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Aberdeen Mcinnes what would you do thread.


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2 hours ago, Rodhull said:

It's a pretty shit state of affairs to judge whether winning a trophy is only relevant if you beat the old firm on the way. That's the kind of shit patter you would expect off a Bennett or Romeo not a supporter of one of the other sides

We beat both the arsecheeks enroute to the 1980 league cup final,we were the first top league opponent dundee united had faced.

They beat us in the final though and at the end of the day that was the only thing that mattered

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Didn't say that though, did I?
I said that Hughes and Stubbs' Scottish Cup wins were more impressive than McInnes winning a League Cup on the lottery of penalties, in part because Hughes and Stubbs (looked down on as managers by certain snobs in Scottish football) beat Old Firm sides en route to the trophy - something that McInnes hasn't done once and I can confidently state never will.


McInnes has beat Rangers at Ibrox and Celtic at Parkhead in the Scottish Cup.
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I'm a believer managers have shelf lives, 

The oaf out stayed his. And mcinnes has done likewise. 

After 8 yrs, players get bored same training drills, same voice, same team rhetoric, etc. 

They break off in to groups managers favourites. The ones who hate him etc. 

McInnes time has been up for at least 2 yrs, ideally he should have walked away after the late cup final defeat to Celtic he would have got a bigger job down south. 

But the dirge, boring, negative play  he is dishing up is soul destroying. 

Out of 70 players he has brought in only 20 can be regarded as a success. That's a poor hit rate. 

May, Forrester, Gleeson, Bryson, Maynard. All cost money or on big wages and we're abject failures, 

In his time at Aberdeen he has won one trophy on penalties, the same amount as Mcintyre, Hughes. Stubbs, Wright, all with similar or smaller budgets. 

He has been lucky that the league lacked, Rangers, Hearts, Hibs, Dundee Utd, were missing for a good chunk of those seasons, so his 3rd place finishes were not the big achievements  he would make out. 

In all 8 yrs is a good run and it probably suits both sides to call it quits, 

He has left the club in a better place and the whole club is now ready to welcome  some new thinking and ideas. 

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40 minutes ago, Willie adie said:

I'm a believer managers have shelf lives, 

The oaf out stayed his. And mcinnes has done likewise. 

After 8 yrs, players get bored same training drills, same voice, same team rhetoric, etc. 

They break off in to groups managers favourites. The ones who hate him etc. 

McInnes time has been up for at least 2 yrs, ideally he should have walked away after the late cup final defeat to Celtic he would have got a bigger job down south. 

But the dirge, boring, negative play  he is dishing up is soul destroying. 

Out of 70 players he has brought in only 20 can be regarded as a success. That's a poor hit rate. 

May, Forrester, Gleeson, Bryson, Maynard. All cost money or on big wages and we're abject failures, 

In his time at Aberdeen he has won one trophy on penalties, the same amount as Mcintyre, Hughes. Stubbs, Wright, all with similar or smaller budgets. 

He has been lucky that the league lacked, Rangers, Hearts, Hibs, Dundee Utd, were missing for a good chunk of those seasons, so his 3rd place finishes were not the big achievements  he would make out. 

In all 8 yrs is a good run and it probably suits both sides to call it quits, 

He has left the club in a better place and the whole club is now ready to welcome  some new thinking and ideas. 

Odd revisionism. Hibs , Hearts and Dundee United werent in the top league for chunks of time as they were shit. Not good enough.

Hearts and Hibs have never finished above a Mcinnes team to date, nor Dundee United.

We also finished above a big spending Sevco in 2nd in 1 of the seasons.

On the cup front yes we all would have hoped for more and some runs have been disappointing. But we've lost to an all conquering Celtic team in a number of finals/semi finals, as well as wins against Sevco at Ibrox and Hampden in 1 season in a cup and a win at Celtic Park in the Scottish Cup in his time. Hardly a disgrace. 

The likes of Hughes/Mcintyre/Stubbs/Wright nor any none old firm manager comes close to that. In fact to date the much lauded Gerrard has spent obscene money to win f**k all from 9 trophies in a row in Scotland. Now that is piss poor!

Whether his time is up now is up for debate. But revisionism around criticising/undermining all he has achieved is unnecessary and a bit petty.

