Celtic and Hearts B Teams in Lowland League?

[Benidorm]

I am certain that the likes of Jamie Barjonas and Tony Ralston would have been 1st team regulars at Celtic and Rangers by now if they played a couple of seasons in front of 300 people not giving a f**k at Cappielow or Forthbank against Cumbernauld Colts, Caley Braves, Spartans etc. Its just too much ask boys to go on loan to Ayr or Morton or Partick Thistle and play with experienced players in games that mean something after all. 

[Melanius Mullarkey]

2 minutes ago, wastecoatwilly said:

It's not about the clubs it's about the players.

Of course, Celtgers have a wonderful history of putting the good of  the development Scottish football before their own needs.

[Thistle Scotland Europe]

I support the Old Firm having B teams in the Lowland League. 
1. This is to help Scottish football produce more good Scottish players. That is as simple as it is. It is simply to help our international side. Which is the priority. 
2. I do not care if it is self serving of the Old Firm. If you think it is self serving then the ONLY explanation for that is that it Will help the Old Firm produce good Scottish players. So GOOD! If you do not want a good Scottish national side, then why on Earth should people listen to you, on how to help Scottish soccer? 
I support systems that produce good Scottish players. I do not care if it helps other clubs. I support all Scottish clubs doing well regardless if they are Celtic, Rangers or Brechin or Peterhead.  
3. The Old Firm are winning every league anyway, so the idea that this is bad because it might enable the Old Firm to win the title, is a ridiculous argument. 
4. I would love it if all Scottish clubs could play B teams lower down the leagues. The more chances for young players the better. 
5. They do this in Croatia, Belgium, The Netherlands, Portugal, Spain, France and Germany. So if it works there it should work here. Look at Croatia reaching a World Cup Final. They have a smaller population than Scotland. If only Scotland could reach a World Cup Final.
6. I want all Scottish clubs to do well. Some people would rather Scottish football did rubbish, than help another side develop young players, 
7.  Then you get the lot saying that they want nothing to do with the Old Firm. Well why is it when a side draw Celtic or Rangers in the cup or a testimonial the attendances go up? Would your team refuse a big transfer from Celtic or Rangers, Would you refuse to loan their players? Would you really put your hatred for Celtic and Rangers above helping the international side?  

I want what is best for Scottish football. Lets create a system that EXPLOITS the Old Firm to develop good Scottish players. They would never fill their first team with young players, they would get slaughtered in Europe, so they would just let their young players rot away. So the preferable option is a system where all young players get competitive game time. The B team system seems perfect. 

I support B teams in the Lowland League, as it will help the national side develop more players. 

 

It would be fun. 

 

I do not see it as a humiliation to play Celtic or Rangers B sides,. It would be a big game for the teams and players. 
 

 

Edited May 10, 2021 by Thistle Scotland Europe

[Spyro]

25 minutes ago, Born To Run said:

You know as well as we all do that reserve/B sides cannot play in the Lowland as rules stand. I’m puzzled as to why you are taking aim at our podcast, however - or our clubs for that matter (I’m the only BSC man, Chris works with Spartans & Ben is involved at Kilwinning).

We’re not the ones proposing this. Wouldn’t necessarily call myself a cheerleader for it either, given my immediate reaction was discomfort regarding how this looks to the leagues below.

So why keep churning out the line, that “there are other colt/reserve teams in the leagues” whenever anyone asked the question? Rather than just answering the simple question and realising WHY it has been met with such dismay and anger among the vast majority of fans of football at this level. This is where my patience was lost with certain people...

Why should these 2 teams get preferential treatment over every other club in Scotland?

