatian 2nd division, everyone happy!

[Gordon EF]

8 minutes ago, Marten said:

Let Celtic & Rangers Colts join the Croatian 2nd division, everyone happy!

This is a great idea. If we don't make a world cup final in the next 10 years, I'll be shocked. Don't know what it is about these Croatian 2nd tier teams playing in front of a couple of hundred fans but they sure do help develop world class players.

[Gordon EF]

Watch the gormless idiots like Aberdeen, Hearts, and Hibs line up to support B teams over the next few years, not realising that all it'll mean is they pick up and keep fewer good young players as the OF collect them all up in a big net.

Edited May 14, 2021 by Gordon EF

[Sergeant Wilson]

3 hours ago, Che Dail said:

I'm not an expert, but happy to defer to the suggestions and ideas of football innovators (eg Cruyff / Guardiola / Gerrard / Kompany), and I'm  content they have greater knowledge and insight on this subject than me or you.

Will any of them be appointed manager of Rangers reserves?

[FairWeatherFan]

32 minutes ago, Marten said:

Let Celtic & Rangers Colts join the Croatian 2nd division, everyone happy!

They are quite happy to accept loan signings. Even the Dutch are smart to send their best over there

Dinamo Zagreb II

 

 

[Jacksgranda]

2 hours ago, RiG said:

What are these wider benefits that you speak of and where is the evidence for said benefits?

We'll find out after a year - ffs, are you not following this?

[Le Tout P'ti FC]

Can anybody confirm whether this new book will have a chapter on Dalbeattie Star?

[Born To Run]

2 hours ago, Che Dail said:

Before the dust settles on the current diplomatic explosion, and on the subject of sporting integrity, I would hope that the League associations can now get round the table with the LL and  agree a suitable pathway for licensed clubs to make their way through the pyramid - eg get it to 3 or 4 promotion / relegation places asap:  'Ventilation'.

My understanding is that any proposed rule changes would need to have been submitted by yesterday ahead of the LL AGM. Any club can propose something with the backing of one other.

Really, really hope I’m wrong but I don’t think further relegation will be on the table. In my opinion, we should be aiming for three down every year but realistically they’d only vote to add one more spot.