Edited by afc_blockhead
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9 minutes ago, afc_blockhead said:

Whether his time is up now is up for debate. But revisionism around criticising/undermining all he has achieved is unnecessary and a bit petty.

You see this a lot and it's not worth engaging with. Every 'fact' about the manger totally skewed to whatever side of the fence they're on. See 'Mcinnes got lucky with Mckenna because we got pumped by Motherwell'. I think that one is my favourite from the 'Mcinnes never plays youth' brigade.

The fact is if he'd left in 2017 he'd be remembered as a terrific manager for us all things told, with a few 'if only's' and missed opportunities to remember him by. Since then it's been a lot more mediocre but you can still attribute him another 2nd place finish ahead of the ****, European qualification every season and another cup final. An objectively not bad job at all.

 

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1 hour ago, Willie adie said:

I'm a believer managers have shelf lives, 

The oaf out stayed his. And mcinnes has done likewise. 

After 8 yrs, players get bored same training drills, same voice, same team rhetoric, etc. 

They break off in to groups managers favourites. The ones who hate him etc. 

McInnes time has been up for at least 2 yrs, ideally he should have walked away after the late cup final defeat to Celtic he would have got a bigger job down south. 

But the dirge, boring, negative play  he is dishing up is soul destroying. 

Out of 70 players he has brought in only 20 can be regarded as a success. That's a poor hit rate. 

May, Forrester, Gleeson, Bryson, Maynard. All cost money or on big wages and we're abject failures, 

In his time at Aberdeen he has won one trophy on penalties, the same amount as Mcintyre, Hughes. Stubbs, Wright, all with similar or smaller budgets. 

He has been lucky that the league lacked, Rangers, Hearts, Hibs, Dundee Utd, were missing for a good chunk of those seasons, so his 3rd place finishes were not the big achievements  he would make out. 

In all 8 yrs is a good run and it probably suits both sides to call it quits, 

He has left the club in a better place and the whole club is now ready to welcome  some new thinking and ideas. 

There is so much drivel in there, that I’m only going to pick on one lazy, predictable, clichéd line.

If you take Saturday’s match, and it fits in with quite a few of our matches this season, Aberdeen created enough chances to score at least 5 goals. This doesn’t point to “dirge, boring, negative play”, but rather to the reality that we don’t have players who are clinical when an chance presents itself to them. The amount of chances that we have spurned this season beggars belief.

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17 minutes ago, kingjoey said:

There is so much drivel in there, that I’m only going to pick on one lazy, predictable, clichéd line.

If you take Saturday’s match, and it fits in with quite a few of our matches this season, Aberdeen created enough chances to score at least 5 goals. This doesn’t point to “dirge, boring, negative play”, but rather to the reality that we don’t have players who are clinical when an chance presents itself to them. The amount of chances that we have spurned this season beggars belief.

Yep.

You could post this on any of the post match threads on Hibs net when we have lost / drawn a match this season and would have hit the nail on the head.

Unfortunately, 90% of the responses would be of the heads gone variety.The problem with football fans is that it seems to be a binary choice between "we are fucking magic" and "we are fucking boring and shite".

There are only 3 big competitions each year, only two of which are (even vaguely) realistic for most clubs to win. The league - for most - is about survival and they will do everything they can to do that.

Edited by Green Day
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19 minutes ago, kingjoey said:

There is so much drivel in there, that I’m only going to pick on one lazy, predictable, clichéd line.

If you take Saturday’s match, and it fits in with quite a few of our matches this season, Aberdeen created enough chances to score at least 5 goals. This doesn’t point to “dirge, boring, negative play”, but rather to the reality that we don’t have players who are clinical when an chance presents itself to them. The amount of chances that we have spurned this season beggars belief.

You're absolutely right that the post you've quoted is drivel.

However, I'd say we don't actually create nearly enough good chances. We probably created more against County than we did against Dundee United, Motherwell, St Johnstone and Rangers combined in recent weeks. We have lots of good play back to middle but decision making and execution in the final third has been pretty woeful.

