Burnieman Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 18 minutes ago, Footballfirst said: Highly unlikely this would happen, but I'd like to see a seeded pre-season mini play-off tournament involving the bottom four clubs from the premier league facing the top two sides from each of the conferences. Two winners would play in the Premier league next season. It would give everybody a fighting chance with something to play for, and perhaps even have fans in to watch. How do clubs sign or re-sign players for a new season if they don't know what division they will be playing in? Unworkable. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfirst Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 Just now, Burnieman said: How do clubs sign or re-sign players for a new season if they don't know what division they will be playing in? Unworkable. I'm sure there would be pragmatic solution if there was a will to do so. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnieman Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 Just now, Footballfirst said: I'm sure there would be pragmatic solution if there was a will to do so. The pragmatic solution is to complete the season to halfway and settle on PPG as agreed by clubs but now seems unlikely, or null & void as agreed by clubs. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truthteller Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 1 hour ago, Burnieman said: The pragmatic solution is to complete the season to halfway and settle on PPG as agreed by clubs but now seems unlikely, or null & void as agreed by clubs. Wee Burnie, how would it be unlikely when the fixtures secretary said it would require 3 weeks to complete half a season and the season technically doesn’t finish until the 30th June ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnieman Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 (edited) 20 minutes ago, Truthteller said: Wee Burnie, how would it be unlikely when the fixtures secretary said it would require 3 weeks to complete half a season and the season technically doesn’t finish until the 30th June ? Took an hour Half-Truthy, you're slipping. Just work it out. Penicuik and Dundonald have 9 games left to play, Jeanfield 8, another half dozen or more have 7 games and all that takes 5 weeks mimimum, probably 6 as each team wont get a clear Sat/Wed/Sat run every week. Add in the fact that you'll probably need 3 weeks of full contact training minimum (which won't be allowed until 17th May as things stand), then you'll need 9 weeks. That's not taking into account postponements. It's only just over 6 weeks from 17th May to 30th June. I'll also add in that when Scotland wide travel opens up on 26th April, along with shops and other things, players/coaches/committee turning round to families and saying that's me at training 2/3 times a week and then playing/helping twice a week until the end of June, would go down like a lead balloon for many. As you said yourself back in January "That’s the season finished because the covid 19 issue won’t be gone in 3 weeks. All the leagues will have to be voided and hopefully started again in August" You've been proved right eventually. Edited March 17, 2021 by Burnieman 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truthteller Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 No problem it’s just that the fixture secy has stated it will take 3 weeks to complete half the season 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnieman Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 5 minutes ago, Truthteller said: No problem it’s just that the fixture secy has stated it will take 3 weeks to complete half the season Kenny is exceptionally good at what he does, so if there's a feasible way of doing it he'll find it. I just can't see it unless the 17th May date is moved forward. Maybe there needs to be a conversation about how to avoid Conferences next season if season is null & void, and get First/Second in place as planned. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truthteller Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 3 minutes ago, Burnieman said: Kenny is exceptionally good at what he does, so if there's a feasible way of doing it he'll find it. I just can't see it unless the 17th May date is moved forward. Maybe there needs to be a conversation about how to avoid Conferences next season if season is null & void, and get First/Second in place as planned. Good luck with that one and keeping people happy 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnieman Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 30 minutes ago, Truthteller said: Good luck with that one and keeping people happy There is no solution where everyone will be happy. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bundesliga Boy Posted March 17, 2021 Author Share Posted March 17, 2021 (edited) I appreciate with each passing week it becomes more unlikely the league will finish, but if they really wanted to get to half way and then call it, they absolutely could do. Personally I believe clubs could get by with just two weeks worth of training. If you therefore start the first games on Tue 1st June and play two games a week, then even the teams that require 9 games to finish, would end their season on Tue 29th June. Yes that's very tight, and yes it doesn't allow for any postponements, but in 'junior football days' it wasn't uncommon towards the end of the season to see certain clubs playing 3 games a week (ie Sat, Mon, Wed etc), so perhaps for the first two weeks or so, some of the clubs may have to do just that to ensure completion. This would allow the likes of Leith and (likely) Luncarty to take their rightful spot in the top league with the bottom four in the Premier dropping down to accommodate them. This in turn reduces the top league to the optimum 16 clubs. I'd much rather give things another few weeks than do something hasty like null and voiding the EOS leagues right now. Edited March 18, 2021 by Bundesliga Boy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malty Guy Posted