Playoff Semi Final , 18th October 2020

[GroundskeeperWillie]

Conflicting feelings on that.  Great that we're through but by god was that absolute drivel.  It's been mentioned here already but looking at the body language at the end of the 90 minutes/prep for extra time you do wonder if Steve Clarke has got the backing of the players.  Even at the prep for the penalties it didn't look as if they were at all focused on what he had to say.

Is it really asking too much to ask for at least a relatively cohesive performance based on the players we have.  Given that some of them have done well in PL/European competition, heck even at the top of the EPL, we looked like rank amateurs out there tonight.  I'm not buying the no crowds thing, because Israel looked hungrier for it tonight and tbh deserved to pap us out.  Whether Clarke is the man to take us forward or not I'm not sure I even care about any more, because we appointed him based on the fact he could take ordinary players and make them a decent outfit against stronger  teams (based on what he did at Killie) so the fact we're struggling against supposedly weaker opposition hints at something more deep-seated within our game as a whole.

The annoying thing is we've got some decent players who at club level are playing very well, but we just can't seem to mould that into a creative unit at international level.   Admittedly, I had the fear tonight when we went out with a system that inherently had no real width (game was crying out for Fraser and A N Other to play as wingers with O'Donnell and Robertson as full backs), but that was as chronic as we've been for some time.  Unless we find an answer soon-ish there's no chance we are going to Serbia expecting anything than getting oor arses handed to us.

[Diamonds are Forever]

4 minutes ago, Jim McLean's Ghost said:

Hmmm. I'm looking at the number of caps Gary Caldwell has and it isn't zero so you are talking pish.

 

Caldwell played about 100 games in the English Premiership, won the FA Cup, reached the last 16 of the Champions League twice with Celtic and won the Scottish Football Writers Players of the Year.

How does that compare with Declan Gallagher, Scott McKenna, Liam Cooper or Ryan Porteous?

[Scary Bear]

That was shite, penalty shoot-out excepted.

Still, as long as Clarke can get the result in the next game and get us to the Euros that’s all that matter.

[RossBFaeDundee]

1 minute ago, RandomGuy. said:

I get no joy out of watching an absolutely shite match than ends with a penalty shoot out win, tbh.

Should've turned it off then.

[Jim McLean's Ghost]

Just now, Diamonds are Forever said:

 

Caldwell played about 100 games in the English Premiership, won the FA Cup, reached the last 16 of the Champions League twice with Celtic and won the Scottish Football Writers Players of the Year.

How does that compare with Declan Gallagher, Scott McKenna, Liam Cooper or Ryan Porteous?

Gary Caldwell is pish mate. I don't care where he played and who he played with. Absolutely rotten player.

[Diamonds are Forever]

1 minute ago, Jim McLean's Ghost said:

Gary Caldwell is pish mate. I don't care where he played and who he played with. Absolutely rotten player.

 

I never said he wasn't.

I'm pointing out that, despite that, he was on a completely different level to the options we have now in that position.

Edited October 8, 2020 by Diamonds are Forever

[oneteaminglasgow]

1 minute ago, Jim McLean's Ghost said:

Gary Caldwell is pish mate. I don't care where he played and who he played with. Absolutely rotten player.

Stunningly, he’s a significantly worse manager. 

[Detournement]

Marshall

Gallagher Cooper Tierney

Palmer McGregor McTominay McGinn Robertson

Dykes Christie

[Gordopolis]

Conflicting feelings on that.  Great that we're through but by god was that absolute drivel.  It's been mentioned here already but looking at the body language at the end of the 90 minutes/prep for extra time you do wonder if Steve Clarke has got the backing of the players.  Even at the prep for the penalties it didn't look as if they were at all focused on what he had to say.
Is it really asking too much to ask for at least a relatively cohesive performance based on the players we have.  Given that some of them have done well in PL/European competition, heck even at the top of the EPL, we looked like rank amateurs out there tonight.  I'm not buying the no crowds thing, because Israel looked hungrier for it tonight and tbh deserved to pap us out.  Whether Clarke is the man to take us forward or not I'm not sure I even care about any more, because we appointed him based on the fact he could take ordinary players and make them a decent outfit against stronger  teams (based on what he did at Killie) so the fact we're struggling against supposedly weaker opposition hints at something more deep-seated within our game as a whole.
The annoying thing is we've got some decent players who at club level are playing very well, but we just can't seem to mould that into a creative unit at international level.   Admittedly, I had the fear tonight when we went out with a system that inherently had no real width (game was crying out for Fraser and A N Other to play as wingers with O'Donnell and Robertson as full backs), but that was as chronic as we've been for some time.  Unless we find an answer soon-ish there's no chance we are going to Serbia expecting anything than getting oor arses handed to us.

Agree with most of this. However Fraser was clearly unfit and not the zippy, tricky player who helped rip Albania apart a few years ago. I think Clarke knew this and it forced his hand somewhat with the formation.

[Zapp Brannigan]

2 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

I get no joy out of watching an absolutely shite match than ends with a penalty shoot out win, tbh.

