ahemps Posted January 13, 2021 Author Share Posted January 13, 2021 6 minutes ago, DiegoDiego said: I can only really speak for Serie A, as I have close to zero knowledge of the English, German, French or Spanish leagues. Juventus have been impacted exactly the same as any of the top clubs in Serie A. The transfer market has been affected of course but that also hampers clubs like Atalanta from cashing in on some of the 50+ players they have away on loan in order to strengthen their first team. Some squads were more covid-proof than others but that's more down to factors like age and lengths of contracts than total squad value. In Serie A the six clubs in European places are the exact same six clubs which qualified for Europe last season, so I don't really see any evidence that they've been adversely troubled. Of course covid has influenced the season but I'm not sure its effect on clubs is as disproportionate as you claim. In Italy, the simple answer is that Pirlo is not as good a manager as Allegri or Sarri and Milan have finally got their team performing at a level relative to their spend. Inter are treading water. I really don't think covid's had much to do with it. Italy is different to Spain and France in the sense that Juventus are not as dominant as PSG or Real/Barca. The Italian league is much stronger and it was only a matter of time before AC and Inter, possibly even Roma, Lazio, Napoli etc. could reign Juventus in so I agree it is maybe just a more natural situation developing in Serie A than the others I mentioned. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnoustie Young Guvnor Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 4 minutes ago, ahemps said: Italy is different to Spain and France in the sense that Juventus are not as dominant as PSG or Real/Barca. The Italian league is much stronger and it was only a matter of time before AC and Inter, possibly even Roma, Lazio, Napoli etc. could reign Juventus in so I agree it is maybe just a more natural situation developing in Serie A than the others I mentioned. Juventus are going for ten titles in a row. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ahemps Posted January 13, 2021 Author Share Posted January 13, 2021 Just now, Carnoustie Young Guvnor said: Juventus are going for ten titles in a row. I know and I get what you are meaning but if I was to look at Italy, Germany, Spain or France I would still say Italy has more teams to have a sustained challenge on the dominant team (teams in Spain) than the rest. If Atleti win the league this year I would expect Barca and Real to win the next 5 between them. If Lyon won in France they will have a fire sale like Monaco did when they won it. If Dortmund or Leipzig win in Germany then I'd expect Haaland and Nagelsman to be ripped off them. If AC or Inter win in Italy they could hold that top spot for a few years, Juventus wouldn't be able to just flex their muscles and take it straight back like in the other leagues. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnoustie Young Guvnor Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 1 minute ago, ahemps said: I know and I get what you are meaning but if I was to look at Italy, Germany, Spain or France I would still say Italy has more teams to have a sustained challenge on the dominant team (teams in Spain) than the rest. If Atleti win the league this year I would expect Barca and Real to win the next 5 between them. If Lyon won in France they will have a fire sale like Monaco did when they won it. If Dortmund or Leipzig win in Germany then I'd expect Haaland and Nagelsman to be ripped off them. If AC or Inter win in Italy they could hold that top spot for a few years, Juventus wouldn't be able to just flex their muscles and take it straight back like in the other leagues. Yes they will. Just cause there are more big teams in Italy than other leagues it doesn't matter if the gap between Juve and rest financially remains as big. The Milan teams need to build a stadium too which will hinder their chances of competing in the next few years. Look at this, Juve's wage budget has crept up to 300 million Euros. Next highest in Italy is Inter on 145, less than half. Nobody will be able to touch them for a long time. I'd love to see Milan nick a title this year but realistically its not gonna happen and even if it did Juve would take it back next year. Inter's has actually decreased to 100, so Juve have triple the wage budget of anyone else in the league. Its not even close. https://www.sportekz.com/football/serie-a-clubs-wage-bills/ 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ahemps Posted January 13, 2021 Author Share Posted January 13, 2021 5 minutes ago, Carnoustie Young Guvnor said: Yes they will. Just cause there are more big teams in Italy than other leagues it doesn't matter if the gap between Juve and rest financially remains as big. The Milan teams need to build a stadium too which will hinder their chances of competing in the next few years. Look at this, Juve's wage budget has crept up to 300 million Euros. Next highest in Italy is Inter on 145, less than half. Nobody will be able to touch them for a long time. I'd love to see Milan nick a title this year but realistically its not gonna happen and even if it did Juve would take it back next year. Inter's has actually decreased to 100, so Juve have triple the wage budget of anyone else in the league. Its not even close. https://www.sportekz.com/football/serie-a-clubs-wage-bills/ That's interesting. If that gap can't be closed then you will be right. I follow Swiss Ramble on Twitter, he does excellent work on showing the finances in European football. While Juventus are the best performing club in most departments they have their challenges as well. They had the biggest operating losses in Italy by £234m (2nd was AC at £144m). They also had the highest wage to turnover ratio. I suppose I am coming from a historical viewpoint that I see their dominance as more fragile than PSG, Bayern, Real or Barca as I believe AC and Inter to be bigger than Dortmund, Atleti or Lyon. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TheJTS98 Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 (edited) Real and Barca have dropped points in 42% of their games so far this season. Last season it was 33%. Liverpool and Man City have dropped points in 47% of their games this season. Last season it was 24%. Bayern have dropped points in 33% of their games this season. Last season it was 23%. PSG have dropped points in 37% of their games this season. Last season it was 18% (stopped after 27 games). Juventus have dropped points in 44% of their games this season. Last season it was 32%. Obviously, form fluctuates and good and bad managers make an impact. But the pattern of the big teams coming back to the pack is so uniform across all the big leagues (and France) that it's hard to avoid the conclusion that it has something to do with the combination of the weird transfer market, the awkward fixture lists, the players missing games due to covid, the empty stadiums, the disrupted or curtailed pre-seasons etc. In all the leagues, previously dominant sides are simply winning fewer games. Manchester United are top of the league this season and are heading for about 80 points. Last season Liverpool won with 99. The season before City won with 98. The season before City won with 100. The season before Chelsea won with 93. United aren't even on track to match Leicester's 81 from 2016 in what was considered a bizarre season with no strong sides. 36 points from 17 games last season would have had United 3rd, 13 points off the top. The previous season 5th. The previous season 3rd, and again 13 off the top. If it was just one or two leagues, it could be dismissed. But it's across the board. It's like playing early season European ties. When two teams are unprepared, it's a leveller. And, yes, I really have nothing better to do. Edited January 13, 2021 by TheJTS98 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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