March 18, 2021 Share Posted March 18, 2021 7 hours ago, Bundesliga Boy said: I appreciate with each passing week it becomes more unlikely the league will finish, but if they really wanted to get to half way and then call it, they absolutely could do. Personally I believe clubs could get by with just two weeks worth of training. If you therefore start the first games on Tue 1st June and play two games a week, then even the teams that require 9 games to finish, would end their season on Tue 29th June. Yes that's very tight, and yes it doesn't allow for any postponements, but in 'junior football days' it wasn't uncommon towards the end of the season to see certain clubs playing 3 games a week (ie Sat, Mon, Wed etc), so perhaps for the first two weeks or so, some of the clubs may have to do just that to ensure completion. This would allow the likes of Leith and (likely) Luncarty to take their rightful spot in the top league with the bottom four in the Premier dropping down to accommodate them. This in turn reduces the top league to the optimum 16 clubs. I'd much rather give things another few weeks than do something hasty like null and voiding the EOS leagues right now. I’d say anything is possible. But I’d find it very hard to accept that after many months of lockdown and over a year in a situation alien to normal behaviour. That as soon as personal restrictions are removed - that players and management staff turn their full (or 3 games a week worth) attention to non family/personal liberty. Football is great, but just now it’s very much secondary. Why some associations can see that and others cannot is a cause for concern. I think the players/staff and everyone involved with the game deserve some quality relaxation and recovery. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swifty Posted March 18, 2021 Share Posted March 18, 2021 15 hours ago, Burnieman said: The pragmatic solution is to complete the season to halfway and settle on PPG as agreed by clubs but now seems unlikely, or null & void as agreed by clubs. Clubs didn't agree on the 50% scenario. That was a board decision. Not that it may make any difference, just clarifying. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnieman Posted March 18, 2021 Share Posted March 18, 2021 29 minutes ago, Swifty said: Clubs didn't agree on the 50% scenario. That was a board decision. Not that it may make any difference, just clarifying. Fair do's, I don't think any club objected to it, and it was done before the season kicked-off so everyone knew the score. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldandround Posted March 18, 2021 Share Posted March 18, 2021 Imho Its only teams not wanting to finish that are looking for an excuse to do just that. they can start training now. Six solid weeks or fitness will or should have the players in peak shape. Then a week of corners and shaping etc and bang. Let’s get started on 22nd may. every team is in the same boat with short start timesets go for it. Use the squads sign some ams or get the u20s involved. have a positive can do mentality rather than a lazy “too hard” viewpoint covid has been difficult for all let’s not compound it by giving up Lots of differing valid opinions. But im just for getting going and muddling through best we can. Again imho, voiding is cowardly and lazy. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GordonS Posted March 18, 2021 Share Posted March 18, 2021 10 minutes ago, oldandround said: Imho Its only teams not wanting to finish that are looking for an excuse to do just that. they can start training now. Six solid weeks or fitness will or should have the players in peak shape. Then a week of corners and shaping etc and bang. Let’s get started on 22nd may. every team is in the same boat with short start timesets go for it. Use the squads sign some ams or get the u20s involved. have a positive can do mentality rather than a lazy “too hard” viewpoint covid has been difficult for all let’s not compound it by giving up Lots of differing valid opinions. But im just for getting going and muddling through best we can. Again imho, voiding is cowardly and lazy. I'm generally in your camp, but without fans I'm not really sure it's worth it. I'd be really interested to know what the players want because without fans in grounds, they're clearly the most important people in this. If it were me I would want to be playing competitive football as soon as it was safe to do so, which would mean playing 2 games a week through June. But I wouldn't presume that's what they generally want. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnieman Posted March 18, 2021 Share Posted March 18, 2021 (edited) 22 minutes ago, oldandround said: Imho Its only teams not wanting to finish that are looking for an excuse to do just that. they can start training now. Six solid weeks or fitness will or should have the players in peak shape. Then a week of corners and shaping etc and bang. Let’s get started on 22nd may. every team is in the same boat with short start timesets go for it. Use the squads sign some ams or get the u20s involved. have a positive can do mentality rather than a lazy “too hard” viewpoint covid has been difficult for all let’s not compound it by giving up Lots of differing valid opinions. But im just for getting going and muddling through best we can. Again imho, voiding is cowardly and lazy. No club has said they don't want to finish the league from what I have seen. What does need to happen though it some consideration for players and officials., they arent pieces of meat to be ordered around when restrictions lift and devote 8 weeks of their lives to playing football which for many will be meaningless, and let's remember many won't be getting paid to play the game and have families. Club officials are volunteers. Covid has been difficult, very difficult for many and football may not be the first priority for some the moment lockdown is lifted. A bit of common sense wouldn't go amiss, rather than throwing accusations of cowardly/lazy around which is out of order, that language helps nobody. Edited