Tier 4 - Restrictions.

[AlanCamelonfan]

3 hours ago, Ann Dan Otherthing said:

Does our (Scottish) tax not go into Westminster’s pot then?!?

Income tax goes to scottish government now. They set the tax that's why we pay 21% and not 20%like England 

[GordonS]

20 minutes ago, AlanCamelonfan said:

Scottish government are sitting on money and not giving it out. English government are trying to get things moving while scottish government sit on their hands and wait on Westminster making  a mistake

That's not true. Stop getting your news from Facebook.

19 minutes ago, AlanCamelonfan said:

Income tax goes to scottish government now. They set the tax that's why we pay 21% and not 20%like England 

No, it still gets collected by the UK government but the Scottish Parliament is allowed to set the rates. If we set them higher we get the extra, if we set them lower we have to pay the difference.

You're also wrong about the rate. It's 19% from the personal allowance to £14,585; 20% from that to £25,158; and 21% from that to £43,430, where the higher rates kick in.

Those earning under £27,243 pay less income tax than if they lived elsewhere in the UK, which is 56% of Scottish income tax payers. So most people in Scotland are paying less income tax than if they lived in England.

I'm sure you'll accept these facts and change your opinions accordingly...

[GordonS]

In fact, fk it... for those giving it the "Sturgeon's just being different for the sake of it" bullshit, here's a harsh dose of objective reality.

[Dev]

8 hours ago, Burnieman said:

So my initial impression is that we won't come out of any significant lockdown until end of April. Non contact kids sport will return but adult contact sport seems f**ked until at least then. Anyone else got anymore detail or a different take?

If it is nothing before end of April, season is done.

Seems that way.

Interesting that in the SP today NS admitted that it was a SG mistake to allow travel into Scotland last Summer when the rate of covid was lowest in the UK.  She made it clear that the rise in covid (pre the new variants) was down to travellers from outside/outside travel and nothing-else. The Govt in Wales DID do something about that for a while so Scotland could have too  but it's a bit late now. I wonder how many people could have been saved or avoided long-term covid effects?

Also no suggestion that scientific advice has been even listened to about the comparative safety of controlled outdoor activities in the summer and autumn. Interesting that although the level of covid is lower in Scotland than next door in England, where such activities are now coming back, Scotland has to be different yet youngsters, who may well easily unknowingly transmit covid, especially any new covid variants, are given a timetable for outdoor activities. Older people (17 and older should be safer shouldn't they? There's no science to the contrary).

Having said the above covid will be tough to bring down. It doesn't go down neatly on a steady downward path when you look at the figures and the SNP are looking at an election scheduled for May so they need to be conservative and not to mention what they've got wrong/admit too many mistakes e.g. slow roll out of vaccines (though that's come good now) or the belief that we would have been in a much better place if we'd been in the EU with extremely low supplies of vaccines compared to the rest of the UK?

[Dev]

4 hours ago, Ann Dan Otherthing said:

Does our (Scottish) tax not go into Westminster’s pot then?!?

Yes some does but it's nowhere near self sufficiency. UK Govt happy to see Scotland, Wales and NI raise own taxes from own people - thinking this will make devolution less popular to those who do pay tax.

Edited February 23, 2021 by Dev
.

[Dev]

27 minutes ago, GordonS said:

In fact, fk it... for those giving it the "Sturgeon's just being different for the sake of it" bullshit, here's a harsh dose of objective reality.

Utter nonsense because if you wished you could do a similar exercise and compare one part of Scotland with another and you'ld come up with a similar graph. You can find places in Scotland with higher or lower rates of covid because everywhere's circumstances isn't the same. The same applies everywhere.

[Arch Stanton]

5 hours ago, Auld Heid said:

Whilst Westminster is paying the bills and taking the chances. The Scottish Government are happy to sit on its erse and wait.

WTF is this pish?

So the income tax and NI that I, and every other pays every month just goes into the ether?

Idiot.

[GordonS]

57 minutes ago, Dev said:

Utter nonsense because if you wished you could do a similar exercise and compare one part of Scotland with another and you'ld come up with a similar graph. You can find places in Scotland with higher or lower rates of covid because everywhere's circumstances isn't the same. The same applies everywhere.

You're telling yourself stories because you don't like the implications of the numbers. But it's a cast-iron fact that England has had far more cases and far more deaths than Scotland, especially in the second peak.

What difference could it possibly make that some regions within those countries are higher and lower than the average??? If you can find some corner of a foreign field that is Covid-free, does that mean that entire country is better than all others? It's a bizarre take.

[AlanCamelonfan]

2 hours ago, GordonS said:

That's not true. Stop getting your news from Facebook.

No, it still gets collected by the UK government but the Scottish Parliament is allowed to set the rates. If we set them higher we get the extra, if we set them lower we have to pay the difference.

You're also wrong about the rate. It's 19% from the personal allowance to £14,585; 20% from that to £25,158; and 21% from that to £43,430, where the higher rates kick in.

Those earning under £27,243 pay less income tax than if they lived elsewhere in the UK, which is 56% of Scottish income tax payers. So most people in Scotland are paying less income tax than if they lived in England.

