Scottish Infrastructure

[RiG]

17 hours ago, Ginaro said:

Didn't realise just how little space there was now that the houses have been built, with Google Maps being out of date. That entire area of housing would be useful for the tunnel portal, though the Abbeyhill line is single track and even then the gradient might be too steep to get it underground.

And if you go to the north of that location on Google Maps all of the empty space (on the satellite image) has been filled in as well so it's a very constricted area for development now. Though perhaps they could squeeze a single line tunnel entrance / exit that splits into two tracks underground?

Edited January 14, 2021 by RiG

[jamamafegan]

Big fan of this project. These are all things that should exist anyway tbf.

Also suggesting putting a line to Westhill from Aberdeen and up to Fraserburgh, of which there is still some line that's been turned into a walkers route.

I was really surprised to learn that Peterhead is not served by a railway. Crazy. It would be great if there was a line going to Fraserburgh and along the coast towards Banff, Buckie and joining the existing line at Elgin.

[welshbairn]

I'm a bit surprised that the Greens are encouraging more long distance commuting.

[Detournement]

Given that the UK/Scotland is under constant extortion from the consultant class nothing like this is ever going to be possible unless it's all carried out in house in new state enterprises.

Try to build anything using the private sector (or even send food to hungry kids) and this guy and his mates turn up like a plague of locusts to bleed it dry. 

[Caledonian1]

7 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

I'm a bit surprised that the Greens are encouraging more long distance commuting.

It's a tricky balance between decarbonising existing long commuting and encouraging more people to move further away from cities to do exactly that.

With more working from home in the future (some  attending an office once or twice a week perhaps rather than five days a week) it is difficult to see an econimic case for tunneling projects such as this. 

[101]

2 hours ago, Caledonian1 said:

This story seems to have got lost over the past week or so ( Brexit, Covid-19, Storming of White House etc) but I find this a really exciting development

Scotland to have its first hydrogen-powered train running during COP26 - Energy Live News

Hydrogen powered trains could be a real game changer - not only reducing emissions from the transport network but creating a potentially huge market for hydrogen use.  Scotland could produce loads of green hydrogen in a few yars time primarily from offshore wind and this could be the impetus the industry needs.

 

This is excellent news and has to be the answer for putting renewable trains across the forth rail bridge who I presume wouldn't be allowed to fit overhear power lines to a UNESCO heritage site.

As for the tunnel under the forth, I think it's pointless unless it will be used by the East Coast main line from Aberdeen to London. I think the days are gone of huge demand on commuting trains but maybe a call will be better made once things are back to normal. Also the Fife to Leith hovercraft wasn't deemed sustainable neither was the direct bus route (although it did take forever). 

[Caledonian1]

53 minutes ago, MixuFruit said:

NAP things don't go to plan and it doesn't run in time and ends up being 300% over budget like those ferries.

Nah, I am being optimistic on this one.  Trains are perfect for hydrogen - nothing changes other than the tractor unit...same carriages, same tracks...no need for incredibly expensive network of overhead calbes to electrify.  I was given an Aberdeen City Council hydrogen car to drive for a week (this time last year) and it was great 

The electrolyser was at the fueling station (which happens to be right next door to the sub-station for Kincardine Offshore Wind Farm (in Altens) This could be replicated in many areas (on a grander scale) all over Scotland

Hydrogen can be deployed locally for many use cases - trains, cars, delivery lorries, scaffie lorries, heating homes (maybe as fuel mix with natural gas initially - 2o% mix has no impact on curent gas network, boilers and leads to 20% less emissions - current project through Keele Uni and forthcoming project at Levenmouth) . Distilleries are already looking at Hydrogen power so too are there projects looking at farms.  Hydrogen is the fuel of the future (along with electricity from wind) for lots of applications....maybe not airships?