March 18, 2021 by Burnieman 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black & Red Socks Posted March 18, 2021 Share Posted March 18, 2021 What does need to happen though it some consideration for players and officials., they arent pieces of meat to be ordered around when restrictions lift and devote 8 weeks of their lives to playing football which for many will be meaningless, and let's remember many won't be getting paid to play the game and have families. Club officials are volunteers. Covid has been difficult, very difficult for many and football may not be the first priority for some the moment lockdown is lifted.This seems exactly right to me.It’s often mentioned that fans are the most important part of a club and, if not them, then players - but what about the committees who, for the most part, are merely fans who have stepped up and volunteered countless unpaid hours to facilitate the games that those fans watch and that those players play in?To expect these folks to work tirelessly behind the scenes to put on two and perhaps three games a week to squeeze in half a season when there will still be no fans to witness it, when many of those games will be entirely meaningless and when, in all likelihood, all COVID protocols will still have to be enacted is not realistic in any way when their families will need to come first when lockdown restrictions are lifted.Some of the language used in an earlier post against the null and void option, eminently sensible imho when set against what is outlined above, is pretty much out of order and helps absolutely no one. 12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyramidic Posted March 18, 2021 Share Posted March 18, 2021 17 minutes ago, Black & Red Socks said: This seems exactly right to me. It’s often mentioned that fans are the most important part of a club and, if not them, then players - but what about the committees who, for the most part, are merely fans who have stepped up and volunteered countless unpaid hours to facilitate the games that those fans watch and that those players play in? To expect these folks to work tirelessly behind the scenes to put on two and perhaps three games a week to squeeze in half a season when there will still be no fans to witness it, when many of those games will be entirely meaningless and when, in all likelihood, all COVID protocols will still have to be enacted is not realistic in any way when their families will need to come first when lockdown restrictions are lifted. Some of the language used in an earlier post against the null and void option, eminently sensible imho when set against what is outlined above, is pretty much out of order and helps absolutely no one. Agreed. I am very sad that we are not able to complete the 2020/21 season or get anywhere near the half way point. Truly gutted. I think we need to accept the fact that this season has been prematurely terminated and keep the same format for 2021/22 with the 18 teams in the Premier Division. The First Division should be reformatted into three conferences with the addition of the new applicants. One promotion place for each of the conferences with five clubs relegated from the Premier Division. The other top clubs in the Conferences will play in the new First Division in 2022/23 so plenty to play for and to look forward to. I think the sensible option would be to start the 2021/22 season in early July and see if we can beat this dreadful pandemic this time around. An early start should ensure that if there is an enforced break at some time in the new season it will not destroy the whole campaign. It is hard to come to terms with termination of our season and its consequences but much harder to accept the loss of family, friends or associates to this dreadful pandemic. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malty Guy Posted March 18, 2021 Share Posted March 18, 2021 5 hours ago, oldandround said: Imho Its only teams not wanting to finish that are looking for an excuse to do just that. they can start training now. Six solid weeks or fitness will or should have the players in peak shape. Then a week of corners and shaping etc and bang. Let’s get started on 22nd may. every team is in the same boat with short start timesets go for it. Use the squads sign some ams or get the u20s involved. have a positive can do mentality rather than a lazy “too hard” viewpoint covid has been difficult for all let’s not compound it by giving up Lots of differing valid opinions. But im just for getting going and muddling through best we can. Again imho, voiding is cowardly and lazy. Kind of agree with you up to point of getting going and muddling through it again. No more muddles. Please just stop, reorganise and plan for the future. Move forwards and onwards. What’s the loss to any club by stopping?? Whats the benefits to operating in a muddle free environment. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldandround Posted March 18, 2021 Share Posted March 18, 2021 5 hours ago, Burnieman said: No club has said they don't want to finish the league from what I have seen. What does need to happen though it some consideration for players and officials., they arent pieces of meat to be ordered around when restrictions lift and devote 8 weeks of their lives to playing football which for many will be meaningless, and let's remember many won't be getting paid to play the game and have families. Club officials are volunteers. Covid has been difficult, very difficult for many and football may not be the first priority for some the moment lockdown is lifted. A bit of common sense wouldn't go amiss, rather than throwing accusations of cowardly/lazy around which is out of order, that language helps nobody. Yeah. You’re probably correct. im just so disappointed that we’re not playing football right now that I’m lashing out at everything that I’m perceiving must be holding its return. I just think the risk adverse have taken everything too far (just like my silly post) 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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