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Lowland League 2020/21 General Chat


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1 hour ago, Burnieman said:

Maybe Queens Park should never be relegated, afterall they started fitba up here....

Historical interlude: when QP finally entered the Scottish League in 1900, having played in the supplementary Glasgow League since 1895 btw, they went straight into the top level; and an extra condition was they'd be exempt from relegation (which was by vote back then). It lasted to the introduction of automatic promotion/relegation in 1922... and they went straight down!

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3 hours ago, Burnieman said:

Well, many of those associated with the LL are the ones who regularly point to "ventilation at the top" before there is more "ventilation below" so to speak.

It's a well worn excuse for not opening up more relegation spots, however they don't have control of the former, but they do the latter.

Why would the LL vote for more relegations?

The drums keep beating here for the ex super junior clubs. 

If they're that good then it's obvious they are a threat so LL will want them kept oot the league for as long as poss. 🤷‍♂️

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Historical interlude: when QP finally entered the Scottish League in 1900, having played in the supplementary Glasgow League since 1895 btw, they went straight into the top level; and an extra condition was they'd be exempt from relegation (which was by vote back then). It lasted to the introduction of automatic promotion/relegation in 1922... and they went straight down!
A travesty! Pity the LL wasn't around then....
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Why would the LL vote for more relegations?

The drums keep beating here for the ex super junior clubs. 

If they're that good then it's obvious they are a threat so LL will want them kept oot the league for as long as poss.

You're of course spot on Broony, turkeys, Xmas etc. Just keep it in mind when they bleat about the SPFL looking after their own.

 

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25 minutes ago, Burnieman said:

You're of course spot on Broony, turkeys, Xmas etc. Just keep it in mind when they bleat about the SPFL looking after their own.

 

I would think the Highland and Lowland Leagues are open to more relegation but they would like more movement from the 2nd Division who are as it stands over protected. 

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1 minute ago, Burnieman said:
44 minutes ago, Amandajoan said:
I would think the Highland and Lowland Leagues are open to more relegation but they would like more movement from the 2nd Division who are as it stands over protected. 

Well, HL don't relegate for a start......

And therein lies the problem that I've said from the start. 2 leagues at tier 5 yet only one league gets punished.The pyramid is massively lopsided. There is no real solution due to Scotland's geographical shape. 

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11 hours ago, Graeme said:

Aye that's right, always going to be a massive loss for those relegated losing out on the betfred cup money. Promotion of the big ex juniors at the expense of the bottom half of the lowland which has some clubs with barely any support would make the relegation more bearable though. Reality is most clubs getting relegated are likely to face revenue loss no matter what league they are in, but improving the standard and size of the fanbases in the league they are dropping into will soften the impact.

The size of another club's fanbase doesn't matter much as is doesn't translate into another club's coffers. It certainly doesn't make up for the loss of a home support that usually comes from relegation.

What made the Pyramid playoff just about bearable for those potentially relegated were the parachute payments giving them an advantage for a quick return. If the SPL and SFL had got together sooner there probably wouldn't have been a pyramid, as the SPFL financial distribution model meant relegation out of the national leagues was an even tougher drop than from the pauper SFL.

 

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For a few more seasons we are still going to have a clique of former pre-2013 EoS premier clubs and assorted boys clubs that got in early viewing the LL as their fiefdom (even after they get relegated in Whitehill Welfare's case apparently) . They still have the numbers needed to prevent more ventilation at the bottom at this point and there has been every indication that they will do so as long as they can.

Give it a few more years of pro-rel though and the reality that the pyramid belongs equally to all the clubs involved in it (yes, even Whitburn when they finally join next season) will start to prevail. A solid majority of south pyramid clubs will be ex-SJFA, so they will have the ability to retrofit the pyramid more in line with their way of doing things only minus Tom Johnston and with floodlights and fixture lists this time, if that turns out to be what they want to do.

I strongly suspect/hope that having both the EoS and WoS winners automatically promoted every season (if they can deal with the SoS champion in a two from three playoff format, probably with two more places potentially up for grabs after that for the second placed EoS and WoS teams, SoS champion and fourth bottom LL team) and merging the SCC and SJC to keep the tradition of having a national nonleague cup going will be high on the agenda in the years ahead.