I'm sure you'll accept these facts and change your opinions accordingly...

I'm fully aware of the tax bands so keep your arrogance to your self. 

Scottish tax ie the difference it spent in scotland. Obviously the rest of the tax has to be spent on things like defence etc which the uk government are responsible for.

Dont insult me by suggesting things like you get your facts from Facebook. I will make up my mind about this government last time I checked, dispite the scottish government, it is a democracy. 

[AlanCamelonfan]

1 hour ago, GordonS said:

In fact, fk it... for those giving it the "Sturgeon's just being different for the sake of it" bullshit, here's a harsh dose of objective reality.

She is being different for the sake of it. She couldnt even stay on the 4 nations call because she had to her tv show that she doesnt need to do. She started the pandemic well but politicised everything. It's about her being in control. 

The people who defend her to the hilt like you are doing just make it worse for her. Time for snp to go. They wont but the problem is the rest of the parties in scotland are shite. Labour in scotland miles off it. Tories changing their leader again up here. If ruth had been staying theyd be ok. Willie rennie is.about as much use as nicola sturgeon at a tory conference. That is one of the main factors against independence is the politicians in the parliament are absolutely awful. 

I hate the snp but one of the few msps I do like is snp is my msp michael Matheson. Dont agree with his political belief but he doesnt seem to ram it down ur throat like most of them do.

[Burnieman]

9 hours ago, Dev said:

Seems that way.

Interesting that in the SP today NS admitted that it was a SG mistake to allow travel into Scotland last Summer when the rate of covid was lowest in the UK.  She made it clear that the rise in covid (pre the new variants) was down to travellers from outside/outside travel and nothing-else. The Govt in Wales DID do something about that for a while so Scotland could have too  but it's a bit late now. I wonder how many people could have been saved or avoided long-term covid effects?

Also no suggestion that scientific advice has been even listened to about the comparative safety of controlled outdoor activities in the summer and autumn. Interesting that although the level of covid is lower in Scotland than next door in England, where such activities are now coming back, Scotland has to be different yet youngsters, who may well easily unknowingly transmit covid, especially any new covid variants, are given a timetable for outdoor activities. Older people (17 and older should be safer shouldn't they? There's no science to the contrary).

Having said the above covid will be tough to bring down. It doesn't go down neatly on a steady downward path when you look at the figures and the SNP are looking at an election scheduled for May so they need to be conservative and not to mention what they've got wrong/admit too many mistakes e.g. slow roll out of vaccines (though that's come good now) or the belief that we would have been in a much better place if we'd been in the EU with extremely low supplies of vaccines compared to the rest of the UK?

I'm not really interested in your political agenda which is pretty clear.  I'm interested in when and if we'll be able to restart fitba this season.

[Burnieman]

8 hours ago, AlanCamelonfan said:

She is being different for the sake of it. She couldnt even stay on the 4 nations call because she had to her tv show that she doesnt need to do. She started the pandemic well but politicised everything. It's about her being in control. 

The people who defend her to the hilt like you are doing just make it worse for her. Time for snp to go. They wont but the problem is the rest of the parties in scotland are shite. Labour in scotland miles off it. Tories changing their leader again up here. If ruth had been staying theyd be ok. Willie rennie is.about as much use as nicola sturgeon at a tory conference. That is one of the main factors against independence is the politicians in the parliament are absolutely awful. 

I hate the snp but one of the few msps I do like is snp is my msp michael Matheson. Dont agree with his political belief but he doesnt seem to ram it down ur throat like most of them do.

Can we maybe stick to the fitba and chances of getting back rather than a political rant. Same for everyone, let's stick to the fitba rather than point fingers.

Edited February 24, 2021 by Burnieman

[Marten]

Whatever you think of the Scottish government, the figures around the peaks of the pandemic were considerably lower here than in England, so the SG will see that as a confirmation that the more cautious approach works. Saying they are just different for the sake of it is ridiculous as each government has to take their own decisions in this pandemic based on the situation. Wales and Northern Ireland were also different from England, and neither Mark Drakeford nor Arlene Foster are particularly keen on seeing the UK break up. Different people come to different conclusions, it's as simple as that.

In terms of football, it's understandable that part time football isn't a priority for the politicians. Education is clearly seen as a priority now. Then it will be about opening up the economy. Doing too much at once could be very damaging and could throw us back too far. A gradual approach is therefore necessary. All parties agree on that, the main disagreements are on the speed and priorities but not on the core principles of the approach. But whatever way you put it, part-time football doesn't exactly have a big effect on the economy and has relatively few people who care a lot about it. So anyone in power would not see it as a main priority, however much we might want them to.

It's up to the leagues and SFA to come with a plan for a return to football. The South of Scotland League confirmed on Twitter that they will have a meeting with the West, East and SFA on that very subject tomorrow. It's up to those parties to work out a collective approach and take plans to the authorities. Then we'll see at what stage of the planned road map a return to part-time football will be included.