Between that and the way this has been sneaked out, rushed through so close to the start of the new season and up for a vote tonight, it stinks to high heaven. I’m yet to find anyone who is involved with any club at tier 5 and below who thinks this is a good idea, but low-and -behold it looks like it might actually happen. You can’t tell me that this doesn’t look like a complete stitch up to anyone on the outside

[Ira Gaines]

2 minutes ago, Thistle Scotland Europe said:

I support the Old Firm having B teams in the Lowland League. 
1. This is to help Scottish football produce more good Scottish players. That is as simple as it is. It is simply to help our international side. Which is the priority. 
2. I do not care if it is self serving of the Old Firm. If you think it is self serving then the ONLY explanation for that is that it Will help the Old Firm produce good Scottish players. So GOOD! If you do not want a good Scottish national side, then why on Earth should people listen to you, on how to help Scottish soccer? 
I support systems that produce good Scottish players. I do not care if it helps other clubs. I support all Scottish clubs doing well regardless if they are Celtic, Rangers or Brechin or Peterhead.  
3. The Old Firm are winning every league anyway, so the idea that this is bad because it might enable the Old Firm to win the title, is a ridiculous argument. 
4. I would love it if all Scottish clubs could play B teams lower down the leagues. The more chances for young players the better. 
5. They do this in Croatia, Belgium, The Netherlands, Portugal, Spain, France and Germany. So if it works there it should work here. Look at Croatia reaching a World Cup Final. They have a smaller population than Scotland. If only Scotland could reach a World Cup Final.
6. I want all Scottish clubs to do well. Some people would rather Scottish football did rubbish, than help another side develop young players, 
7.  Then you get the lot saying that they want nothing to do with the Old Firm. Well why is it when a side draw Celtic or Rangers in the cup or a testimonial the attendances go up? Would your team refuse a big transfer from Celtic or Rangers, Would you refuse to loan their players? Would you really put your hatred for Celtic and Rangers above helping the international side?  

I want what is best for Scottish football. Lets create a system that EXPLOITS the Old Firm to develop good Scottish players. They would never fill their first team with young players, they would get slaughtered in Europe, so they would just let their young players rot away. So the preferable option is a system where all young players get competitive game time. The B team system seems perfect. 

I support B teams in the Lowland League, as it will help the national side develop more players. 

 

It would be fun. 

 

I do not see it as a humiliation to play Celtic or Rangers B sides,. It would be a big game for the teams and players. 
 

 

 

[RossBFaeDundee]

4 minutes ago, Thistle Scotland Europe said:

Scottish soccer

f**k off.

[Born To Run]

1 minute ago, Spyro said:

So why keep churning out the line, that “there are other colt/reserve teams in the leagues” whenever anyone asked the question? Rather than just answering the simple question and realising WHY it has been met with such dismay and anger among the vast majority of fans of football at this level. This is where my patience was lost with certain people...

Why should these 2 teams get preferential treatment over every other club in Scotland?

Between that and the way this has been sneaked out, rushed through so close to the start of the new season and up for a vote tonight, it stinks to high heaven. I’m yet to find anyone who is involved with any club at tier 5 and below who thinks this is a good idea, but low-and -behold it looks like it might actually happen. You can’t tell me that this doesn’t look like a complete stitch up to anyone on the outside

For the first point, I’d defer to Chris.

In fairness, I’d say we all understand the reason for such strong feelings on this. You’re right that both OF sides would be getting preferential treatment. However, I can also see why some Lowland sides will vote for it (financially & otherwise).

I strongly suspect that this vote will pass tonight, meaning at least 9 clubs would see value in the proposal.

[Spyro]

2 minutes ago, Born To Run said:

I strongly suspect that this vote will pass tonight, meaning at least 9 clubs would see value in the proposal.

And therein lies the problem, it plays into the hands of all the doubters and trolls who myself and many other have took a lot stick from about what “senior” football in Scotland is all about.

Considering the potential backlash from all angles, I can’t help this is not over and we’ve just stepped back 10 years... or even worse.

[FREDDYFRY]

5 minutes ago, Born To Run said:

For the first point, I’d defer to Chris.

In fairness, I’d say we all understand the reason for such strong feelings on this. You’re right that both OF sides would be getting preferential treatment. However, I can also see why some Lowland sides will vote for it (financially & otherwise).

I strongly suspect that this vote will pass tonight, meaning at least 9 clubs would see value in the proposal.

I’d be hugely disappointed  and angry actually if they voted for this. L1 and L2 clubs ( with maybe 2 exceptions) are totally skint yet have told these two where to go. It’s about more that a wee bit of cash for a short time!, much bigger picture and in fact what is wrong with Scottish football and the horrible influence of Rangers and Celtic in our gsme. It’s a shocking slap in the face to the rest of Scottish football if they agree to this.

as I’ve said before on other forums I’d be done if they were in our leagues (yes I know LL is part of our league set up) but you know what I mean.