[welshbairn]

5 minutes ago, Caledonian1 said:

Hydrogen is the fuel of the future (along with electricity from wind) for lots of applications....maybe not airships?

https://www.zeroavia.com/press-release-25-09-2020

[budmiester1]

On 25/09/2020 at 05:46, budmiester1 said:

 

I was watching something on Amazon Prime and it was on Reunion Island, they have the same problem with their coastal road in that there is a constant threat of landslides, so they have built the road over the ocean.https://www.vinci-construction-projets.com/en/realisations/new-coastal-road/

[Caledonian1]

1 minute ago, welshbairn said:

https://www.zeroavia.com/press-release-25-09-2020

The Orcadians were there before Cranfield  Hydrogen plane tests set for Orkney - The Orcadian Online

Anyway, I really was thinking more along these lines....maybe need to revisit the design before accepting passengers.

[welshbairn]

3 minutes ago, budmiester1 said:

I was watching something on Amazon Prime and it was on Reunion Island, they have the same problem with their coastal road in that there is a constant threat of landslides, so they have built the road over the ocean.https://www.vinci-construction-projets.com/en/realisations/new-coastal-road/

^^^Too embarrassed to mention watching Jeremy Clarkson in an eco centred thread.  

[budmiester1]

1 minute ago, welshbairn said:

^^^Too embarrassed to mention watching Jeremy Clarkson in an eco centred thread.  

Yeah pretty much  

[Ginaro]

1 hour ago, RiG said:

And if you go to the north of that location on Google Maps all of the empty space (on the satellite image) has been filled in as well so it's a very constricted area for development now. Though perhaps they could squeeze a single line tunnel entrance / exit that splits into two tracks underground?

Looking at old OS maps it seems the Abbeyhill line was double track, though it might not be wide enough for modern standards. You'd think once the line crosses the bridge at Abbeyhill it would need to start descending sharpish if it is to go underground before those houses.

There's also been suggestions of underground platforms at Waverley, as an extension of high speed rail from the south - given the lack of space already from the west and at Haymarket - so perhaps the entire Forth tunnel connection could be below ground.

[Sherrif John Bunnell]

I'd like to see more commuter rail on existing lines. In Inverness the Highland Main Line passes Balloch, Culloden, Smithton, Westhill, Cradlehall and the UHI and even one station on that side of town would take a huge amount of traffic off the roads. Aberdeen would surely benefit from more local stations as well.

[RiG]

12 minutes ago, Ginaro said:

Looking at old OS maps it seems the Abbeyhill line was double track, though it might not be wide enough for modern standards. You'd think once the line crosses the bridge at Abbeyhill it would need to start descending sharpish if it is to go underground before those houses.

It was to begin with but, from what I've read, the track was reduced to single track in the late 80s - https://www.railscot.co.uk/locations/A/Abbeyhill/ - some cracking old photos on that site.  

2 minutes ago, Sherrif John Bunnell said:

I'd like to see more commuter rail on existing lines. In Inverness the Highland Main Line passes Balloch, Culloden, Smithton, Westhill, Cradlehall and the UHI and even one station on that side of town would take a huge amount of traffic off the roads. Aberdeen would surely benefit from more local stations as well.

IIRC the planned development of the land around the back of the retail park, Cradlehall, Smithton etc which would come one the Inshes road is linked to the A96 also includes a provision to safeguard land around the railway to construct a station. Stations at Culloden and Balloch (perhaps even do up the old Culloden Moor station before the viaduct) would be a good idea though expensive and I think a lot of people in Inverness are welded to their cars regardless.

Edited January 14, 2021 by RiG

[Melanius Mullarkey]

On 13/01/2021 at 11:58, MixuFruit said:

Aye well there's one way to fix it...

Ocean Finance?

[Sherrif John Bunnell]

24 minutes ago, RiG said:

IIRC the planned development of the land around the back of the retail park, Cradlehall, Smithton etc which would come one the Inshes road is linked to the A96 also includes a provision to safeguard land around the railway to construct a station. Stations at Culloden and Balloch (perhaps even do up the old Culloden Moor station before the viaduct) would be a good idea though expensive and I think a lot of people in Inverness are welded to their cars regardless.

