Jump to content

The 2021 election and a mandate for Indyref2.


Erih Shtrep

Where will you cast your constituency vote at the 2021 election?   

133 members have voted

You do not have permission to vote in this poll, or see the poll results. Please sign in or register to vote in this poll.

Recommended Posts

You just need to look at the posts on here to see who the aggressive side is. Wishing death on old people and Tories. Woe betide anyone who challenges their Indy aspirations. Very civic and joyous. They are actually that stupid that they believe it’s just sevco supporters and members of the armed forces who vote no. 


Dry your eyes ffs. Not every independence supporter wishes death on old people.

Old people dying is probably going to improve the chances of independence considerably seeing as the majority of folk in their 60s are no voting, brexiteer Tory gammons. That’s just a fact. Doesn’t mean I actively want them all to die.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, John Lambies Doos said:
16 minutes ago, Stormzy said:
I love it when people try and use the above argument, it's like they forget that people age. Just wait til he discovers the honey roasted ham in their 50's...

Absolutely people age, and some will fade to the other side, but enough will continue.

...and they'll naturally mature into a more Conservative position, as they always do. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, jamamafegan said:

 


Dry your eyes ffs. Not every independence supporter wishes death on old people.

Old people dying is probably going to improve the chances of independence considerably seeing as the majority of folk in their 60s are no voting, brexiteer Tory gammons. That’s just a fact. Doesn’t mean I actively want them all to die.

 

I agree on all counts, but remember 1 in 3 people over the age of 60 voted YES.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, jamamafegan said:

 


Dry your eyes ffs. Not every independence supporter wishes death on old people.

Old people dying is probably going to improve the chances of independence considerably seeing as the majority of folk in their 60s are no voting, brexiteer Tory gammons. That’s just a fact. Doesn’t mean I actively want them all to die.

 

As I mentioned earlier there was a post 2014 Referendum survey carried out  of 5000 ref voters.

Surprisingly this showed that in the No camp there was a strong alliance between the youngest voters/average earners/protestants/women

So in that we cannot just point the finger at the older voter, even though they were mostly in the No camp.

However that demographic has drastically changed with Brexit which will have a positive yes vote in a second referendum.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

47 minutes ago, HeartsOfficialMoaner said:

Working class people don't become Tories when they turn 65. Might happen with the middle classes, I don't know. 

There are lots of old Tories because people with money live longer than poor people.  

And is that set to imminently change? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm not at all convinced by the "people just naturally grow more conservative in their old age" argument for a variety of reasons whether because the affluent are just more likely to live longer or that the history of right-wing parties is littered with grand bargains to win a new generation of voters. It wasn't people naturally becoming more conservative in the aftermath of the Thatcher years like it's photosynthesis or whatever it was largely because of Right to Buy giving them a tangible stake in the economy.  

I have no idea what the Conservatives great gambit to keep on turning the next generation of old people to the right will be beyond tedious culture wars but given we ended up with a catastrophic Brexit that really has zero economic benefits it clearly has some power to win over people.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, NotThePars said:

 

I have no idea what the Conservatives great gambit to keep on turning the next generation of old people to the right will be beyond tedious culture wars but given we ended up with a catastrophic Brexit that really has zero economic benefits it clearly has some power to win over people.

Levelling up the north would be my guess. While giving up on winning back seats in London and other major cities probably.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

35 minutes ago, MixuFruit said:

Growing old drifting right works when right means a bit less regulation, a bit more laissez-faire economics. Wobbling around a stable political average.

It doesn't work when people can't have a house/kids till they're 40, can't retire till they're 67 (& in a few years time 68? 69? 70?). You can't sell capitalism to people who can't acquire capital.

I meant conservative generally speaking not specifically to vote for the Conservatives so when discussing issues like a referendum on separation with potentially huge negative repercussions I definitely think people would mature into a content with the status quo position rather than a more bold and adventurous "f**k it" position. 