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Fair enough it's good to have a debate, 

18 pts from 102 against celtic and rangers, is a dire indictment, 

There was an opportunity when Celtic had Ronnie as manager, to really push them,  but mcinnes side didn't, 

Since that last minute cup final defeat he has hardly laid a glove on celtic, he comes out with statementd and soundbites, that the weegie press love and lap up he tells them exactly what they want to hear,  Aberdeen in 3rd place is where we should be, don't want to upset the applecart, 

The consensus now appears to be that mcinnes race is run, he has had 8 yrs, and one cup win, and no qualifying for group stages at European competition in that time is pretty scant return, 

At least 2 Cup finals when we didn't lay a glove on celtic, and showed no desire to. 

McInnes is nothing more than an average manager, who has achieved the bare minimum he's expected to. That suits the Glasgow press, and media agenda and he knows that they are happy to have one of thier own in charge. 

As for the " be careful what you wish for"  line and " lucky to have him"  utterances, I'm sick of hearing it, always issued by his fellow weegies and folk that have little or no link for club

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3 minutes ago, Willie adie said:

Fair enough it's good to have a debate, 

18 pts from 102 against celtic and rangers, is a dire indictment, 

There was an opportunity when Celtic had Ronnie as manager, to really push them,  but mcinnes side didn't, 

Since that last minute cup final defeat he has hardly laid a glove on celtic, he comes out with statementd and soundbites, that the weegie press love and lap up he tells them exactly what they want to hear,  Aberdeen in 3rd place is where we should be, don't want to upset the applecart, 

The consensus now appears to be that mcinnes race is run, he has had 8 yrs, and one cup win, and no qualifying for group stages at European competition in that time is pretty scant return, 

At least 2 Cup finals when we didn't lay a glove on celtic, and showed no desire to. 

McInnes is nothing more than an average manager, who has achieved the bare minimum he's expected to. That suits the Glasgow press, and media agenda and he knows that they are happy to have one of thier own in charge. 

As for the " be careful what you wish for"  line and " lucky to have him"  utterances, I'm sick of hearing it, always issued by his fellow weegies and folk that have little or no link for club

Is this just a direct copy/paste from AFC chat? It's the most cliched arguments out there.

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41 minutes ago, Dons_1988 said:

You're absolutely right that the post you've quoted is drivel.

However, I'd say we don't actually create nearly enough good chances. We probably created more against County than we did against Dundee United, Motherwell, St Johnstone and Rangers combined in recent weeks. We have lots of good play back to middle but decision making and execution in the final third has been pretty woeful.

There's no doubt at all that it's the final third that's killing us this season. 

Since McInnes arrived we've actually been fairly consistent in the amount of goals scored...usually around the high 50's over a season. This season we're well down on that ratio. 

Traditionally as well under Mcinnes, we don't draw a lot of games. This season we've already drawn 6 out of 22 matches, and that's more than the whole 2018/19 season. The reason for that is obvious, an inability to create and take chances. 

I would hate for Cosgrove and Main to be the hill that McInnes dies on, but it looks unlikely that we'll bring in any better striking options this January.

 

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6 minutes ago, Bob Mahelp said:

There's no doubt at all that it's the final third that's killing us this season. 

Since McInnes arrived we've actually been fairly consistent in the amount of goals scored...usually around the high 50's over a season. This season we're well down on that ratio. 

Traditionally as well under Mcinnes, we don't draw a lot of games. This season we've already drawn 6 out of 22 matches, and that's more than the whole 2018/19 season. The reason for that is obvious, an inability to create and take chances. 

I would hate for Cosgrove and Main to be the hill that McInnes dies on, but it looks unlikely that we'll bring in any better striking options this January.

 

The insistence on playing Main/Cosgrove together worries me. I don't think they've ever actually linked up or looked like a pairing. Smacks more of just hoping an extra body in the box will mean something might fall for us from a cross or set piece (I guess it did on Saturday but it was a Ross County player that finished it). 

Fact is Scottish defences are quite happy to deal with cross after cross into the box with two big men just waiting for it. 

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1 hour ago, Dons_1988 said:

You see this a lot and it's not worth engaging with. Every 'fact' about the manger totally skewed to whatever side of the fence they're on. See 'Mcinnes got lucky with Mckenna because we got pumped by Motherwell'. I think that one is my favourite from the 'Mcinnes never plays youth' brigade.