Very true. I know a few people who commute by car daily from Nairn to Inverness and none of them would ever consider using the train, despite it being a quick and fairly reliable service and the A96 being utterly miserable going through Nairn.

[Highland Capital]

3 hours ago, jamamafegan said:

I was really surprised to learn that Peterhead is not served by a railway. Crazy. It would be great if there was a line going to Fraserburgh and along the coast towards Banff, Buckie and joining the existing line at Elgin.

 

The old Elgin railway station is still there, just along from the current station and is a rather grand looking building.  It's a shame such a nice building is now a depot.  A line from Elgin to Lossiemouth, Buckie, Banff, MacDuff etc would surely make sense.  These towns are small...but they're not that small. 

1 hour ago, Sherrif John Bunnell said:

I'd like to see more commuter rail on existing lines. In Inverness the Highland Main Line passes Balloch, Culloden, Smithton, Westhill, Cradlehall and the UHI and even one station on that side of town would take a huge amount of traffic off the roads. Aberdeen would surely benefit from more local stations as well.

A railway station at Beachwood would be great and makes perfect sense.  Within a short/medium walk you'd have the university, two retail parks, a major hospital and on a heavily populated side of the town which is only getting bigger.  I know some say folk are welded to their cars but I don't know if that's true.  I seem to recollect reading that when the stations were rebuilt in Beauly and Muir of Ord traffic towards Inverness on weekdays dropped quite significantly.

It's a nonsense that the Highland Main Line isn't dualed especially when it was previously.  If you look at old pictures of the Culloden Viaduct you can see it was dualled at one time.  Perhaps that would be another station to look at reopening - Culloden Railway station was just before the viaduct and the amount of tourists who want to go to Culloden Battlefield and Clava Cairns is massive now.  I've no doubt it'd be well used.  Seemingly as well, many in Tomatin are wanting it's station reopened.  Again, you could imagine it'd be fairly well used and wouldn't be too difficult to revive - most of the station is pretty much intact and the platforms look in decent condition, it's just a bit overgrown.

[Sherrif John Bunnell]

A railway station at Beachwood would be great and makes perfect sense.  Within a short/medium walk you'd have the university, two retail parks, a major hospital and on a heavily populated side of the town which is only getting bigger.  I know some say folk are welded to their cars but I don't know if that's true.  I seem to recollect reading that when the stations were rebuilt in Beauly and Muir of Ord traffic towards Inverness on weekdays dropped quite significantly.
It's a nonsense that the Highland Main Line isn't dualed especially when it was previously.  If you look at old pictures of the Culloden Viaduct you can see it was dualled at one time.  Perhaps that would be another station to look at reopening - Culloden Railway station was just before the viaduct and the amount of tourists who want to go to Culloden Battlefield and Clava Cairns is massive now.  I've no doubt it'd be well used.  Seemingly as well, many in Tomatin are wanting it's station reopened.  Again, you could imagine it'd be fairly well used and wouldn't be too difficult to revive - most of the station is pretty much intact and the platforms look in decent condition, it's just a bit overgrown.

There always seems to new housing going up in the Sunnyside and Croy area, so a small station at the viaduct could also serve those areas. It's a fairly short trip to Dalcross from there, so you could have a shuttle bus to the new airport station for folk who don't need to go via the city centre.

[Cyclizine]

1 hour ago, Sherrif John Bunnell said:

I'd like to see more commuter rail on existing lines.

Aberdeen would surely benefit from more local stations as well.

The old station at Kittybrewster is mostly still there, part of the council depot now. SHMU radio has tho old Woodside station. You'd think stations in suburbs like Kittybrewster, Woodside, Bucksburn, Ferryhill, Torry, Cove Bay, Newtonhill would be relatively easy, the line is already there.

It would be great to see the line north to Fraserburgh being reinstated. Not sure how much of the old track bed is still there though.