[Footballfirst]

5 minutes ago, Spyro said:

Considering the potential backlash from all angles, I can’t help this is not over and we’ve just stepped back 10 years... or even worse.

If the proposal goes through then I expect there will be a lot of regular fans who will boycott games against the OF.

I don't follow one particular team and tend to mix and match my games between LL and EOS, so it's likely that I will give priority to EOS games next season.

Edited May 10, 2021 by Footballfirst

[Cannibal]

Should scrap the promotion playoff next season if this goes ahead.  A complete farce that goes against the pyramid and makes a mockery of the division.

Edited May 10, 2021 by Cannibal
Edited for spelling...

[RedEd]

If the proposal is voted through tonight I would hope that SPFL2 clubs start to take a position. They might not be able to prevent the LL champions from taking part in a play-off, but they may be able to argue that the runner-up shouldn't take part if one of the OF win the league (or 3rd place for that matter if they finish 1st and 2nd).   

[Born To Run]

Just now, andrew21 said:

League 2 clubs have just had 150k grand (100k from government and 50k from James Anderson) given to them and even the bottom team will be getting 40k from league if its the same prize money as last season. Throw in £20k from League cup and money from Scottish cup games.

This is the big financial difference.

While SPFL clubs got the Anderson money and government help, LL sides only got a Government grant of <£10k. Like it or not, that will make them more keen on any proposal with potential financial upside.

(Thanks for the red dot in advance, Marsh.)

[Cannibal]

1 minute ago, RedEd said:

If the proposal is voted through tonight I would hope that SPFL2 clubs start to take a position. They might not be able to prevent the LL champions from taking part in a play-off, but they may be able to argue that the runner-up shouldn't take part if one of the OF win the league (or 3rd place for that matter if they finish 1st and 2nd).   

The whole league as a competition is devalued if there are games in it with youth teams that can't be relegated or promoted as far as I am concerned.  Seems ridiculous to promote someone from it or relegate someone to it.

[Spyro]

7 minutes ago, FREDDYFRY said:

bigger picture

100% THIS

[parsforlife]

22 minutes ago, Thistle Scotland Europe said:

general shite

Calls it soccer

 

 

Expects his opinion to be taken seriously 

[Cowden Cowboy]

12 minutes ago, andrew21 said:

League 2 clubs have just had 150k grand (100k from government and 50k from James Anderson) given to them and even the bottom team will be getting 40k from league if its the same prize money as last season. Throw in £20k  minimum from League cup and money from Scottish cup games.

Puts clubs in Lowland league (30k from government money)trying to get some extra cash into perspective.

Yes but they have then been spending that money on testing, transport, training costs, wages, etc 

[LongTimeLurker]

12 minutes ago, Born To Run said:

....(Thanks for the red dot in advance, Marsh.)

Wait until he does that to you 50 times in a row.

What the people that matter on this need to grasp is that this colt team thing can't just be the Old Firm if it's going to gain anything close to consensus acceptance and that you can't parachute them into a division in a way that hinders other clubs from progressing without generating a massive backlash.

You would have to be remarkably tone deaf not to have realised that by now but still they push this relentlessly with all the tact of a bull in a china shop.

Edited May 10, 2021 by LongTimeLurker

[Burnieman]

14 minutes ago, Born To Run said:

This is the big financial difference.

While SPFL clubs got the Anderson money and government help, LL sides only got a Government grant of <£10k. Like it or not, that will make them more keen on any proposal with potential financial upside.

(Thanks for the red dot in advance, Marsh.)

Didn't LL clubs receive something like £33k each from the SG/Lottery grant money just before Xmas?

Edited May 10, 2021 by Burnieman

[Jack Burton]

This is the big financial difference.
While SPFL clubs got the Anderson money and government help, LL sides only got a Government grant of (Thanks for the red dot in advance, Marsh.)

All the LL players and managers will have been on furlough the whole season. A fair chunk of the grants etc will have been spent on testing in the SPFL.