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The Hypothetical Roadmap to Getting Fans Back in the SPFL Grounds Discussion


The Getting Fans Back in the SPFL Grounds Questionnaire  

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2 minutes ago, craigkillie said:


Bands are allowed to hold gigs behind closed doors too. I'm not really sure where you're going with this.

Yeah, this.

There's plenty of bands using social media to put on live shows from their house(s) and getting paid for it.

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12 minutes ago, craigkillie said:


Bands are allowed to hold gigs behind closed doors too. I'm not really sure where you're going with this.

These gigs are to ensure they don't lose million pounds worth of TV deals are they?

Are these same bands continuing to break Covid guidelines while publicly being told it's a 'last chance'?

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2 hours ago, Merkland Red said:

And what's to stop them using partially attended football stadiums for gigs?

I know this isn't what you're getting at, but I'll answer this anyway... 

Costs.

The production needed to put on a gig in a stadium is astronomical. With distancing measures massively reducing capacity, it's just not going to be cost effective. 

Scale that down to indoor gigs and it's the same story. Eg, 1000 capacity venue, break even point is 500, but only 250 are allowed in. The only gigs I can see happening soon are ones that are heavily funded so they can afford the inevitable loss.

Look around our football grounds though, most have plenty of space available even in normal times, so hopefully when crowds are allowed back it's done on a percentage of capacity rather than a blanket 300/500/1000 depending on what Tier you're in.

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5 minutes ago, DG.Roma said:

I know this isn't what you're getting at, but I'll answer this anyway... 

Costs.

The production needed to put on a gig in a stadium is astronomical. With distancing measures massively reducing capacity, it's just not going to be cost effective. 

Scale that down to indoor gigs and it's the same story. Eg, 1000 capacity venue, break even point is 500, but only 250 are allowed in. The only gigs I can see happening soon are ones that are heavily funded so they can afford the inevitable loss.

Look around our football grounds though, most have plenty of space available even in normal times, so hopefully when crowds are allowed back it's done on a percentage of capacity rather than a blanket 300/500/1000 depending on what Tier you're in.

It's the same for football though. Aberdeen have the guts of 7k season ticket holders as far as I am aware. There's no point in the near future where we get to allocate a seat to half of those people.

 

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17 minutes ago, Merkland Red said:

These gigs are to ensure they don't lose million pounds worth of TV deals are they?

Are these same bands continuing to break Covid guidelines while publicly being told it's a 'last chance'?

I've got to the point here where I'm not really sure what you are arguing about, because none of these things seem remotely relevant to the topic being discussed. You asked why football should be given preferential treatment to gigs, I pointed out that outdoor events were safer than indoor events, but that outdoor gigs would be treated exactly the same as football.

Since then, you seem to have moved on to football actually being played in Scotland, which doesn't really have anything to do with the thread at all.

The bands are playing gigs for the same reason football clubs are playing matches - to keep their businesses alive and protect their livelihoods. I'm sure there are plenty of bands breaking covid guidelines - for example, Right Said Fred and Ian Brown are massive covid deniers so I doubt they're following all the rules.

Edited by craigkillie
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1 minute ago, craigkillie said:

I've got to the point here where I'm not really sure what you are arguing about, because none of these things seem remotely relevant to the topic being discussed. You asked why football should be given preferential treatment to gigs, I pointed out that outdoor events were safer than indoor events, but that outdoor gigs would be treated exactly the same as football.

Since then, you seem to have moved on to football actually being played in Scotland, which doesn't really have anything to do with the thread at all.

The bands are playing gigs for the same reason football clubs are playing matches - to keep their businesses alive and protect their livelihoods. I'm sure there are plenty of bands breaking covid guidelines - for example, Right Said Fred and Ian Brown are massive covid deniers so I doubt they're following all the rules.

The initial comment was where I posted to someone else that top level football is hard done by compared to other businesses.

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10 hours ago, DiegoDiego said:
18 hours ago, Steven W said:
I think there is every probability that when the time comes, certainly initially, it'll be local fans only. I'm pretty sure thats what the Highland League teams were doing when they had fans for a wee while. 

I bought a ticket for a Highland League match back in December (postponed, I've gone over a year without seeing a game now) and there were no checks about whether I was local or not.

I can't say I'm surprised.

I think it was supposed to be the case you had to live within 'X' miles of the stadium. Quite if it was actually enforced I'm pretty doubtful.

I'd imagine that Scottish League clubs, if / when the time comes would be told to enforce it and do checks.

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5 minutes ago, Steven W said:

I can't say I'm surprised.

I think it was supposed to be the case you had to live within 'X' miles of the stadium. Quite if it was actually enforced I'm pretty doubtful.

SHFL cubs were told to make it clear that only 'local fans' would be allowed in. IIRC, little in the way of firm guidance was given as to what local meant in the initial stages of that part of the farce, only for someone to decide it meant 25 miles. However, as those selling tickets weren't meant to ask for Track and Trace details beyond a name and phone number, it was unenforceable, and clubs were left to rely on people following the travel advice based on the tier they were in. 