The fact is if he'd left in 2017 he'd be remembered as a terrific manager for us all things told, with a few 'if only's' and missed opportunities to remember him by. Since then it's been a lot more mediocre but you can still attribute him another 2nd place finish ahead of the ****, European qualification every season and another cup final. An objectively not bad job at all.

 

You could argue McKenna was a bit lucky because he was supposed to go out on loan.

What can't be denied is McKenna was never dropped after that game. Even after poor games where you expected McInnes to go back to a more experienced player. He didn't.

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7 minutes ago, Merkland Red said:

You could argue McKenna was a bit lucky because he was supposed to go out on loan.

What can't be denied is McKenna was never dropped after that game. Even after poor games where you expected McInnes to go back to a more experienced player. He didn't.

That's a small element of luck.

I'd argue chucking in a youngster to the defence a at a place you just got pumped is pretty ballsy, and as you say he stuck with him.

It's not really the main point anyway, it's just an example of several disingenuous arguments used against him (when there's plenty legitimate ones) that are always pushed by the rabid folk who are convinced he's a complete fraud of a human being.

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Fair enough it's good to have a debate, 
18 pts from 102 against celtic and rangers, is a dire indictment, 
There was an opportunity when Celtic had Ronnie as manager, to really push them,  but mcinnes side didn't, 
Since that last minute cup final defeat he has hardly laid a glove on celtic, he comes out with statementd and soundbites, that the weegie press love and lap up he tells them exactly what they want to hear,  Aberdeen in 3rd place is where we should be, don't want to upset the applecart, 
The consensus now appears to be that mcinnes race is run, he has had 8 yrs, and one cup win, and no qualifying for group stages at European competition in that time is pretty scant return, 
At least 2 Cup finals when we didn't lay a glove on celtic, and showed no desire to. 
McInnes is nothing more than an average manager, who has achieved the bare minimum he's expected to. That suits the Glasgow press, and media agenda and he knows that they are happy to have one of thier own in charge. 
As for the " be careful what you wish for"  line and " lucky to have him"  utterances, I'm sick of hearing it, always issued by his fellow weegies and folk that have little or no link for club
So much nonsense in one place.
18 points out of 102 against Celtic and Rangers isn't great, but they tend to turn up in games against us. I can't remember many games when Rangers or Celtic have been poor against us.

This myth that Deila's celtic were rubbish is nonsense. They won the league with 92&86 points. That's pretty consistent. I think Rodgers' Celtic even won the league with 82 one season.

We didn't lay a glove on Celtic in cup finals and since the 2016 final. We'll just ignore the win at Parkhead on the last day of the season to make sure we finished 2nd then. The two Cup final performances were disappointing but to say the players showed no desire is nonsense. We were below our best but there are a few things have conspired against us at Hampden in the last wee while.

Weegie press and weegies, grow up for f**k sake.

Keeping us in 3rd place and not upsetting the applecart, see above finishing 2nd in both Rangers first two seasons back. Unfortunately it appears that Rangers have now appointed a semi competent manager and are chucking cash at him hand over fist in order to stop a Celtic team that in case you haven't noticed, have won the last 9 titles. This crap Celtic team are still on course for around 82 points this season, they'll probably end up nearer 90 and neither Rangers or Celtic have lost to another team in the league this season.

Not qualifying for the group stages in Europe. I'd say not reaching the playoff round at all has been disappointing but you should really look at some of our potential opponents had we made the playoff round. We've faced English, Spanish and Dutch (we beat them) even before the playoff round. Have run into teams with vastly more resources than we have and have got knocked out at the stage we've been seeded to pretty much every year.

I understand the frustration with things at the moment but regurgitating shitty and false arguments is not an excuse to look for change. Maybe we are bobbing along at our expected level but this mythical next level of Europa League groups and winning a trophy every other season and challenging Rangers and Celtic, while something to aspire to, is fantasy.
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The sheep flock are happy to be the best of the rest until that is threatened from a Steve Clarke Killie side or a Jack Ross Hibs side.
The question should be would these two managers get a better tune from being the dons manager for me the answer is yes.
 

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17 minutes ago, wastecoatwilly said:

The question should be would these two managers get a better tune from being the dons manager for me the answer is yes

Completely Untestable Hypotheses thread for this please...........

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