I'm not one of those fannies who would "rather lose playing nice football than win with shite football", but neither am I someone who's going to watch a game that awful then pretend it was amazing because we won.

Don't think anyone on here is saying it's amazing either but we'll take it!

I was at Pittodrie when St Johnstone beat us 1-0 to qualify for Europe a few years back. Not a classic game that I can remember, but if you weren't in the away section buzzing to get into Europe and have that opportunity to experience then I feel sorry for you.

[itzdrk]

19 minutes ago, Jambomo said:

This difference with this Scotland team is that we are lucky. A few soft pens in previous games, playing badly but still getting results. 

Stuff of European Champions 

We are Ireland now. 

[Scary Bear]

2 minutes ago, Jim McLean's Ghost said:

Gary Caldwell is pish mate. I don't care where he played and who he played with. Absolutely rotten player.

Scored the winner against France. He wasn’t great but In Scotland terms he did well. McFadden is deified for his goal against France.

[Gordopolis]

Marshall
Gallagher Cooper Tierney
Palmer McGregor McTominay McGinn Robertson
Dykes Christie

Apart from continuity, what is the argument for continuing with 352? The 4231 isn't perfect but has allowed us to express ourselves and claim handsome victories along the way in the last 5- 6 years. Tonight was just desperate stuff.

[pandarilla]

Hanging on for dear life against Israel. Clarke can gtf as far as I'm concerned. Any semi-competent manager should be able to get some sort of tune out of that squad.

Whatever the outcome here us, Clarke  needs binned

Nerve well held by Mclean. I'd have completely rubbered the rest of the squad and went and got it right up the Israeli that passed on the walk talking shite. 
Get Clarke fucking emptied. 

What a hot take this is.

Let's go and try another manager even though this one actually got us through to a playoff final for the first time in umpteen years. f**k sake.

Do folk never learn? We've had loads of managers since we last qualified. What do people expect when they demand another change at the drop of a hat?



Terrible game, pretty dire performance, but f**k it... we won. It was a semi-final and the fancy football can wait.

[G51]

1 minute ago, Diamonds are Forever said:

 

I never said he wasn't.

I'm pointing out that, despite that, he was on a completely different level to the options we have now in that position.

Liam Cooper is a far better centre back than Gary Caldwell ever was. He was an absolute haddie.

Cooper is a good centre back in a good team. Caldwell was only ever a bad centre back in poor teams. Even Celtic fans hated him when he was in their league winning side.

No idea how he won that SFWA award either when Boyd scored 27 goals in the league that year.

[qos_75]

10 minutes ago, C4mmy31 said:

 

[RandomGuy.]

5 minutes ago, RossBFaeDundee said:

Should've turned it off then.

Me tonight.

Don't want to watch Scotland, can't help but watch Scotland.

1 minute ago, Zapp Brannigan said:

Don't think anyone on here is saying it's amazing either but we'll take it!

I was at Pittodrie when St Johnstone beat us 1-0 to qualify for Europe a few years back. Not a classic game that I can remember, but if you weren't in the away section buzzing to get into Europe and have that opportunity to experience then I feel sorry for you.

There's zero comparison. We'd played some good football that season and in the two previous European campaigns had beaten Rosenborg and Luzern, so there was (naive) hope of winning ties.

I've absolutely no belief this Scotland set up under Clarke does anything other than shitfest losses if they qualify for the Euros.

[Detournement]

1 minute ago, Gordopolis said:

3 minutes ago, Detournement said:

Marshall
Gallagher Cooper Tierney
Palmer McGregor McTominay McGinn Robertson
Dykes Christie

Apart from continuity, what is the argument for continuing with 352? The 4231 isn't perfect but has allowed us to express ourselves and claim handsome victories along the way in the last 5- 6 years. Tonight was just desperate stuff.

I agree but given we are on a decent run I don't think he'll change it. We've  got a better chance of keeping a clean sheet with 3-5-2 than we do of outscoring them with 4-2-3-1.

[sergie's no1 fan]

If we were to qualify, and that's a big IF, it gives our players the experience of playing in a tournament. Fills our FAs coffers which can be re-invested into the game.

We'd probably get 2 doings maybe 3, but we could learn from it and get a bit better each time. Build that onto the World Cup.

It's not an easy fix but qualifying would get that monkey off our back.

[GroundskeeperWillie]

2 minutes ago, Gordopolis said:

 

 

Agree with most of this. However Fraser was clearly unfit and not the zippy, tricky player who helped rip Albania apart a few years ago. I think Clarke knew this and it forced his hand somewhat with the formation.

 

Definitely, I suppose I was looking at the fact he played at least part of the game for Newcastle at the weekend.  Overall though, does absolutely show how far back we are progressing when there are absolutely no wide men we can call upon internationally ( I know Forrest is injured but...).  So it looks like now we are lacking in a proper right back, winger, creative midfielder, central defender.  Should start putting ads in the papers for positions wanted....