To summarise my point I think it's a reach and a bit of an unlikely thing to think the referendum debate will be spun at this specific point when all these old people die. People can hold on to that if they want, I'd say it's fair to say this is a gamble of a position to hold and it's not worth much credibility at all. 

Some people have been watching too much Logans Run.

Edited by Stormzy
Link to comment
Share on other sites

35 minutes ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

You mean when the far right descended on George Square throwing Nazis salutes in the direction of the cenotaph that some of them ‘protected’ in June? 

No, I was talking about the time Yes voters were arrested and displaying the characteristics denied by the poster I quoted. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, NotThePars said:

I'm not at all convinced by the "people just naturally grow more conservative in their old age" argument for a variety of reasons whether because the affluent are just more likely to live longer or that the history of right-wing parties is littered with grand bargains to win a new generation of voters. It wasn't people naturally becoming more conservative in the aftermath of the Thatcher years like it's photosynthesis or whatever it was largely because of Right to Buy giving them a tangible stake in the economy.  

I have no idea what the Conservatives great gambit to keep on turning the next generation of old people to the right will be beyond tedious culture wars but given we ended up with a catastrophic Brexit that really has zero economic benefits it clearly has some power to win over people.

This.

There are umpteen other factors in play that suggest people becoming more conservative as they age is not a strategy to hang your hat on if you are considering electoral strategy or policy.

Decline in religiosity for one, proliferation of the internet another. Decline in print news is a significant factor. Missus has finally convinced the aulds to stop having the Daily Mail delivered. For the very first time, she has witnessed her own mother agree with Nicola Sturgeon and exclaim that Boris Johnson was 'talking shite'. This never happened, not once, while she was still reading the Mail, in fact, every single day was a litany of Sturgeon supposedly spouting lies and disinformation. Why? Because she read so in the Mail.

Probably most significantly, there's no indication that young people now have anything like the boons the boomer generation are enjoying to look forward to. People wont feel naturally as inclined toward conservatism when they have a lot fucking less to conserve in the first place.

Edited by Boo Khaki
Link to comment
Share on other sites

55 minutes ago, Stormzy said:

No, I was talking about the time Yes voters were arrested and displaying the characteristics denied by the poster I quoted. 

Youre going to have to provide examples, 11 arrests were made at George Square that night, the vast majority being from the unionist side, the violence and sectarianism which erupted only came from one side, only one side was throwing Nazi salutes and running riot, any attempt to frame it differently is nothing short of desperation. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Stormzy said:

I meant conservative generally speaking not specifically to vote for the Conservatives so when discussing issues like a referendum on separation with potentially huge negative repercussions I definitely think people would mature into a content with the status quo position rather than a more bold and adventurous "f**k it" position. 

To summarise my point I think it's a reach and a bit of an unlikely thing to think the referendum debate will be spun at this specific point when all these old people die. People can hold on to that if they want, I'd say it's fair to say this is a gamble of a position to hold and it's not worth much credibility at all. 

Some people have been watching too much Logans Run.

thing is, if you were a youngish Yes voter in 2014 off the back of Labour/Lib Dem/Tory parties all backing No + in the face of the relentlessly miserable, negative media coverage then I'm not so sure support for independence will just "thaw" to support for the status quo as time goes by.

Also - everything since 2014 points to any notional status quo as being a red herring. Our future Union or no Union has a fair amount of uncertainty in it too.

I'm leaning towards another deeply unpopular conflict in the next 5 years being what finally breaks the Tories dominance, but maybe we're at the point where nobody down south would even care enough to punt them out from an Iraq war style debacle (shooting from the hip but I think that may have been a perfect storm; being seen to be America's lapdog for an unpopular George Bush was more damaging from people that didn't really give a shit about going into the war itself, plus the Dr David Kelly stuff  was damaging from people that didn't want the war in the first place. Afaik that + Gordon Brown replacing Tony Blair finished Labour off. The "bigoted woman" comment, what with the way Brexit turned out a few years later, was probably more important a factor than anyone maybe even realised at the time too...)

Edited by Thistle_do_nicely
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...