It meant you had situations where the likes of Strathspey were nominally refusing to sell tickets to Buckie fans, who are in theory more than 25 miles away but at the time were in Moray which I think was in the same tier/level/whatever the f**k it was as Grantown. 

No non-league/lower league club was going to enforce that rule.

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https://kilmarnockfc.co.uk/news/get-your-season-pass-for-2020-21/
I'm sure Craig's concerns are nothing to do with this mental pledge his club made.
Is this still going to be honoured?

My concerns are absolutely nothing to do with this, and everything to do with getting fans (including myself) back to football games as soon as it's safe. It's literally the reason all our clubs exist.

I would be very surprised if many Killie fans actually requested a refund so this will have a minimal impact.
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The initial comment was where I posted to someone else that top level football is hard done by compared to other businesses.

I've read back through all the posts in the thread once again and I'm still none the wiser as to what point you're trying to make.

Your first post was to wade in with a reply to kingjoey where your tone implied you were disagreeing with him even though what you said just backed him up. Then you made a facetious post about football being more important than everything else, something nobody else on the thread had actually said.
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3 minutes ago, craigkillie said:


My concerns are absolutely nothing to do with this, and everything to do with getting fans (including myself) back to football games as soon as it's safe. It's literally the reason all our clubs exist.

I would be very surprised if many Killie fans actually requested a refund so this will have a minimal impact.

Well on point one that's how I feel. I just don't think football clubs should be given preferential treatment to get it done. I also see no evidence of a government agenda against football.

Yes, you'll probably get the odd knob who requests a refund 

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44 minutes ago, Merkland Red said:

Well on point one that's how I feel. I just don't think football clubs should be given preferential treatment to get it done. I also see no evidence of a government agenda against football.

Yes, you'll probably get the odd knob who requests a refund 

An agenda maybe implies something a bit more sinister but I certainly feel that football fans are held to a higher standard than others in Scotland.

The majority of this stems from Police action and how they treat football fans. Not to mention an outdated anti-alcohol policy that ultimately harms the earning potential of our clubs.

Rugby were granted their test event in August yet the request for similar in football fell on deaf ears with no meaningful explanation offered as to why it was refused.

Attend a football match drunk and then attend a rugby match drunk and see the difference in how the police will treat you.

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27 minutes ago, AJF said:

An agenda maybe implies something a bit more sinister but I certainly feel that football fans are held to a higher standard than others in Scotland.

The majority of this stems from Police action and how they treat football fans. Not to mention an outdated anti-alcohol policy that ultimately harms the earning potential of our clubs.

Rugby were granted their test event in August yet the request for similar in football fell on deaf ears with no meaningful explanation offered as to why it was refused.

Attend a football match drunk and then attend a rugby match drunk and see the difference in how the police will treat you.

Not the thread for this but I'm sure you know why this is.

If there was a true agenda against football then surely the 6 nations matches could be open to some supporters?

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5 minutes ago, Merkland Red said:

Not the thread for this but I'm sure you know why this is.

If there was a true agenda against football then surely the 6 nations matches could be open to some supporters?

If you're referring to the 1980 cup final, then it's absolutely ludicrous that you can't buy a pint at East Fife vs Cowdenbeath because of a riot at a cup final 40 years ago.

There is no justification for this policy. If you're worried about a repeat of 1980, simply don't sell alcohol during the four Old Firm matches a year.

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1 minute ago, Merkland Red said:

Not the thread for this but I'm sure you know why this is.

If there was a true agenda against football then surely the 6 nations matches could be open to some supporters?

If you are referring to the 1980 Scottish Cup Final which resulted in the ban, then yes, I wholeheartedly believe an imposed alcohol ban following an event that occurred more than 40 years ago is outdated.

I'm not sure about the point about the 6 Nations - attendance at all sporting events is currently prohibited but even when that was still the case, Rugby were allowed to hold a test event when football wasn't. Of course, when the time comes to allow fans back in, this will be when the best comparisons can be drawn, but I certainly feel football fans are held to a higher standard than other sports fans in general which is what leads me to my beliefs that we will be bottom of the pile when it comes to opening back up.

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34 minutes ago, AJF said:

Attend a football match drunk and then attend a rugby match drunk and see the difference in how the police will treat you.

Its slightly off topic, but I have attended numerous football matches pished out my tits and have never been refused entry or ejected.

Its entirely possible to behave like a non-c**t when steaming.

If you are reekin, pishing in peoples stairs, smashing buckfast bottles, threatening bystanders in the street (all of which happens when a couple of clubs come to Easter Road, I will leave the identities up to your imagination) then you may expect to be treated like a fucking animal.

I cant testify for rugby as I dont attend..............but behave the way I mention above and I dont think you will get a free pass.

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