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And therein lies the problem that I've said from the start. 2 leagues at tier 5 yet only one league gets punished.The pyramid is massively lopsided. There is no real solution due to Scotland's geographical shape. 
Relegation isn't "punishment" to a league, it's a healthy turnover of clubs within the Pyramid which makes tier 5 stronger. The HL, North Juniors and NCL look to be taking long overdue steps with that as well, Banks O'Dee should be a HL club.
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15 hours ago, Burnieman said:
15 hours ago, amigan said:
Great result for Gala today shows they have a decent side this year.   Maybe benefitting from the demise of Selkirk in terms of attracting players from the region.
Also, why should clubs like VoL and Edinburgh uni who signed up at the start voluntarily make way for the ex juniors.  It will all right itself in the end.
Football is cyclical so wouldn't be surprised if teams like Whitehill did return to LL at some point.

Maybe Queens Park should never be relegated, afterall they started fitba up here....

Your point makes no sense i am not saying they shouldn't be relegated.

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38 minutes ago, amigan said:

Your point makes no sense i am not saying they shouldn't be relegated.

You're not saying they should either, you're saying, and I quote "why should clubs like VoL and Edinburgh uni who signed up at the start voluntarily make way for the ex juniors."  Sounds like you'd like to keep those pesky ex-Juniors away from stealing your cake for as long as possible.

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1 hour ago, Burnieman said:
12 hours ago, newcastle broon said:
And therein lies the problem that I've said from the start. 2 leagues at tier 5 yet only one league gets punished.The pyramid is massively lopsided. There is no real solution due to Scotland's geographical shape. 

Relegation isn't "punishment" to a league, it's a healthy turnover of clubs within the Pyramid which makes tier 5 stronger. The HL, North Juniors and NCL look to be taking long overdue steps with that as well, Banks O'Dee should be a HL club.

Aye ok 🙄

Until that happens though it's still lopsided. 

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2 hours ago, Burnieman said:

You're not saying they should either, you're saying, and I quote "why should clubs like VoL and Edinburgh uni who signed up at the start voluntarily make way for the ex juniors."  Sounds like you'd like to keep those pesky ex-Juniors away from stealing your cake for as long as possible.

Pesky juniors haha.  A club like VoL or Edinburgh Uni would be making as much money in the EoS Premier league as they would have in the lowland league before the juniors came in, if not more.  That doesn't mean they should be demeaned for not doing particularly well in a league they have every right to be playing in.  If the lowland league was so lucrative they would be able to attract better players than the ex juniors.

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20 hours ago, newcastle broon said:

Why would the LL vote for more relegations?

The drums keep beating here for the ex super junior clubs. 

If they're that good then it's obvious they are a threat so LL will want them kept oot the league for as long as poss. 🤷‍♂️

In that case there can be no complaints from LL clubs about the SPFL remaining a relatively closed shop.

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20 hours ago, Burnieman said:
21 hours ago, Amandajoan said:
I would think the Highland and Lowland Leagues are open to more relegation but they would like more movement from the 2nd Division who are as it stands over protected. 

Well, HL don't relegate for a start......

Was only after I posted that it occurred to me they don't 😀

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5 hours ago, amigan said:

Pesky juniors haha.  A club like VoL or Edinburgh Uni would be making as much money in the EoS Premier league as they would have in the lowland league before the juniors came in, if not more.  That doesn't mean they should be demeaned for not doing particularly well in a league they have every right to be playing in.  If the lowland league was so lucrative they would be able to attract better players than the ex juniors.

Who mentioned money? this is about relegating more clubs at the bottom of the league, and promoting better clubs from the level below.  If VoL and Edin Uni are good enough to avoid all that, then they'll remain in the LL. If not, they go down.

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As I was saying. Jeanfield, Haddington and Tranent eliminate LL opposition, Blackburn lose on penalties, and Colts and Berwick with narrow wins.

No disrespect to Civil Service today who are a decent solid side, but we've played several much better teams in the EoS Premier this season.

Let's open up the LL more and get the Pyramid moving.
Great result from Tranent Juniors today beating one of the LL title favourites, whilst Jeanfield Swifts push Kelty all the way at Central Park.

Of the 4 LL clubs left involved in the Scottish Cup, 3 are ex-Junior......
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