[Spyro]

12 hours ago, GordonS said:

In fact, fk it... for those giving it the "Sturgeon's just being different for the sake of it" bullshit, here's a harsh dose of objective reality.

These aren’t actual COVID deaths, these are “deaths 28 days after a positive test”... another smokescreen to all this madness to fiddle the numbers to suit. Let’s see the miraculous drop in other deaths over the same period

[GordonS]

1 hour ago, Spyro said:

These aren’t actual COVID deaths, these are “deaths 28 days after a positive test”... another smokescreen to all this madness to fiddle the numbers to suit. Let’s see the miraculous drop in other deaths over the same period

Ok, go back and read what it actually says and try again.

[AlanCamelonfan]

2 hours ago, Marten said:

Whatever you think of the Scottish government, the figures around the peaks of the pandemic were considerably lower here than in England, so the SG will see that as a confirmation that the more cautious approach works. Saying they are just different for the sake of it is ridiculous as each government has to take their own decisions in this pandemic based on the situation. Wales and Northern Ireland were also different from England, and neither Mark Drakeford nor Arlene Foster are particularly keen on seeing the UK break up. Different people come to different conclusions, it's as simple as that.

In terms of football, it's understandable that part time football isn't a priority for the politicians. Education is clearly seen as a priority now. Then it will be about opening up the economy. Doing too much at once could be very damaging and could throw us back too far. A gradual approach is therefore necessary. All parties agree on that, the main disagreements are on the speed and priorities but not on the core principles of the approach. But whatever way you put it, part-time football doesn't exactly have a big effect on the economy and has relatively few people who care a lot about it. So anyone in power would not see it as a main priority, however much we might want them to.

It's up to the leagues and SFA to come with a plan for a return to football. The South of Scotland League confirmed on Twitter that they will have a meeting with the West, East and SFA on that very subject tomorrow. It's up to those parties to work out a collective approach and take plans to the authorities. Then we'll see at what stage of the planned road map a return to part-time football will be included.

England is different vast population in a small space. Glasgow is the same and has a ridiculous record. We are probably saved by the highlands and islands because its denser populated and theirs large areas with nothing.

[Marten]

49 minutes ago, AlanCamelonfan said:

England is different vast population in a small space. Glasgow is the same and has a ridiculous record. We are probably saved by the highlands and islands because its denser populated and theirs large areas with nothing.

Glasgow has a bad record, but so have several English cities, some worse than Glasgow. The population of the Highlands & Islands is so small that their influence on the overall Scottish average isn't very big. Actually, 83% of Scotland's population lives in urban areas, which is almost exactly the same as the UK-wide percentage.

Edited February 24, 2021 by Marten

[GordonS]

Everything Alan writes is wrong and he doesn't change his views whenever he's corrected, so I think it's a waste of time trying. The only value in it is making sure nobody else is tempted by his opinions.

Reality - apart from London, the average Scot lives in a place about as densely populated as the average English person. And a far smaller proportion of people in Scotland have had Covid than in Wales and Northern Ireland too, so I wonder how the people who don't like the implications of the numbers try to explain that one away.

Getting back to something more relevant to the thread, in much of the EoS area cases are bloody high. There's a feeling going around that things are getting better, but that's premature and we've been here before. In West Lothian they've been rising and are only just below their highest point in this whole thing so far. The seven-day rolling average doubled between 11 and 18 of February. Cases here are far higher than when we stopped playing.

I don't think anyone can hope to be making any sort of predictions about where we'll be three weeks from now, never mind in April. There's nothing to be gained from looking too far ahead, we just need to stay focussed on the here-and-now, though it is useful (and fun) to think about how we might restart once we can do so.

[Ann Dan Otherthing]

17 hours ago, AlanCamelonfan said:

Income tax goes to scottish government now. They set the tax that's why we pay 21% and not 20%like England 

So we Scots don’t pay Value Added Tax, Excise duty, et.?!?

[AlanCamelonfan]

1 hour ago, GordonS said:

Everything Alan writes is wrong and he doesn't change his views whenever he's corrected, so I think it's a waste of time trying. The only value in it is making sure nobody else is tempted by his opinions.

Reality - apart from London, the average Scot lives in a place about as densely populated as the average English person. And a far smaller proportion of people in Scotland have had Covid than in Wales and Northern Ireland too, so I wonder how the people who don't like the implications of the numbers try to explain that one away.

Getting back to something more relevant to the thread, in much of the EoS area cases are bloody high. There's a feeling going around that things are getting better, but that's premature and we've been here before. In West Lothian they've been rising and are only just below their highest point in this whole thing so far. The seven-day rolling average doubled between 11 and 18 of February. Cases here are far higher than when we stopped playing.

I don't think anyone can hope to be making any sort of predictions about where we'll be three weeks from now, never mind in April. There's nothing to be gained from looking too far ahead, we just need to stay focussed on the here-and-now, though it is useful (and fun) to think about how we might restart once we can do so.

I think you should change the first part to gordon.

Nonsense  to your 2and paragraph england is full of massive cities we have 3 real big cities Glasgow edinburgh and Aberdeen. England have london manchester Birmingham newcastle, liverpool all with great populations